[In this for ME]

Although I am new to all this (8 months since BD and divorced within 2 months) I've been trying to give myself a crash course in the effects of different mistakes made in the past. I don't want to do that again within this relationship and or future ones; if that ever happens.

I have read some books and kept a close eye on this site. I am however finding opposing reserch and or opinions between some of the books I've read. Which I expect but gives me pause to wonder.

I read  "Secrets Every Woman Should Know About Men" by Beverly DeAngelis PHD cover to cover more than once. And yesterday I bought "Sexual Intimacy" by Andrew M Greeley It is quite wordy (essays)and refers to theology a lot but I thumbed through and hit upon his take on mothering men.
He says men love it period. The more adoration and caretaking the better.

DeAngelis book claims research among men to acertain what their general view is. She says although the caring suppotive nurturing part is important..her overall view is men don't want to make love to thier mothers. And we kill our own passion by turning them into our sons.

Now I don't know about you ladies but I find this a thin line to walk. After having kids it just ended up flowing into the relationship. I got a great deal of satisfaction taking care of him BUT looking back on it now I find some of the things I did excessive like:

Making him breakfast then running all over an 8 acre estate to bring it to him; laying his clothes out for work so he could sleep an extra 15 minutes; cleaning off his car after a snowstorm and starting it before he went to work and on and on.

During this crisis I found it's been the hardest thing to let go of emotionally because I saw how his decisions etc were far from sound. And still from time to time concern myself about his saftey etc. It was worse a while ago and has gotten better but I was wondering if any of you could see the same patterns in your own relationships before you ended up here.

And men how do you feel about maybe being the one who was more of a caretaker or do you feel your MLC'er may have gotten overwhemled by caretaking you?

[limitless]

My H took care of us - regarding cooking dinner, picking up the kids, getting us all up in the morning to start our days.  And, apparently, he resented it.  I didn't know that, until BD.

On the other hand, with regards to finances - I took care of everything.  I made more $$ than he.  When he would get into trouble with money and such - I would fix it for him.  And, I resented it - something HE knew and I knew for most of our marriage.

My resenting him and being open about it - lead me to treat him with disdain and, quite honestly, take advantage of the caregiving that he did.  I truly believed that he OWED it to me - for spending lots of money behind my back and lying about it.

That doesn't sound like a healthy relationship, does it?

I don't think men need their wives to be their mothers.  I don't think they want that.  And, yet, my H put me in the  mother role and now resents that I acted like I was his mother.

Lessons learned.  I am DONE being a mother (except to my 3 kids).

L

[In this for ME]

Good job!!

[OldPilot]

I think the thing that might be important here is to realize that during MLC or midlife in general all people male and female become the opposite of what they were for the rest of their lives.
I think that this relates back to the life cycle of hormones.
Early in all peoples lives there are no hormones.
As teenagers we get them, women more estrogen men more testosterone.
At the end of life we revert back to close to being the way we were at the beginning of life with no hormones.
Their are major fluctuations for women and small ones for men.

The point of all this becomes pursuit and distance of different sexual and emotional traits.
Men are sexual pursurers and emotional distancers.
Women are the opposite.

The point is no matter what we are is that we must stop our pursuit during MLC.
This is one of the major changes that we must learn and make.

ITFLH I think you were speaking to your husband through Acts of Service.
Probably not his Love Language.
More than like he is touch or Words of Affirmation.
Your Love language is Acts of Service.

If he were to do AOS for you then you would feel loved by him.

I don't know if this is all making any sense right now but I will review what I wrote tomorrow and see if I can revise it.

Have to go eat breakfast. 

[hyperglad]

Laurascan my R with my H was the same as yours only my H never spent lots, just had no ambition or drive to earn or achieve more.

 Given that these people cheat whatever may just be excuses they use to condone their unacceptable behaviour.

[In this for ME]

Thanks for that  OP

I think you're right about that. I am trying more affirmations. Letting him know I have faith in him. These are only in response to emails he sends. I do not talk about a future right now with him in regards to a relationship.

 I have asked him to tell me he doesn't love me anymore so I can continue to move further away. He will not do that. He said because it is not true.

I guess I'm still not sure what his love language is. I know I've gotten closer to him emotionally; I mean as in feelings from him to me as he's said he is afraid. It's the intimacy thing the "baring of his soul" our souls to each other. terrifies him.

I was afraid for quite a while also but have gotten much stronger. And I tend not to worry too much about if what I say makes him feel uncomfortable. If it is my truth about how I feel; I speak it.

[readytofixmyselffirst]

My marriage has shifted over time. She used to do things for me and I did things for her. She used to iron my shirts and lay out my clothes. I went to work and came home to dinner and time with the kids.

Now, I do everything from making dinner to doing the clothes to paying the bills. She is not responsible for anything other than taking care of herself. She does do some things like takes the youngest to school on some mornings and she will fold some clothes. Other than that, nada. Of course, depression wipes you out and despite all things not being equal, I understand that this is something she has to go through on her own.

Now, lets drop the MLC issues and speak about normal relationships. I really believe that we have men and women in relationships and we have daddy's, mothers, adults, little boys and little girls. While we play all roles in the life. I can be the little boy wanting mothering attention and there are times that I am the father, and times that I am the adult. We go through the roles and shift throughout them.

Things tend to go haywire when I see that one role becomes dominate over other roles. Then the person having the interaction has great difficulty in dealing with the other. When one is forced onto being the father role constantly or little girl role or always being the adult, it builds resentment. This leads to the breakdown in relationships and disrupts true communication between people.

I think that everything is about achieving balance between all the roles we play. I think that to develop meaningful and powerful relationships, we have to  state our expectations to our PARTNER and listen carefully to their expectations. We also have to accept our expectations change over time and we need to revisit these expectations from time to time so that relationship evolves over time.

Of course, this all deals with healthy people and MLC is about crisis and depression. There are no true rules and there can be no rationalization with them because their feelings and thoughts are random and often they do not even have an idea of what they want. That is why it is best not to engage them in relationship talks or try to feel them out because they really don't know what they want.

As a man, I do want to see things from my wife. I want acts of service and I want the affirmation that I am her man. I want someone who respects me as a person and admires my good qualities. I do want someone who can also be tender and comfort me when I am down so that I don't always have to be strong. I also know that I do have to be strong at times and that I need to be kind and tender as well. It is give and take, with mutual respect and honesty as the core values. There needs to be commitment not only to the vows of the marriage but to each other.

When it comes to dealing with the MLCer, you need to follow your intuition. Don't do things out of fear or frustration. Pursuing is not the same as being nice. Pursuing seeks affirmation, reassurance to ease the fear of the LBSer that wants to know everything is going to be all right. Being yourself gives the MLCer a glimpse of the true you. To realize that you are still succeeding and thriving in a world that they do not understand.

Of course, this is all the world according to Ready and his w is deep in MLC and has not made any movement towards him in a long time. 

[In this for ME]

I guess you're right too Ready-

We all have those facets..little girls little boys adults etc.

I guess it all comes down to a fear of those things or those facets where we thing we can't or shouldn't be weak or feel small or whatever we feel might be a flaw somehow.

But it is componded in the MLCer. And it would feel safer for them to run and try to start over somewhere else. Especially if they didn't think the LBSer was capable of providing those comforts. At least that's my case.

I honestly think my ExH thought I wasn't capable but I think he's finding out differntly. And he knows he is also but it scares him to death to extend that trust.