Author Topic: My Story Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think  (Read 3750 times)

Online EnyoTopic starter

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My Story Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« on: February 12, 2017, 08:06:01 AM »
I have been married for nearly 35 years, H is 56, I am 58.  Two sons, S25 and S24, both back living at home after finishing university.  Just really coming to the conclusion that H has been in a MLT and now MLC for about 4 years but I did not recognise it as this.

4 years ago I had 3 quite serious illnesses in quick succession, this was probably the catalyst to the beginning of the MLT (more why I think this in a later post).  I had my Ovaries out (tumour turned out to be non-malignant but surgery resulted surgical menopause), a year later injury to back which resulted in 3 months unable to move in / bedbound before eventual surgery.  6 weeks after this surgery I suffered a Brain Haemorrhage, which mercifully I recovered from.  Through the last two illnesses my parents cared for me as my husband worked mostly away from home and this allowed him to continue to work.  Our sons were away at university.  H didn’t handle my illnesses well, and began to withdraw.

The next year I tried in vain to regain my former fitness, I was a bit of a runner and attended bootcamps and running event, but with inactivity due to pain and medication I put on around 45lbs and after a year it became obvious that I was fighting a losing battle and succumbed to depression.  The next year I was really quite depressed, H also in low spirits as was missing exercise with me and wasn’t enjoying job, younger boss etc and saw no way of getting another meaningful job ‘at his age’.  We were / are both employed with good salaries.

In the October of that year (2014) H offered a new job with 6 figure salary, didn’t apply for role was head hunted by the company.  The job involved working away during the week but we were used to this.   Nov and Dec 14 H on ‘Gardening Leave’ from old job because of conflict of interests and spent 8 weeks in the gym and cycling basically becoming the fittest he has ever been, he said that he needed to be fit for the new job.  Job started Jan 2015.  By July 2015 he was working longer and longer hours.  Leaving the house in the very early hours of Monday (sometimes even Sunday night) and not returning until midnight Thursday or late Friday afternoon, he continually spent his 'downtime' answering e-mails, I remember being on holiday in Italy and eating a few meals alone whilst H walked round whichever town square we happened to be in talking on the phone, he is a very important person don't you know :-\ .  He also stepped up his exercise programme in an attempt to maintain his fitness level from gardening leave.  He started exercise with my ex training partner, a friend (now ex friend!) who is 17 years my junior, she is also married but her H who is 17 years older encouraged her exercising with my H, he had no interest in exercise and felt she was 'safe' with my H, it also gave him an excuse to work whilst she was out. 

Typical weekend arrive home from work on Friday evening H already be at gym doing a shared (with training partner) personal training session, followed by coffee, because he needed to catch up with her!  Saturday morning he attend her boot camp (she had become a personal trainer), Saturday afternoon they went on a cross country run to train for Tough Mudder type events, Sunday morning 50 mile cycle, she was training for a long distance event and H was helping her train, Sunday afternoon marathon training, they had signed up for Rome marathon April 2016.  He would then pack and either leave that evening or had early night and leave around 4am the next morning.  I tried on numerous occasions to talk to H about his work/life/exercise balance (that is all I thought this was!!!) but he refused saying do we have to do this now.  He also started saying to whoever would listen that he was never going to get old and was never going to retire, I think he actually believed this.  In Dec 15 I suggested that when he was running in Rome that we make a holiday of it by going out the week before, he replied that I wouldn’t be going, just H and training partner going out for the weekend together.  I blow up at this point and I asked (probably insisted actually) that H stop training with this partner immediately, which in fairness he did, but has never forgiven me and resents that I did this, apparently I over reacted.  Training partner / ex friend had by this time withdrawn from our friendship over the proceeding 6 months stating work pressure.  I don’t think that they were having and PA and H denies EA, which could well be true as I think what was really going on was that H was infatuated with her and projected fantasies onto the relationship, though they obviously had some sort of connection so I may be wrong about EA.  As a consequence of stopping training with training partner was that we lost a whole 'friendship' group and this was also my fault (again I will write more about this later)   

From Aug 15 to Dec 15 H’s attitude toward me become very negative and critical, he criticised the way I spoke, he corrected my grammar whilst I was talking, criticised what I ate, even when out in company example ‘eating that isn’t going to help you lose weight’, criticised the way I dressed – dressed like a slob around the house (ouch – if he had dressed in a smoking jacket and cravat around the house  I would have said that he had a point  ;)), he said I was socially inadequate and often looked bored when out in company, that I suffered from mood swings and that I was controlling eg stopping him training with training partner - well I basically just got on his nerves, he also said that I was getting old before my time. 
Meanwhile he had completely reinvented himself in his new job, at work he is known by his full name and not just the shortened version that everyone had known him by and I have never been introduced to any of his new colleagues.  I don’t even think that he has told anyone at work that we are now separated as he is still wearing his wedding ring.  He started dressing in trendy casual clothes, purchases from designer shops at airports, he began to worry about winkles and bags under his eyes and buying expensive serum creams (also purchases from airport shops), when I found out I did look at him and asked when was going to start using them, not nice I know but I was angry  ::), he also tried using false tan, (why don’t men read instructions - he spent a week with orange hands after this one), he couldn’t do anything about his hair as he has shaved his head for 25 years.  It was also around this time that he started saying that he didn’t know what he wanted and that he needed to leave because he needed space.

I tried from January to the end of August to get him to stay and talk we even tried counselling at the beginning of the year, he left on 21st Aug 16 (is this BD #1?) and moved into a flat we own locally.  I had spent from Feb to Aug renovating this flat so we could sell it so it was all nice a new for him  >:(.  In the middle of October he came to see me and said he had never been happier than he was living alone in the flat and that he had come to the conclusion that what was wrong in his life was ME and that he couldn’t cope with the emotional pressure he felt from me and was telling me he was never coming home (BD #2?), he loved me, I was a great wife and mother and a wonderful homemaker but he didn’t think that this was enough. (I am / was actually an awesome wife and mother ;D).  He said we had grown apart and that we didn’t want the same things anymore (though he said he didn’t actually know what he wanted!).  He also said that he thought he had married too young!  Our sons went to talk to him, he told them that they didn’t know the whole story, which he couldn't tell them or see the way I had changed as I hide it from everyone but him! He also said he couldn’t remember being happier than he had been in the 8 weeks since he had left, as you can imagine this upset them greatly.  He has accused me of turning our sons against him saing that he felt excluded even before he had left he also thinks that at their ages they should now have moved out of the family home and when they do they will see things more clearly and would not take sides. 
Since leaving home he has been working up to 100 hours over 6 days each week (from August to December) travelling all around Europe, keeping busy so he has no time to reflect on situation.

He came to see me again in December, said he wasn’t sleeping, drinking too much (he has been self medicating on at least one bottle of wine a night for the last 3 years), smoking too much (he started smoking again a year ago after not smoking for nearly 20 years), and messing up at work and the reason for this was the emotional pressure that I was putting him under he then reiterated that he was never going to come home.  At this meeting he informed me that he was going to spend Christmas with his family, and in tears told me it had been over 20 years since he had spent Christmas with his parents, said it in such a way that made it obvious that this was my fault and he didn’t know how many more Christmas’s they would be around.  MIL 80, quite frail FIL 91 suffers from dementia.  H’s relationship with parents has always been a ‘duty’ one, H reports not having a loving childhood, wasn’t allowed to show emotion MIL withheld affection as a punishment, FIL worked away, never home.  I’ll write more about family dynamics in another post.

MIL collapsed on Boxing day, was seriously ill and spent next 3 weeks in hospital, H, along with brothers (x2), shared the care of FIL between working.  H not allowing me to contact him or his family and only sending basic text messages updating me on MIL condition.  H had no real contact sons either, he sends all three of us the same basic group text once a week eg ‘mum responding to treatment’.

As I was very conscious that he would be under a lot of stress, marriage ‘breakdown’, working long hours, mother very ill, caring for a father with dementia, I had continued to send texts every 4 to 5 days, which did not need a reply, just reminding him that I was here if he felt he needed support or just an ear.  All ignored.
Last weekend, after not seeing him for 6 weeks or talking for 4 weeks, I received an e-mail saying that he thought that I had a right to know that he had put our flat up for sale and was moving further south to shorten his weekend commute, I later found out that he had put flat on the market 3 weeks earlier.  He visited home town to do this but hadn’t contacted me or sons whilst here.

I met with him to talk finance, flat a joint asset.  Before we did this he looked at me, and his expression is not one that I have ever seen before, pretty ugly actually, and said that I should get it into my head that he was not coming home and that sending text showing concern was a form of manipulation and a trick to try to get him to come home.  His family also think that I am dragging the separation out – God knows what he has been telling them!, I am not sure what they expect from me after 35 years marriage, that I just say OK and walk away?

On the face of it he is being very generous.  Says he will have the flat, we don’t actually have very much equity in it, and I can have the family home (which we more or less own) plus everything in it as money is no longer important to him!!!  Not sure if this will come to fruition, but for the moment he is paying all bills and giving me my share of our joint income.
Says needs to leave home town as has no friends here (this apparently is my fault, I will write more about this in another post).  As a result of his work / life balance he doesn’t actually have any close friends, so has had no one to turn to.
H not sure where in the country he will rent a flat but wants to go somewhere to ‘develop a new social life’, reinvent himself.
Also says is planning to give up work in 12 to 18 months (says I am right, there is more to life then work!), and then would like to work for a charity on humanitarian projects in the 3rd world, all very worthy but I don’t think he has thought it through, also talking about drawing down his pensions not sure why yet.

I think after reading info on site that I am dealing with a wallower, I understand from sons that this weekend, the first since BD1 that he has given himself a 2 day weekend, all he has done is go on a bike ride and sat and binged watched Game of Thrones and no doubt self medicating on wine, not exactly the high life is it? I have questions about contact / no contact obviously showing concern is out, even though I am very concerned.  I do love him very much and at the moment feel really sorry for him.  Feeling pretty blessed that there is not yet OW but I am just waiting for that axe to fall.  Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

(Edited for carriage returns.)
« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 11:11:08 AM by LearningIamOk »
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2017, 11:44:33 AM »
Welcome Enyo! I am glad that you have found us, but sorry you need to be here. Your H and my xH sound very much alike. My xH went over the edge at 55, almost 56. We had just celebrated our 30th anniversary.

He found his OW at the gym. She is a spin instructor. She is 9 years younger than me and 13 years younger than xH. My kids, 4 of them, were all over 21 at the time. Her 4 were 10-17. My xH also felt that ours should be out on their own. Bizarre that he would take on someone with 4 kids younger than ours. When I said that to him he screamed, "I'm not taking anyone on!"

You have been thru quite a lot physically. My xH also had little to no sympathy when my arthritis was flairing up. His comforting response was to hand me a box of tissues because I was in tears from the pain. I asked him point blank if he would leave me if the pain continued. I got no response.

Be very cautious about the money, house and flat. Mine said similar things to me. xH bought a condo very quickly, about 4 months after leaving. He told me that if we divorced, I could have the house and he would keep the condo. He was also paying all the bills. xH makes 8X my salary. When it came time to really divide things, he fought me about the amount of alimony and he wanted me to buy him out of the house. I couldn't qualify for a mortgage so I told him I would see him in court first. I am not trying to scare you, only alert you that his feelings about all of this could change.

I would get a financial agreement in place pronto. Consider it saving the family money for a time when he exists his MLC.

Whether or not your H's relationship with the trainer was a PA or EA, it was inappropriate. He had no regard for your feelings about it. He had to catch up with her? No, his place was to catch up with his wife.

Remember, you were blindsided, but he has been planning this for a while. We have a saying on here, believe only 50% of what they do, and believe nothing that they say.
trying2bok

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2017, 01:23:50 PM »
Thanks learningIamOk,

New to this so will look into a financial agreement. I know it is the right thing to do but I suppose it is early days for me and I still can't get my head around him acting this way & when he says 'I'm not coming back' am finding it hard to believe he could have switched off so quickly and so entirely.

I am not really sure what sort of contact is wise. Until last weekend, and he has been gone for 5 months, I have just been sending messages of support as I know he has been under a lot of stress, really just trying to maintain connection. That seems I have really backfired as he saw this as manipulation.  Is the general consensus / rule to just let him be with no contact unless he initiates it? Is the thought process behind this that they will contact you eventually?. Must admit to feeling like an alcoholic looking for a drink while waiting for contact, does it get easier. 

Also when H left he insisted that all in his life was well except his relationship with me which caused stress and problems in his life, first two months living in the flat, were the happiest he had ever known, another two months on he seems to now realise that living alone, with free time on his hands is not any fun, so currently still blaming me for unhappiness but also home town as has no friends here - hasn't been out socially with joint friends since he left, also joint friends have not been in touch with him which is not unusual after separation but he is feeling very hurt. Because of working pattern he has always found it difficult to make / maintain friendships. Now wanting to move away but doesn't seem to have researched where he could go just looking to reinvent himself somewhere else.  Must admit I am worried about lack of contact when he leaves, will it not be a case of out of sight out of mind?

Found this site this week and reading info has made me feel stronger.  Just need to GAL now Without H.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline OldPilot

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2017, 01:27:18 PM »
Welcome to the Board

You are in a good place.
Your H/W  is on his/her own journey.
You can not do anything to control this trip.
Come here and read or vent, we will listen.
Give your H/W space  he/she needs to heal himself/herself.

I would not ask him/her anything unless you can have no expectations.
Sometimes asking them questions will be thought of as pressure.
You do not want to do anything that can be thought of by your H/W as controlling or pressure.

Your need to start working on you.
There is nothing that you can do to help your H/W.

He/She has given you a gift.
It is time!!

Use the time wisely to make yourself a better person.
Look in the mirror to see what it is that you can improve.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
GAL.

Read some books on depression. Both for yourself! And for H/W.
Believe none of what he/she says and 50% of what he/she does.

Read the resources from this site.
The links that are in my signature.

Detach. - The single most important thing you can do

The detach link and HB's 6 stages of MLC(rewritten from Jim Conway) located in the resources above.

Developing Detachment
http://jamesjmessina.com/toolsforcontrolissues/developdetachment.html

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/self-focus_releasers_detach.html

http://www.livestrong.com/article/14712-developing-detachment/

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Offline stillbaffled

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2017, 07:12:15 PM »
Welcome to our little corner of cyber space, Enyo.  You will find wonderful people here who will offer wisdom, comfort, and encouragement.  Read lots and post often. 
After all, tomorrow is another day.
Together 16 years - married 6
BD - 1/1/16
His divorce final 7/16
Married OW - 7/17
a consistent semi-vanisher in the same small town

Offline No expectations

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2017, 07:20:50 PM »
Enyo,

I'm so sorry you had to find your way here.  I remember when I first came here, hoping I didn't really need to be here.  But it has provided me so much support and help, this is a great place.

I have found for me, I did better not initiating contact with H, letting him take the lead.  Many here have a spouse that blames them for all their woes.  I haven't experienced that myself, but he may be doing that and not telling me.  My h is a huge conflict avoider.

Your H will have to go through this on his own.  Your best course of action is most likely to move forward with yourself, use this time to your advantage.  Read everything you can of RCR's articles, then reread them.  Then reread them again.  Every time I read them, I discover something I missed before.  Post often.  Post on other's threads so more people find you.  Ask for a mentor.  Let everyone know what you need, there are so many wonderful people here, and we are all going through our own version of it. 

Take care.  I will be here, following along.
Married 10 1/2 years, together 17.  BD 9/2016, 2nd BD 10/16.  H moved out 10/16.  2 AS's from my first M.  Me 55, H 49.  OW 23.

"And once the storm is over, you won't remember how you made it through; how you managed to survive.  You won't even be sure if the storm is really over.  But one thing is certain; when you come out of the storm, you won't be the same person that walked in...that's what this storm is all about."

"The trick is to enjoy life.  Don't wish away your days, waiting for better ones."

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2017, 07:07:04 AM »
Thank you for the messages of support above

OK, it has been nearly 4 weeks since I signed up to this forum and wrote the above.  In that 4 weeks I have taken time to firstly BREATH, then read as much as I could about MIC, and the posts on this forum.  Yes I have looked at the reconciliation posts ~ we all need a bit of hope ~ but I have also read with interest posts from members who are new to this crisis, these I have found reassuring as it seems (and this is very good news) that I am not going mad, nor am I to blame for all the problems in the world!
After doing all the reading I really can’t imagine how I missed all the signs.  I have read in some of the posts that people have said that they initially did one or two things wrong, well I have probably been doing it ALL wrong for over 18 months!  In my defence I was recovering from illness and suffering from depression.

I think my H has started going through MLT / MLC around 4 years ago.  At that stage I was ill and he definitely didn’t handle it very well, I think he saw my illness as life limiting for him (he has seen this happen with friends).  Within a year of that he started watching his weight, exercising, weighing himself daily, dressing in designer clothes, he even had a tattoo, he started questioning what he was doing in his life, was dissatisfied with his job, his younger boss etc etc.  Around 2½ years ago he was offered the job he has now.  6 figure salary, big title basically THE job and at the age of 54, he had MADE it.  I have never met any of his new work colleagues (which is unusual for us) and he seems to have developed a new persona / image at work.  He is called by his full name not the shortened version (which is unheard of), and he was also very pleased that his new work colleagues all through he was 10 years younger than he actually was.

The exercise continued along with a change in attitude toward me, he became arrogant, and started living in a ‘better than’ box (reference from the Anatomy of Peace – worth a read), by that I mean he adopted an entitled attitude, our sons came home to live after finishing university and one asked ‘Why is dad acting like an a@@hole since starting this new job’ says it all really.  He was drawing further and further away from me and by August 2015 had set into the working /exercise routine as described above.  By December, after holding it together for around 3 years my marriage imploded!  The rest is described above.

From then on I basically did everything wrong, tried to get him to talk to me, went to marriage counselling, though I didn’t think our marriage was the problem, cried (as did he!) I didn’t beg but couldn’t see any reason why we couldn’t sort ‘this’ out.  Him living at home from December 15 until August 16 was extremely stressful for both me and our sons.  My H was angry ALL the time about everything and we walked around on eggshells for all this time, he said I was controlling, needy, socially inept (!) and was the reason he had no friends.  When he moved out I honestly thought he would be back very quickly, I really was delusional.  By Christmas his mum was very ill and I would send texts every 4 to 5 days offering support not really getting any reply.  The six weeks from Christmas until I found this forum he had virtually stopped contacting me, or our sons, and when I met with him 4 weeks ago he said that my supportive texts were manipulative and an attempt to trick him to come home.  Soooo, since that time I have turned 180. 

I have not once initiated contact.  He rang me after 2 weeks and I sent his call to voice mail.  He left a message about our S24s birthday, saying he had bought a card from us both (?), and we should talk about what we were going to give him as a present and that he had booked a table for us all to go for a meal, he said he was going to Italy for the week and would be in touch.  I did not reply.  I did tell S24 that I didn’t feel I could go to the meal to which he replied ‘If you don’t go I’m not going either’.  H is really trying to reconnect with sons; it’s all very clunky and not at all relaxed and mainly involves H offering them money for one new tyres on the car, football (soccer) tickets etc.  Most of which they decline but he transfers the money into their accounts anyway.  I decided I would go to the meal but would sit away from H.

He called again 6 days later and I actually missed his call as I was out to dinner with friends.  He seemed a bit annoyed that I hadn’t returned his call and asked if the meal arrangements he had made were OK.  I just sent a text saying ‘Out at dinner, phone on silent so missed your call.  Am OK for tomorrow’.  He called again the following afternoon (the day of the meal), I answered calmly, was polite but cool.  We decided on an amount for a present (S24 wanted money as he was saving for a new computer) which H said he would cover, he had also bought another present which he asked if I thought was ‘too much’ to which I replied that it probably was.  He also said he had bought a bottle of Champagne to open before the meal and was it OK if he came to the house ~ this is just a normal 24th birthday but he seemed hell bent on celebrating in style, we are normally very low key ~  anyway I love Champagne so said yes!  When he arrived at the house I didn’t greet him with a hug, just a Hi and walked away.  I didn’t travel with him in the car to the restaurant, which he was surprised about.

H made sure that I sat across from him at the meal and even though I was polite I didn’t initiate conversation, which is not like me at all as I always have stories to tell about who I have seen, what I have read or watched and what I am doing, I did tell him about some work that needed doing on the house but said that it was all in hand (which it is) and I was just letting him know.  I am always usually interested in what he has to say about work or his family (who he has effectively cut me off from), but I didn’t ask about either.  Apart from this I only initiated conversation with our sons and their girlfriends.  He did ask how my parents were and I simply said ‘fine’.   At the end of the evening he gave me a big hug and a kiss (on the cheek) and said take care, to which I said you too.

I can say that in the last 4 weeks I have been more relaxed than I have been for a couple of years.  I have decided that his problems can no longer be my problems, I love the phrase on this site ‘Your circus, your monkeys’.  I think this is what is referred to as detaching.  I am definitely sleeping so much better and laughing more and my counsellor definitely noticed a difference not only in my attitude but in the way I held myself.  Feeling good about myself.  Miss H dreadfully, and actually really love him.  He looked so lost when my S25 and I left him at his car on Friday night and I felt like giving him a hug!!!, but have decided just to GAL and hope that he follows. 

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline What now

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2017, 08:54:29 AM »
Attaching. Im in the same part of the world and have a similar timeline (thinks hes been in MLC for 4 years, BD#1 was in August 2015 "I love you but I think I'm going to leave. I still want a relationship with you though" BD#2 December 2016 he stayed out and I told him not to come back. Denied ow but I know there was someone else. Admitted to relationship in January 2017) and cant believe I missed the signs either. You only notice them in hindsight though. Its when you can look back on it and do the research that you realise its MLC and not you.

You seem to be in a good place and in good spirits so that will help with your journey.

Expect the best, prepare for the worst and be kind to yourself.

You have found a really good place to vent, ive found this site to be very helpful as others can offer a different perspective on your situation.
Me 34
Him 46
S 4, D 9, SD 20, SS 24, SD 27. 6 grandchildren.

BD#1 August 2015 - i think i should move out and carry on as we are because i love you but it would work better
BD#2 December 2016 - moved out
ow- 27 with 3 young kids. They don't live together

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2017, 06:24:03 PM »
Enyo, you really do see in hindsight what had begun brewing years before BD. The walking on eggshells is exhausting. Peace at all costs can be costly.

I am very happy to hear that you are improving. I love that you are sleeping better and carrying yourself better. "Not my circus, not my monkeys", is a great attitude to have. Letting go of trying to control the situation is very freeing. Keep putting one foot in front of the other. I think you are on your way.
trying2bok

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2017, 07:36:53 AM »
Hi Enyo.
attaching for your ride.
Good to read how ell you are doing. It probable took me 10months before I was enjoying and laughing again. But I had a touch and go for 31 days so a small knock back. Im in the UK and I'm working through my Financial Settlement agreement. Please PM if you need any advice etc.
Dont worry about missing the signs. You were married for a long time and in that time you had trust and honesty which your thought was a 2 way street.
I only found out last month that my W had been living 2 lives for over 3 years with OM before Bd1.
I remember looking at the 6 stages on the HB wedsite and writing all the things that had happened over the last 4 years which was text book to MLC. I didnt have a clue to MLC then .
Your doing so well. Detachment and distance.
He will follow a pattern and you will identify how he contacts and when etc.
Take care  DW

Online Mitzpah

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2017, 11:50:59 AM »
Hi Enyo,

I think all long marriages when hit with this crisis have a lot of similarities. I heard a lot of what  you did, admittedly we had only been married 26 years and five months at BD, 31 years relationship. The 'we got married too young', watching his weight, obsessing with all he perceived I 'never let him', he also excluded me from his office socialization, starting to run with the younger crowd...

You are doing very well and seem to have gotten a handle on this.

One of the early triggers for my husband's crisis was my hysterectomy (along with the removal of my gall bladder too) - he was very distant, different from my loving husband - this was in 2008 - two years before BD. Our middle son had had brain cancer and was recovering at this time, needing less attention. H. seemed to disconnect from me then, even though I made a good recovery and felt a lot better after the hysterectomy.

I am glad you have a counsellor, I am sure it is a great help :) Let go and let God, is what I say!
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #11 on: March 08, 2017, 11:43:11 AM »
Thanks WN, Learning and dogwalker for the words of support.
 
Wasn't expecting H to be in contact, well that’s a Lie!!!!  I think that deep down I am not as detached as I thought and was hoping he would maybe contact in a ‘friendly’ way.

H did call sons on Friday to catch up, sons feel really awkward talking to him, but are trying to be friendly with him.  He also sent me a text me to say he had been hit with a hefty electric bill for our (my) house.  He is actually being more than generous with money and is making sure that I am receiving 50% of our joint income.  We had a new tiled floor throughout kitchen and conservatory (quite a large space) with underfloor heating put in last spring.  The underfloor heating was Hs request, think that the cost of running it has come back to bit him now.  Still toasty toes were nice while they lasted!

He didn’t travel home to the flat last weekend opting instead to travel to Italy over the weekend for meetings on Monday.  This coming weekend he is going to Cardiff (Rugby) on Saturday, got tickets through work clients then travelling up north after the game so he can travel back down on Sunday (400-mile round trip) so he can take our sons to play happy families with his family.

Have to admit this family trip is getting to me.

His family – what can I say.  We have always had a ‘Christmas Card Round Robin Letter’ relationship with his family.  By that I mean everything is very shallow and ‘topshow’, only good news and smiles allowed.  It gets very wearing and the mask was getting more and more difficult to keep in place over the last couple of years.  H wants sons, and their girlfriends, to do the round trip on Sunday to go out for a meal with MIL FIL BIL SIL and two cousins and maybe other BIL and SIL will be there to make a full set.  I am not sure what H has told them about me, they know we are separated but I am not sure how he has justified this to them, in fact he has asked that I don’t contact them and the last message I got from SIL was ‘Sorry it hasn’t worked out between your and ***** (H)’ as if we were teenagers having gone out for a few weeks not been married for nearly 35 years. 

Sons are really not looking forward to the day (which will involve around 7 hours sitting in a car) but don’t feel able to say no as they know H will blame me for influencing them if they do so they have reluctantly agreed to it.  Also H has reminded them that Grandparents are now old and he doesn’t know how long they will be around.  That reminds  H did actually tell me when we first met (36 years ago) that his mum was ill (she had sarcoidosis) and probably only had around 6 months to live ~ she is still here.

On a brighter note I am going to a Gin festival on Saturday afternoon so maybe I will be too hungover to care ;)
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #12 on: March 08, 2017, 12:00:48 PM »
Thanks Mitzpah, Its true that they don't seem to be able to handle our illnesses well.  I think that maybe it reminds them of how we are all ageing, they just need to realise that you can enjoy this time in life, lets face it the children and independent, the hard work is behind and whats ahead can be anything you want it to be - a real adventure.

Actually went through a surgical menopause when I had my ovaries removed this followed 12 months later by back surgery and and SAH really seemed to freak him out.  Also I was pretty depressed and questioning my role in life, not that I ever thought our marriage or H were at fault.  In fact BD is what snapped my back into living, now just need something to snap him back.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2017, 05:18:52 PM »
Enyo, I would tell your sons that H's perception of why they don't want to go, shouldn't influence their decision. He's entitled to his feelings and interpretations however wrong they are. I do agree that they should make an effort to visit with their ageing grandparents. It's true that they won't be around forever.

The fact that your H's family is only allowed to share good news speaks volumes as to why you are at this juncture. Your H has apparently never been allowed to speak his mind or deal with difficulties.
trying2bok

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2017, 02:32:27 PM »
Hello Envoy:

I have been chosen to mentor you.  You sound like a lady who wants to heal and find her way to normality.  A woman with reasonable expectations and is completely honest with herself.  Just the sort of person I love to work with, can't believe I got two such mentee's in a week of each other.

I am sure you are aware, there is no magic solution.  Sadly, not me or anybody else can do this for you.  Only you can do that.  That being said, it is YOU who determines how much pain and suffering you are willing to accept.  If you want to suffer a lot, you will focus completely on your MLCer and pretty much ignore the importance of your own healing.  My personal experience taught me that to heal myself first and then see how my MLCer was looking, helped me in so many ways. 

Healing will not happen overnight.  You have spent a good portion of your life with your h, your lives are forever "entwined" no matter what the outcome.  My desire is to help you through the worst of the pain, so that you are able to remain in civilized, perhaps even amicable terms with your spouse.  There is NOTHING you can do about your MLCer, you may or may not be at that point yet, so I will try not to rush you. 

You have been battling this pretty much on your own for quite a while now and doing a VERY good job of it too, I might add.  You have done many of the things that all of us tried to do and have had the same result.  I do not consider these to be error's, I think it is human nature to try to be as compassionate and empathetic when you truly think there is something wrong with someone you love, or perhaps are struggling with depression/mental illness/whatever.  I remember doing all kinds of research on tumours because I was convinced my h had a brain tumour or some such thing, as what else could have caused such a drastic change and so overnight.  Of course as time went on and I began to reflect, THIS had obviously not started suddenly, it had been slowly encroaching into our lives for many years.  Uggh... dreadful!

This is a long, slow process.  No one can predict the outcome.  The only thing we all know for sure, this is easier to handle if you focus on yourself.  This is a good time to start new hobbies that you might have had an interest in pursuing in the past but did not do so, as you felt it might intrude into your family/partnership time.  Reconnecting with old friends, old hobbies, activities will also help you through this most difficult of times.  Taking control of your life and is very gratifying and energizing.  This is the time to do those things that you have been putting off, or considering attempting.  The sky is the limit.  MlCer is off on his own journey, he may or may not return, but the healthier you are, the better you will cope with whatever the outcome.

Feel free to contact me via PM if you like, although I prefer to post on the open forum as other people will be able to contribute and share their personal experience giving you their support and input.  I suggest you reciprocate and post on other threads whose situations interest you, follow and support them, as much as your time will allow.  The more input and support you put into others, the MORE INPUT, support and attention you will receive in return. 

Again, I am so sorry you are here but you have found a safe place to work through all of this with. 

Hugs Stayed


Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

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Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2017, 01:24:01 AM »
Hi Staying, thanks for agreeing to hold my hand over the next few weeks I very much appreciate it.  As you say I am looking to find my way back to normality, I think it has really been missing in my life for the past few years. 

I have read you story and whilst your wonderful outcome obviously gives me hope I am trying hard to hold onto the fact that no matter what I do or how I conduct myself my H may decide not to come back.  I have been living in this full blow crisis probably for over 2 years now, things started to change (I think he moved from MLT to MLC) when H was offered this new job and I think that I have come a long way on my journey in that time but also know that I have a long way to go.  I have started to move forward faster than ever in the 5/6 weeks since I found this forum.

Up until that time I would text H every week just to offer love and support as MIL was so ill and he was struggling to share care for FIL with his brothers.  He took these messages of support to be manipulative so at that point I decided to stop contacting him altogether and just reply, with calm basic replies, if he contacted me, which he has done 4 times in the last 4 weeks.  I know that he is at least alive as he is trying to rebuild his relationships with our sons.  I am noticeably calmer when I don’t have to think about him or about what he is doing or when he may pop up next.  I am even settling back into work.  I haven’t really been operating at an optimum level.  I manage a GP practice in the UK and realise that I have been doing just enough to be useful, thankfully the partners have been very understanding.  We had a partnership meeting last week and after it one of the partners commented that ‘It’s nice to see Enyo’s back in the room!’

I have read a lot of threads on this site and can see that documenting your journey is not only cathartic but also lets you see how far you have come.  I did start a journal over 12 months ago, and really wish I had kept it up.  I found that journal last week and re-read what I had written, I cried for the women and the place I was in at that time, I had forgotten just how low I was and how desparate I felt and I see those feelings mirrored here by people who have found this site at the start of their journeys.  I have had other low moments, particularly this last Christmas, the first without H in 35 years, when even 18 months into this I still was trying to find a solution – the panic attacks were particularly debilitating and I needed time off work.  After finding this site, going 180 and understanding that detaching doesn’t mean giving up and no longer caring but healing and becoming the best I can be for me.  If H does decide he would like to come back he will find, not the women he left 6 months ago, but a confident more self-assured me.  I think my self-confidence has returned because of reading everything on this site, and more and finally understanding that this crisis is not my fault, and that despite what H has said, I did nothing to cause this.  I have been doing my mirror work, if I am honest I have probably been doing this for the last 6 months and can now admit that, since my illness(s) I had probably not been showing up in our marriage and that this has obviously created problems.  I am working at changing my outlook and will definitely be front and centre in my relationship in the future.  GAL confused me at first, I took it to mean that I had to be out socialising every night, which really isn’t me.  I have been going out a lot more with friends for meals and to comedy clubs (having a good laugh really helps doesn’t it?).  I have also taken the decision (at 58) to start studying with the Open University for a degree, I have signed up though the course doesn’t start until October.  One of the best things I did last year was, 4 weeks before H left, to buy a puppy.  She is 9 months old now and is an absolute joy, some days she was the only reason I got out of bed. 

Re-reading the above I do sound very confident but this is not always the case and I am also conscious that I have not really had any contact with H for a couple of weeks, it is definitely that contact that causes stress and anxiety in me.  It was I that eventually asked him to leave at the end of Aug 16, he had threatened to leave every week for the proceeding 6 months.  I eventually just said 'If you are going to go I would rather you just did it', it just so happened that I had completed a 6 month renovation programme on our flat getting it ready to sell, he just moved in to his nice new home!  I really feel for LBS who's MLCer don't leave home, I was a nervous wreck before he left, now I can breath.   

Thanks again Stayed  Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #16 on: March 10, 2017, 06:27:33 AM »
My dear Envoy, I am going to enjoy working with you.  I am so pleased that you can see, that even though I am one of the few who has actually reconciled, that RECONCILING is really not the MAIN GOAL.  You are!  This forum has been a Godsend to many of us in that it directly facilitated our ability and WILL (yes will), to heal and retake control of our lives. 

After finding this site, going 180 and understanding that detaching doesn’t mean giving up and no longer caring but healing and becoming the best I can be for me. 

Your statement here is "music to my ears" as that describes exactly what STANDING is all about, at least in my opinion.  It is not giving up love and hope that your spouse might return, not in the least, in fact, it is holding on to love and hope, placing it in a nice safe place where it can not be damaged any further.  Recognizing that love and hope cannot be taken from you, as that BELONGS to you.  At the same time, being a door matt and clinging to the MLCer is not helpful to yourself, your children, your family, your friends and most of all YOUR MLCER. 

This is an opportunity to rediscover the person you were before your became Mrs. Envoy, before you became a mother, perhaps even before you became a GP.  I'm not sure why, but we women have a bad habit of handing over our SELF IDENTITY when we take on responsibilities.  Men, don't do that nearly as much as we women.  This is not the way you would have liked to have rediscovered the "lost Envoy" but it's what you have, so why not use it. 

I have found that this horrible situation can make you into a stronger, more compassionate, empathetic, caring person then you were before.  The amazing thing, it is not done by bending weakly and caving in to this crisis, it is done by standing up, confronting it face to face and taking back your life.  In my case, I believe that finding my way back to my former Stayed, the woman I was before I met my h and became his wife, actually attracted my h back to me.  I wasn't focusing on myself for that reason, it just seemed to be a secondary RESULT from working on myself and becoming the best Stayed I could be. 

There is so little statistic available on this most sad situation which we call MLC, that it is hard to make any assumptions.  Whether my h returned because he saw that the woman he had originally married returned, or at least was more the woman he had expected me to evolve into or not, is not the point.  The point is, that I became somebody that I now respect and love, first and foremost.  I had lost sight that in order to live a happy, joyful life, one must LOVE oneself first. 

I hated every single second of this nightmare, but I have no regrets, as it is directly responsible for the stronger, happier person I am today.  I feel I have been granted a second chance to be the person I was always intended to be, not the serving, placating, Stepford Wife, and mother, I had become. 

You are sounding strong Envoy, you are sounding really good.  Of course you are still fragile and confused.  You will have days where you feel like you can conquer the world and other days, where you want to curl up in your bed and cry like a baby.  You know what, that's what you should do.  This is one of the most emotionally disturbing events in the world.  It is compared to THE DEATH OF A LOVED ONE... which is an indication of just how dreadful and painful this is.  In some ways, it hurts even more then a "death" because in death, your loved one did not LEAVE YOU WILLINGLY, they had no choice.  With this dreadful situation, they have chosen to abandon us.  THAT HURTS!  That is incomprehensible.  This is a something to CRY ABOUT. 

Even knowing what I know about "detaching" and letting go, I still found it hard to do so.  10/20/30/40 years is a long time.  You were suppose to love, honour and cherish each other until "death do you part" and suddenly ONE PARTY of the team has decided that they are no longer going to stick to the "oath" they took.  That is not an easy thing to accept.  There is nothing easy about any of this.  So please Envoy, be kind to yourself.  Do as you have been doing, go out with good friends, attend comedy clubs etc. as LAUGHTER is truly a wonderful tonic.  The best in fact. 

Keep posting.  I wish I had found this forum when this first happened to me.  I wish I had a actual "journal" of this event.  I know it would have been invaluable.  So keep posting.

HUGS Stayed
« Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 08:08:39 AM by stayed »
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2017, 10:09:15 AM »
Thanks Stayed, I do feel fine at the moment but it is wonderful to know that you can vent on here and release some steam.   OK just to catch you up on where my H is

5/6 weeks ago H informed our sons and I that he had listed our flat (where he is currently  living) for sale or to let, whichever happened first and then he was moving away.  His UK office is 300 miles away and he said that the commute was becoming too much, which I can totally understand.  He wasn’t however planning to live near the office but planned to rent a flat somewhere in the middle (around 150 miles from us and from the office), which meant that he would still be commuting and living in the new flat only at weekends.  He tried to convince our sons that he would see more of them when he moved away but when they asked how that would work he didn’t have an answer.  His first thought was to live in Oxford, we did at one time live just south of Oxford and I think he is looking to re-live a ‘happy’ time, looking for a happy place.  He had realised that Oxford is mega expensive so his plan was that he would just get a map and draw circles at 10 mile radius’s north of Oxford until he found somewhere he could afford!  As you can see not really a lot of thought gone into choosing where he should live, believe it or not H was a very intelligent and practical man be BD not sure where that intelligence went.  Needless to say we didn’t question his logic.  He left home last August saying he was unhappy and it was because of me and our marriage that was the problem, he said he had tried his best to make it work (I didn’t notice and I am not sure what this entailed!),  8 weeks living in the flat he said he couldn’t remember a time when he had been happier than he was living alone however now another 4 months on he now realises he is still not happy but this time it is because he has no friends (which is actually true because of the way he works and his nomadic lifestyle), and he feels that people in town are talking and gossiping about us, so he was moving somewhere where he could start again and build a new social life.  Incidentally he says that I am the reason he has no friends as I am socially inept!  This all makes him sound like a saddo but he really wasn’t before all this started.

H has not had to tell anyone that we are living separately (due to having not friends  ;)) except for his immediate family and I am not sure what he told them as he then cut me off them.  People we know in town know, you don’t live apart for 6½ months without it being noticed and I think that this embarrasses him.  He is still wearing his wedding ring, his Facebook account still says he is married to me and he admitted that he hadn’t told anyone at work that he was separated.  Is this denial on his part?  I honestly don’t think that there is an OW, I think that he had a fantasy relationship / EA with ex training partner and I think that she encouraged this because it got her what she wanted, a training partner who would go out to train at the drop of a hat but I also think that he has been too embarrassed to contact her since I put my foot down on their training together 16 months ago, he is really bothers him what other people think about him.  Since leaving home he has been filling his time with work (up to 100 hrs per week) and training (he has signed up for at least one marathon and a triathlon), he has not given himself anytime to stop, breath and think and I don’t see this happening anytime soon.  I nurse friend of mine thinks he needs just a small illness, nothing too major, just something that will slow him down for a month or two!!!!  He knows that he has a trapped nerve in his lower back and one in his neck that are giving him pain as well neuropathy in one foot but he feels that he can just ‘run these off’, not fool like an old fool. 

I know that it is unusual for there not to be an OW and I may be just being delusional but he is never in the same place from one week to the next except when he is at home and then he is either running or trying to get our sons to go round to keep him company.  I did read that work and exercise could be alienators.  By the way he does exercise alone and is not a member of a gym.  I honestly don’t think that he would have left home if I hadn’t pushed last August, this is something that I have been troubled about and feel guilty for but I think I have got to let this go, what is done is done. 

The reason he listed the flat for letting as well as for sale is that he knows that currently the housing market is depressed and that it would be very unlikely that we found a buyer in the currently financial climate.  There are a lot of new build developments going up in this area and first time buyers, who are most likely to be interested in our flat, are being offered great deals to buy new houses off plan.  My sons and I did notice about 2/3 weeks ago that the flat had disappeared from the letting agents list though it is still up for sale.  I am hoping that this means that he is rethinking the logic around his decision to move away, but is keeping the flat up for sale because he can convince himself that he tried to move away.  Of course neither I, or our sons, have discussed this with him and I may be way off.  I think that our sons really need him near so they (and I) can keep an eye on him.  He admitted 9 months ago that he had contemplated ‘ending it all’.  He said that once when he went to the airport in the middle of the night to catch a flight to somewhere in Europe he walked to the edge of the multi storey car park and contemplated jumping, this apparently wasn’t a one off!  I don’t think that he has actually formulated a plan to do it, which I believe is key, just considered it as an easy way out of his unhappiness. 

I know that he is clearly very unhappy and probably very lonely (but I know that he has bought an Amazon Echo for the flat so at least I now know he has someone to talk to ::)) but as much as I love him (when I see him he looks quite lost and I feel like giving him a hug) all we can do is leave him to his own devises and hope that he gets through this as quickly as possible – well that is what I am hoping and praying for. 

In the meantime I am GAL, tomorrow I am going to a Gin festival in a nearby sea side town (with a big tower), I was offered a ticket by a friend and what can I say, it would have been rude to refuse!

Enyo

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2017, 12:18:25 PM »
Man Enyo, your h sounds SO MID LIFE CRAZY... it is amazing how many of the typical indicators I could check off and I dare say was not missed by you either.  Wow, wow, wow!  Honestly, I have to say, I am so GLAD I never had a mid life crisis.  The inner confusion must be mind blowing. 

As you said though, there is NOTHING you or anybody can do for him.  Sadly, they have to do this on their own.  AS I said before, all we can do is make the best of a bad situation and used this time as productively as we possibly can.  Working on ourselves, reassuring our children that "all will be ok" somehow.  I truly believe the worst thing we can do for our children is to over analyze these things.  I think we need to discuss it with the children but somehow try to help them understand, this is not quite as SELF INFLICTED as we might think.  I try not to get caught up in TOO MUCH SYMPATHY because I don't think that helps either.  I think the best thing we can do, is simply be as pleasant as possible, without being patronizing, kind without enabling and co-operative without being a door matt.  Not asking for much, are we?  hehehe

I believe that if we approach this as positively as we are able, it will help our children to cope and accept that sometimes, things simply cannot be explained.  To me, this is one of those things.  My children were 19 years of age up to 26 when my h finally jumped right into bat$hit crazy mode, found himself another woman and the whole works.  They were so pi$$ed... they were annoyed with me for being so "understanding" as they put it.  They felt I should have kicked his "butt" to the curb.  As time went on, they would shake their heads and look at me, like I had grown a second head.  Now, they admit, they will never understood how I managed to put this all behind us, but SOMEHOW it was working for their dad and I.  All of them admit, for their sakes and their children, they are really happy we were able to do so. 

Lol though, they still cannot understand how!!!  Quite frankly, I'm not sure either, sometimes and I will say, from 2006 until about 2009 I wasn't too sure we were going to make it.  Lot of crap to work through and well, you can NEVER completely stuff the genie back in the bottle.  :)

You are sounding very good Enyo... continue to post whatever you want... good stuff, bad stuff, venting... rationalizing... whatever you need to get off your chest.  There is always somebody here and we all truly "get it"!

Hugs Stayed

P.S.-  hope you are finding other threads that interest you.  Remember the more you put into other people's situations, the more they will put into yours.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2017, 12:20:36 PM by stayed »
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #19 on: March 13, 2017, 02:35:31 PM »
Just journaling

Well our sons, and their girlfriends, visited Hs family on Sunday, 5 adults in a car (our sons are both 6 foot 3), for the 7 hour return journey, not very comfortable.  Initially H wanted the boys, and their girlfriends, to drive to his flat (1 mile away) were they would transfer into his car for the journey.  Think he was nervous about coming round to the house in case he saw me.  I had every intention of not being there, in fact when they left I was enjoying the sunshine walking on the beach with the dog and chatting to other dogwalkers.  When I had left to walk the dog the boys rang H and said they thought it was ridiculous them travelling to him and asked that he picked them up, which he did.  They set off at around 10am and didn’t arrive home until 9.30pm. 

When they got back H came into the house.  Recap, until 6 weeks ago I was texting him every 4 to 5 days, not expecting a reply but offering support as MIL was very ill.  When I met with him to discuss him putting our flat up for sale, which he did without first discussing it with me, he started the conversation by saying ‘Your texts are manipulative and a trick to get me to come home, just get it into your head I am not coming home, its about time you just got over it, everybody thinks so (I think by that he meant his family).  I am moving away to start a new life’.  From that time I haven’t initiated contact, in fact there hasn’t been that much contact.  After two weeks he called me to discuss S24s birthday, I was on a train so sent call to voice mail, he sounded nervous but angry and informed me he has booked a table to celebrate S24s birthday and asked was I free to go, he said he would try to contact me again.  I did nothing.  He contacted me 6 days later but I was out having dinner with friends and had phone on silent so missed his call, he left a message saying he thought I would have got back to him after the last message and was I OK for the meal.  I just text back ‘Out having dinner with phone on silent so missed your call, OK for tomorrow E’, I am normally quite chatty in texts and always in the past ended them with ‘Love E xxx’.  He called me again the next day, which I answered, and it was just agree on how much we were going to give S24 for his birthday, to inform me that he bought a birthday card from both of us (?) and to ask if it was OK to come round for pre-dinner drinks, I said it was fine.  I was friendly but cool at the meal, I didn’t ask about his work, or family.  The following weekend he text me about a query regarding our electric bill, which I replied to, just a basic ‘will look into it’ text.  This weekend he came into the house when dropping the boys off, we chatted a bit, involving the boys in our conversation so it wasn’t just him and me, he visibly relaxed after a few minutes.  When he left he gave me a hug and a kiss (on the cheek) and said ‘We ought to go out for coffee to catch up’ to which I replied ‘great, just give me a call’.  We haven’t been out for a coffee since October, so 4.5 months, and then we only went I suggested it, this is the first time he has suggested it, I have no expectations that it means anything but I think that he is obviously confused by my distance and detachment. 

Next weekend he is taking S25 to a football (soccer) match.  S25 wasn’t sure if he should go, he feels that conversation is very strained, he asked what I thought, I said go, spend some time with your dad, the more you do it the better it should get.  They used to go to watch football together all the time and even season tickets holders at one time, H is a football coach and coached S25s team.  H stopped watching football altogether over 2 years ago, said he wasn’t interested in football anymore. 

The next time I know I will see H is in two weeks at S25s girlfriends 21st birthday party, which is in two weeks.  I really don’t expect any contact before then.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #20 on: March 13, 2017, 05:48:10 PM »
sounding good Enyo.  Keep your h guessing.  Let him wonder wth is going on for a change.

Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2017, 07:14:25 AM »
Journaling, just getting thoughts down.

Thought I was feeling really strong this week but even though I am OK in the day, more than OK actually, I am not sleeping very well at all, lying awake quite a bit in the night.  At least it is just thoughts that are keeping me awake and not anxiety and tears which is how it was up until 6 weeks ago.  My ‘Rain’ sound app on my phone is really getting some use this week. 

The boys are in a bit of a mess though.  S25 has a ‘meet and greet’ today for his new job/graduate scheme which starts in September, he was traveling to his girlfriends (at university in Sheffield) last night then the 1.5 hours to the meet and greet this morning.  Unfortunately he crashed his car yesterday, the second accident he has had in two months which is somewhat worrying.  Fortunately he wasn’t injured but will have a £700 bill for repairs or lose his insurance no claims, but as he has to pay the first £500 of any repair bill he may just pay the lot and keep his no claims.  He doesn’t want to tell H simply because he knows that H will pay the bill and both sons are getting embarrassed at the way H is throwing money at them. 

I took S25 to drop his car off yesterday and he is really down, he says he doesn’t feel like anything is going right at the moment.  I pointed out (gently) that he really did have a lot to be grateful for, a great new job and opportunity, a lovely girlfriend, a wonderful mother ;) and a supportive brother, he also has a month’s travelling round Europe planned for August to look forward to.  He says he feels like the sun has gone out in his life as he was really close to H, he is extremely upset that H tries to justify what he is doing and how he is going about it, H told our sons that he knows a lot of people who have it worse than they do (not sure where he has met these people!) and they should just get over it.  S25 also says that he is having trouble concentrating which he feels is the reason for the crash yesterday and he is worried that he now won’t be able to cope with the new job, he also says he feels angry all the time, and has realised that he has started to become very nervous in new situations and when meeting new people, also not great with new job around the corner.  I have contacted my counsellor to see if she knows a good family therapist.  S24 just refuses to discuss anything to do with H doesn't even like to have his name mentioned in the house, and leaves it as long as possible before replying to Hs texts or phone calls.  I am not sure really how long things have been this bad for our sons, until recently I wasn’t in a great place and I suppose I wasn’t taking much notice whilst at the same time depending on them for emotional support, I am now feeling really guilty that I missed all this.  Lets hope I can get some help.

Hs (idiot?) counsellor is the one who has convinced him that our sons would get over this quite soom and that in the future he would probably have a better relationship with them both than he had before.  On one hand H seems to be really trying to reconnect with them but on the other it seems this only happens when he is not busy with work, he doesn’t try to make contact with them during the week so work is obviously still his #1 priority at the moment.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2017, 02:52:57 PM »
Sounds like S25 could use some counseling.  Fortunately, he appears to be quite open to discussing this.  My son's were not inclined at all, even the more extroverted of the 3, in fact the most outgoing one, finally told his dad to stop contacting him, as it was upsetting him.  This son suffers from IBS and the stress was making it even worse.  Poor kid.  My kids were 19, 22, 24, 25, 26 at the time of the full on BD... they were all totally shaken. 

There is nothing simple about this Enyo.  Please do not "beat yourself up" for missing the chaos this was causing to the entire family. I am sure your sons were completely aware that YOU needed them at that time.  They are probably finally letting it all out, whereas before they knew you needed them and I'm sure they were proud that you could lean on them.  Now they can see you are beginning to feel better and now it is beginning to hit them.

Just reciprocate sweetie.  Like you did, let them talk about it.  Hopefully S24 will open up, soon as well.  They can tell their mom is starting to get back on her feet... that will help them to get themselves pulled together.

These damn counselors... they always say stupid $hit like that.  "Kids will be fine, in fact, you will probably have a better relationship... "  blah, blah... I have heard that counselors prefer to have one on one sessions... harder to fix two people, higher success ratio when dealing with individuals rather then COUPLES.

AS for sleeping, uggh... sleeping was the worst part of all of this for me. I seemed to only be able to average about 2/3 hours a night.  I would sort of pass out from sheer exhaustion, and then wake up with a start... look around, only to realize it was ALL REAL... that my h had abandoned me... run off with some "cow" from work and was playing happy family with somebody who was divorcing her 3rd. husband just so she could be with mine... EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK... FLOP...

I remember wondering, when is "time" going to do it's THING?  I just wanted to feel normal again.. whatever that was!!!

Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Offline stillbaffled

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2017, 08:41:42 PM »

AS for sleeping, uggh... sleeping was the worst part of all of this for me. I seemed to only be able to average about 2/3 hours a night.  I would sort of pass out from sheer exhaustion, and then wake up with a start... look around, only to realize it was ALL REAL... that my h had abandoned me... run off with some "cow" from work and was playing happy family with somebody who was divorcing her 3rd. husband just so she could be with mine... EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK... FLOP...

 

Yup - same here except the "cow" in my life was divorcing her fourth husband!   :o

Sleep is still an issue for me but it's better than it was 15 months ago!  Hang in there, Enyo.
After all, tomorrow is another day.
Together 16 years - married 6
BD - 1/1/16
His divorce final 7/16
Married OW - 7/17
a consistent semi-vanisher in the same small town

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2017, 03:35:20 PM »
Enyo, I found that taking 6 (turned out to be my magic number) magnesium pills before bed, let me sleep. You can start off with fewer and see how it goes. It can make you have the runs. Also, tryptophan works for me. It's the stuff that's in turkey that makes you sleepy after a meal.

Also, creating a safe place in my mind helped. Here is one website:

http://www.innerhealthstudio.com/peaceful-place.html

You can google others. Find one you like. This one is similar to the one I found 6 years ago, but I can't find it now.
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2017, 05:03:55 PM »
Good advice LearningIamOk... great actually.  I wish I had known about this stuff when I had my sleepless night... man it was so awful.  The nights were so LONG!  I always felt exhausted and a little sickly... stomach was off queasy... uggh.  I can't remember the horrible intense times, thank GOD... but I can remember feeling quite nauseous, my head ach constantly and I felt like I was almost walking "beside" myself.  A very unhappy observer of myself!

With time, I discovered meditation.  I found ways of controlling my impulses, or the compulsion to over dwell on my situation.  I made deals with myself, and promises.  There is the elastic band on your wrist trick.  Every time you find yourself thinking about this, you snap the elastic... at first your wrist is scarlet.  I used to snap it and then envision a big red STOP sign.  http://www.smartrecovery.org/resources/library/Tools_and_Homework/Other_Homework/stop-thought.htm

Once I was calmed down, I would then make a deal with myself.  I would promise myself an couple of hours of INTENSE wallowing/self pitying/call it whatever you wish time.  I made the mistake of not giving myself a time limit, which I quickly corrected the next time, as I would get myself so worked up during my solo PITY PARTY... that I couldn't sleep.  I also, reinstated a glassAT of wine to myself.  I HAD cut myself off all booze during the early months (6months to be exact) as I was afraid, I would climb into the bottle and never be seen or heard from again.  Alcoholism is not rampant in my family but it does exist. 

During my "pity party's" I really allowed myself to let lose.  I would cry, scream, punch the hell out of my poor pillows...make sure you are alone, you definitely would not want ANYBODY to witness this complete loss of control.  Strangely enough, we have far more control then we give ourselves credit for, as there truly was nobody around to help me, if I let myself get too far out of hand. 
 
It may be too early for you to attempt "self soothing" but, it is never too early to try.  I was desperate to feel SEMI NORMAL again... so I was pretty willing to try anything.  Others probably have technique's they used during this time. 

Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2017, 06:06:35 AM »
Thanks Learning I am OK and Stayed, your tips are more than welcome at the moment as my anxiety level is sky high today and I can’t work out why, I really thought I had this sorted!!!!  I did actually sleep last night but I think it was because I was exhausted.  Will check out the websites later.  I do take some supplements but will check on the magnesium tablets.  I decided I had to supplement my vitamin intake as after H leave home, I virtually stopped eating; I dropped around 45lbs in around 8 weeks.  Granted most of the weight I lost was what I had put on from the medication I had to take during my illnesses, the first side effect for every medication I was given was ‘weight gain’ and I hadn’t been able shift it during my recovery so every cloud has a silver lining I suppose.  I too stopped drinking, I now allow myself the occasional glass of wine (the Gin festival was an exception, but the different gins were extremely nice ;D) but I definitely am a light weight when it comes to alcohol.  I was never really worried that that I would fall into the bottle but drunk texting was definitely a possibility at one time so thought it was best to avoid drinking altogether. 

Trying to understand what the trigger today could be here.  Could it be car issues, S25 crashed his car this week and this morning I have taken my car in for a service and its first MOT.  I know that everything to do with cars this week will be sorted, and I also know that I am more than capable of dealing with all this but H was the car person in the house and I really miss having someone I can trust to discuss things with ~ forgot H isn’t really trustworthy at the moment  ???.  S25 really wanted to ask his dads advise on the repairs, I too thought that he should talk to him about it, however S25 knew that when he spoke to H that he would just insist on paying for the repairs ~ which he did ~ on the face of it this would be OK but our sons are beginning to feel really uncomfortable with the amount of money H is throwing at them, it feels to them like they are being bought.  I personally think that H is not feeling in control of anything at the moment and this is a way for him to control something, but I maybe way off.    When the boys went to Hs family on Sunday, H left the meal table on the pretext of visiting the bathroom but he actually paid for everyone’s meal (11 people), sons said this made everyone feel very uncomfortably and like they were poor relations.

Also I could be anxious because it is weekend and if I have contact with H it is on a weekend.  I don’t know if it is worse if I actually see or speak or get a text from him or if I have no contact, I stopped initiating contact 6 or 7 weeks ago.  I feel a bit like an alcoholic craving my next drink whilst hoping I can resist it.  H and S25 are going to the football tomorrow so he may well call into the house, I need to get it together before then.

Also I am having flashbacks again.  This began around Christmas when I was really stressed and had to take time off work because I was suffering from panic attacks.  This ‘flashbacks’ are never about anything traumatic, quite the contrary, they are always about happy times and they always blindside me.  This morning, whilst sitting in a meeting discussing NHS Sustainability and Transformation Plans i.e. very boring, the flashback was a memory of when H and I visited South Africa for our silver wedding (10 years ago), whilst on safari we were woken very early one morning by monkeys on the roof of our lodge, we then sat on the veranda and watched the sun rise, magical.  It’s as if my sub conscious is saying ‘look this is another thing that you will never get to experience again’.  Back in my office now and crying like a baby and haven’t cried in weeks, good job I don’t share an office! (Stayed I think maybe that a small pity party is called for tonight -  will buy wine on the way home)

Just yesterday I was mulling over whether I actually felt the same way about H as I had even a few weeks ago and it really worried me that maybe I didn’t and that I was beginning to feel numb when I thought about him ~ but not today, the longing is as strong as ever, maybe getting this down on paper will help me detach again before I actually have to see or speak to him….. and I was doing so well.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2017, 02:09:59 PM »
H rang tonight, one of the things he was ringing to let me know was that he has had an offer on the flat for the full asking price which he will be accepting, so he will be moving, probably the middle of May (our 35th wedding anniversary) I asked where he was going to live and he said he didn't know as he hadn't thought about it. He is picking S25 up tomorrow to go to football and said he would come early so we could have a coffee together and catch up. He also said we should go out for coffee on Sunday.

I did mention that if he had sold the flat then we should talk about a financial agreement, he sort of brushed that aside, not sure I will push it until I know what his plans are. 

The plan was always to sell the flat but not sure how I feel about him leaving the area and having no reason to visit our part of the country and nowhere to stay  if he does.  The boys are adamant that that they won't use up precious weekend time travelling to visit him. Not sure how this will pan out.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2017, 02:48:37 PM »
Enyo, please speak to an attorney ASAP now that the flat is sold. You are entitled to half of that money. He will burn thru it quickly. DO NOT let him "steal" it from you. DO NOT be generous about it. He will not be gracious, appreciate it or reciprocate.

I am sorry about the flashbacks. When I would mourn what we had, I would remind myself that some people never get to experience what I had. I am grateful that I got to stay home with our kids. I am grateful that we got to have wonderful family vacations and cruises. I was married 33 years at the point we D'd.

It was a relief when it was over. I didn't want it, but I am happier now and I wouldn't want it any other way. I still have a lot to be grateful for.
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2017, 06:14:59 AM »
Thanks Learning, Yes your are right, we did have a great life together and I am thankful for the memories.  Must remember that I don't need more to be thankful for I just need to be more thankful.  I have been thinking about it though and this MLC it doesn't actually mean that I will never experience these things again, it may just be with different company.

So H has just called round to collect S25 to go to football.  After his phone call yesterday during which he said ‘I’ll call round early and we can have a coffee and catch up, oh and we have a buyer for the flat’ to which I replied ‘Well then we do need to talk, we now need to sort out a financial agreement’. Well…..

H phoned S25 when he was on his way to ask if he was ready to leave as H said he was running late, H is never late, punctuality is his middle name (I used to joke saying that being early was all well and good but made for a very lonely life!) so running late - I don't think so.  S25 wasn’t ready so H came into the house and stood in the hallway, (S25s girlfriend said he looked nervous and shifty!) I called Hi from the office where I was working, he popped his head in and said ‘I didn’t know you would be here’ to which I replied ‘why, I do live here’.  He said ‘we’re running late so we need to get off’ S25 stood behind him mouthing ‘No we’re not late we have plenty of time!’, he didn’t mention meeting up at all so I said ‘So the flats sold?, we need to get a move on with our financial agreement’ to which he replied ‘Oh nothing is going to happen anytime soon we can leave it for the time being, we have plenty of time’, Ah’, I said ‘I really want to get it right so I need some information from you that may take some time to get hold of like your pension statements’ H looked at me quizzically and said ‘oh, OK’ then dashed off.  Never had him down as a coward!  He really did not want to talk about this, is this because that it seems sort of like a final 'thing'?  Its funny that he has been very happy to blindside me (3 times now since he left) by ringing and saying ‘Can we meet, I need a word?’ then when we have met on all three occasions he has jumped right in to tell me that he is never coming home and that I should just get over it.  If that is really how he feels then why the worry about a financial agreement, surely it is giving him more distance which is what he says he wants.

The reason I may have thrown him into a loop with the request for pension statements is that when he put the flat on the market two months ago, without discussing it with me, I was really ticked off as it is a joint asset, his excuse for not discussing it with me was ‘I thought you could have the family house and everything in it and keep your pension, and I could keep my pensions and the equity in the flat’ which actually is not that much, probably equivalent to 4 months of Hs net salary.  This all looks good on paper but I can’t be expected to make an informed decision unless I know all the facts this is the reason I would like to see his pension statements.

At the moment H keeps saying money means nothing to him, and to reinforce this he keeps throwing it at our sons, he is also paying all the bills on our (my) house as well as giving me some additional money for food and incidentals, I haven't asked for this he just transfers the money.  I have decided not to argue with him about it, I am squirrelling the surplus away for a rainy day!  Incidentally I have quite a decent salary so having read some of the threads on here I really do know how lucky I am.

Had another sleepless night last night whilst I mulled over how the conversation this morning would go, what a waste of good thinking time that was, I wish I could turn my thoughts off sometimes.

I find the OW thing playing on my mind a lot.  I know that most of MLCers have an OP but there is actually no evidence, and never has been, that there is an OW apart from the fantasy affair with the training partner.  Surely (stop keep calling me Shirley! now that dates me) after nearly 18 months he would have slipped up, and what would be the point in not telling at this stage?  I would have also thought that he would be throwing his money around for the OW and that doesn’t seem to he happening.  I suppose that if there is really no PA, with the internet and mobiles etc there is every possibility that there could be an EA.  Up until now I would have just said that Work (he works up to 100 hrs per week) and Exercise (he is training for a marathon and a triathlon) where his OW but not knowing for sure keeps the anxiety building, its feel just like when you are waiting for an illness to be diagnosed, it doesn’t matter what the diagnosis is you know that when you find out one way or another you will just deal with it but not knowing screws with your head.   I suppose that now the flat is sold and he will be moving somewhere to ‘Start a new life’, more will be revealed!

If I am honest with myself I was hoping that it would be quite some time (months maybe years) before the flat sold and in the meantime he would be travelling through the tunnel and that there would always be the possibility that he would be looking for a way home when that time came.  It really is too soon for that to be a possible now.

Enyo x 

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #30 on: March 18, 2017, 06:36:01 AM »
I am so proud of you for speaking up about the flat. I know it wasn't easy to broach the subject. I also heard from my xH that he would keep the condo he bought, 4 months after he left, and I would keep the house. When it came time to split the assets, he wasn't interested in letting me have the house. He wanted me to pay him $80,000 for it. I told him NO and I would see him in court first. Needless to say, I got the house and he was on his second condo, keeping and renting out the first one, when we D'd.

Like yours, mine also kept paying the bills here, but it was to make him feel like a "good guy". He was also trying to set a precedent with the amount of money he was giving me. When I filed, I got a temporary alimony that was double what he was volunteering to give me, and at the final decree, I got MORE money. He was furious. The longer this goes on, the less generous they become.

The wondering if there is an OW is grueling. Try not to let it over take your thoughts. If there is, she is just a symptom of the crisis and nothing more. Broken attracts broken and that's what she will be.

Quote
Surely (stop keep calling me Shirley! now that dates me)

HA! I got that quote. I am dating myself too! ;D
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #31 on: March 18, 2017, 07:34:11 AM »
Ahhhhhhhhh Learning, you are so GREAT!  Thanks for giving Enyo such wonderful advise.  That is pretty much what I would have said, only with a whole hell of a lot more words. 

Enyo, it is completely normal to have set backs and flashbacks.  I had the same problem, as quite frankly, hubby and I had had a pretty darn good life.  Very full, lot's of travelling, a truly good partnership.  Those thoughts used to HAUNT me, until I decided to HOARD them, relish them and NEVER ever let them go.  They became GOLD NUGGETS to me.  They were MY memories and not him, not our kids, family... another partner were ever going to TAKE them from me.  Once I looked upon them in that sense and decided to selfishly hoard them for myself, I began to enjoy and look forward to my flash backs. 

You have a wonderful sense of humour, I too am dated by your "don't call me Shirley" ... made me laugh.  One thing I can assure you of Enyo, as long as you can find ONE thing each day to CHUCKLE about, you will be JUST fine! 

Proud of you girl... will check back in later... one GORGEOUS day here... sun is shining... temperature is going to go above 0C believe me, this is something to celebrate this winter.. hehehe. 

Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
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Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2017, 12:11:12 PM »
I have just been reading Barbiedoll’s thread On the wings of a snow white dove and some of the posts on this about mother and son dynamics have prompted me to write down our Hs family dynamics in the hope of making some sense of things.

H is the middle child of 3 (all boys).  MIL and FIL married when MIL was 19 and FIL was 30.  FIL is now 91 and MIL is 80 and now very frail  MIL and FIL stopped talking to their siblings over 45 years ago I have never met any them.  MIL says can’t remember why she fell out with her siblings but knows she is (still) very angry with them.  Before the falling out H and his brothers spent a lot of time with their cousins but after the falling out (when H was around 8 years old) they knew they weren’t allowed to mention their cousins within hearing of MIL.  H has very few memories of his childhood.  MIL seems incapable of showing affection to more than one child at once so brothers competed for affection.  MIL used withdrawal of affection as a punishment, still does even now her sons are adults.  The brothers, as young boys, all remember being terrified that MIL would leave them, they remember frequently hiding her car keys so she could not leave.  The brothers are still terrified that if they upset her she will cut them off, like she has done with the rest of her family, so they have always walked around on eggshells and pandered to her sulks, she is very passive aggressive.  I have never known FIL or MIL to have any (and I mean any) friends.  When FIL was working (he retired at 70) he used to refer to clients (who he may have seen bi-monthly) as my dear friend XXXXX, this is actually something the Hs recently started doing.  I would describe the family as being ‘a cup half full’ family, very bitter at the unfairness of everything.

FIL worked away from home all his working life leaving on Monday morning and returning on Friday evening (clever man ::)).  H describes his childhood as being not loving but practical, they were not allowed to show emotion and when H was asked by a MC what his family moto would have been H said ‘You must conform’, he also said he couldn’t wait to leave home.  All us 3 DILs are, in MILs eyes are not good enough for her sons and she definitely lets us know. 

The discussion on the thread was around OW playing the role of mother letting MLCer take affection and love without returning it, it is all about how MLCer is made to feel.  After trying to work out this morning if there was an OW in my case I am coming to the conclusion that Hs OP could actually be his mother.  After having just a duty relationship with her for nearly 36 years he has now reconnected with her and visits her as often as he can, he now feels that she is a ‘Wonderful, Strong and Supportive women’, she is supporting him in his separation from me and rings to talks to him every day, I am quite sure that she validates him and enables him to believe that what he is doing is justified and that I am the evil DIL, I think that currently he is ‘top dog’ in the brothers pecking order.  I am not sure what he has said about me to his family because he has asked that I don’t contact them!  His brother did ring me the week before Christmas to inform me that the situation between H and I was ‘Making our mother ill’, however he admitted that H had ‘Spoken very highly of me’, don’t know WTH that is supposed to mean and one of my SIL text me just to say that she is sorry that ‘it hadn’t worked out between you and H’, like we were teenagers who had gone on a couple of dates, not a couple that had been married over 30 years.  7 weeks ago (just before I went 180) I asked H how his mother was, he snarled at me and said what do you care you never liked her.  Its true that I didn’t like how she treated her sons, or DILs, but I wouldn’t wish her ill.  I haven’t asked after his family since.
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #33 on: March 26, 2017, 05:51:11 AM »
So trying to talk myself down and re-engage PMA.  Had a really awful week mood wise.  Not sleeping again and not eating, feel nauseas.  So the flat sold and H is moving away.  He is already away during the week but has been travelling back at weekend though I don’t actually have a lot of contact with him on weekends I know he’s about and that feels helpful.

I had a call from a solicitor on Friday asking me to sign some papers relating to the sale of  the flat so I sent an email to H (the first time I had initiated contact in 8 weeks) saying that I would be happy to sign the paperwork once we had a financial agreement in place.  I am looking at a deed agreement that isn’t legally binding but if  it came to it a judge would take it into account a probably uphold it if it was a fair split.

H very confused as to why we need this, as he has been more than generous with finances, but understands that this is something I need so is willing to do it.  We had a long talk on the phone (1.5 hours) and inevitable we ended up arguing, not about finances but about where we are why he feels he needs to walk away from our marriage.  I know that I should have said ‘I am sorry you feel like that’ but I am not in a great emotional place and bit.

He says it is because I am too controlling, and that I had been for a number of years.   He says I probably don’t know I am doing it because it is ingrained in my behaviour!  I asked if he could give me an example of when I was controlling and he said. ‘ Last year when I went on a bike ride and didn’t get back in the time you thought I would have done you rang to check up on me’.  This incident happened around 6 months after BD, I went to visit my parents and took H with his bike so that he could cycle the 40 miles home while I visited my parents, went out to lunch etc.  When I got home 6 hours later H hadn’t arrived home, the ride should have taken around 4 hours.  I left it another hour but because the weather was wild (windy) and it was getting dark I called him to see that he was OK.  When he answered the phone he snarled at me saying ‘I just knew you would ring to check up on me’ to which I replied ‘Well if you knew I would be worried why didn’t you call to let me know you have been delayed’ he said ‘Can’t even have a bike ride in peace’.  I would say this is more concerned than controlling.  He also said that me trying to make 5 year and 10 years plans for retiring (we will both be in our late 60s in ten years) was controlling.

Went to S25 girlfriends birthday party last night, H was there too, we were civil but we really can’t talk about anything because I feel that if I ask him any questions about work etc he makes me feel like I am prying, he obviously doesn’t really want to know what I am getting up to though he did ask me about work but it was a very superficial enquiry.  I felt miserable all evening but hopefully hide it, not sure if I succeeded.  H left first then I left about 15 mins later, I cried and screamed all the way home in the car.  Today (Mothers Day) sons are sleeping off a night out after the party, I have just done the first tidy up of spring in the garden and am now in the process of painting the new fence panels (Hurricane Doris blow the old ones down) and I am stood crying whilst doing it and feeling very alone and very sorry for myself.   I know I have to stop this pity party but struggling.  I am seeing my GP on Wednesday as I think it is time I got some medication for my mood, concentration is shot and I am not performing well at work.

Just soooooo resentful today that H has put us (me) in this position, though he made it plan yesterday that yes he walked away but we are both responsible. I feel that if he was here (he has gone to visit his now Madonna like mother for mothers day) I would scream at him and feel like punching him (I am not a violent person) but I am so angry today, I can’t stop crying.  And the fact that today I am actually starting to feel like maybe this is all my fault and maybe I was too controlling isn’t helping.

Just needed to get this off my chest.  Will go back to my fences now
Enyo
 
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #34 on: March 26, 2017, 06:19:44 AM »
Hi Enyo. So sorry to read you update. as well as Mother's Day it would be my
29 wedding anniversary today. And for the first time in 29 years I have
No clue or contact where W is. The boys didn't want to see her either
I'm assuming she is in the pub with OM having a great time while we
All keep busy busy busy.
It will get better for you I promise. Try to look at the little things
You have achieved this week and don't dwell on the lowlights.
Easier said then done right. Good news on workingon the financials.
Hope you have the sunshine. DW

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #35 on: March 26, 2017, 06:28:06 AM »
Asked H yesterday where he was thinking of moving to now the flat has sold.  He said not really making a decision yet so and will probably find a flat to rent near to his ageing parents.  His younger brother lives near there and is an estate agent so is looking for a flat for H to rent for him.  He says he will rent to begin with until he decides what he wants to do, well it’s been 18 months since he initially said he didn’t know what he wanted and still hasn’t figured it out, not sure he will any time soon.  Moving near his parents means again he doesn’t have to make a decision with the excuse that he is helping look after them.  I am not sure if I am happier that he will be near family or not, I think so.   He said he is looking forward to being able to spend some time at his home during the week, I am not sure he will get to do that more often than he does now because of work commitments, maybe so, apparently he is looking forward to finding some clubs to join and getting a social life and making friends, he doesn’t have any friends (buddies, friends or otherwise) at the moment, just his brother, our sons and me (though he doesn’t actually consider me a friend at the moment). 

He said that even though he is moving away he will  travel to home town often to visit our sons often, not sure if he is intending on staying over when he does, If so do I let him stay in the spare room?

He tells me he is happy, doesn’t think he is depressed and says he is definitely not suffering from any crisis (identity, ML etc), so he has been thinking about it, but just unhappy with the travelling and living in home town as has no friends and feels now people know we are separated (my fault for telling!) that people are talking about him (us), as Eleanor Roosevelt said 'You would worry so much that people were talking about you if you realised how little they did', didn't quote that but felt like it.  I know he is training for a marathon though he hasn’t mentioned it to me.  He spoke to a mutual friend at the party last night and she said he admitted to being lonely at work, he is the boss and works in a very solitary way does not mix with colleagues, she also said he told her he was training but he described his training regime as destructive, and admitted that it was probably a form of self-harm.

Yesterday when I asked if he had future plans I reminded him that 8 weeks ago he told me he was going to give up work in 12 months, draw down his pensions and work for a charity in the third world he said just forget about what I said then that was just fantasy (his word), I may take a different direction career wise but haven’t really decided yet but he also said he can’t give up work as ‘at his age’ he wouldn’t get another.

I know that this is MLC but sometimes you doubt and think that maybe he had just fallen out of love with me, especially as there is no OW (suspected EA 18 months ago).  Your insight would be welcome

Enyo

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #36 on: March 26, 2017, 06:49:19 AM »
Dogwalker

Thanks for the reply.  Yes we have sunshine here today, its a really lovely day. 

29 years, now this, I won't wish you happy anniversary but you are in my thoughts, tough day.  Do you ever start to look back at your marriage and remember with fondness.  At the moment I just feel like with what H is saying that maybe I was living in a fantasy of my own all these years.

My 35th Wedding anniversary is in around 6 weeks.  I have booked a hotel in the lakes (Borrowdale) for me and my dog and intend to go and walk in the fells and hopefully find some peace, not really looking forward to the date but love the Lakes (they are only 1hr away) and it is the first visit there for my dog, she is only 10 months old, I am sure she will love it.

Keeping busy helps, if I can stop crying long enough to finish the fences :'( and I know I will have an enormous sense of achievement when the garden tidy, it was normally Hs job.  Also I know that when the boys surface (they didn't get in to 6.30am ::)) I will have some presents.

For me H is trying, and succeeding in some way to reconnect with the boys, which is good, he doesn't really monster anymore (I don't see him that often) and actually comes across as reasonable most of the time.  As there is no OW I just sometimes wonder why he left, he obviously cannot tell me with any certainty (though he seems certain) just vague ideas that I was too controlling, we had nothing in common and despite him trying everything (still don't know what he tried) it just wasn't working out and it took 34 years for him to figure this out!

Nearly PMd you to ask you advise on Financial Agreement but manage to speak to my solicitor (H very surprised and hurt that I have actually spoken to a solicitor) and think I know what I want.  H still has me as his wife on social media and still wears his wedding ring, as do I.

Hope you are enjoying the sun also Enyo
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #37 on: March 26, 2017, 07:51:22 AM »
Hello Enyo, you seem to have calmed yourself and moved away from the cliff.  I'm sure you have noticed that when you start missing SLEEP you become much more erratic and irrational.  That happens to all of us. When we do not get enough sleep and proper nutrition we lose our ability to focus and think SENSIBLY.  Out of concern for you, I looked up an old member who still comes on "occasionally" and will post you her threads.  This young woman became DETERMINED to help herself and began meditation and tried many self soothing techniques.  She really was amazing. Her handle was gimlan and here are threads... remember the first ones are her latest postings, so the further you go... the older the threads.  I have narrowed the search down to HER PERSONAL THREADS... (hopefully)
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;sa=topics;u=4386

I've also sent her a message and asked her to take a look at your thread.  Now she may choose not to Enyo as she has moved on in her life and taking back control completely.  That being said, she is an amazing, compassionate young woman.  I think you and she would related to each other very well.  She needed somewhere to FOCUS her recovery and chose a completely natural, therapy and meditation.  There was nothing HIPPY-ISH about her approach, but it was very self aware.   People just following her thread, often found comfort and solace simply by listening to the meditation video's she often posted. 

You are doing great Enyo, I know it is hard for you to look at yourself impartially.  We always SEE OTHERS situations much clearer then can our own.  I am really pleased that you saw a solicitor.  I am always amazed when  the MLCer becomes "hurt" about us seeing one.  They act like we should TRUST them, or something.  Good LORD, what a mistake that would be and in all honesty Enyo, we have seen many LBS's that trusted their MLCer and quite frankly, they were ROYALLY FLEECED!  Do I think our MLCer's do it intentionally... I honestly don't know, but they are EXTREMELY unpredictable.  Just remember, YOU NEVER EXPECTED HIM TO LEAVE YOU... ever!

I hate to do this to you, as I know you are hurting enough already...but please, please, please PROTECT YOURSELF!  You do not want to find yourself broke and working until you are 80. 

One day at a time my girl... one day at a time!

Hugs Stayed
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 08:00:40 AM by stayed »
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #38 on: March 27, 2017, 05:12:51 PM »
I lost an entire post to you and am royally aggravated! >:( >:( >:( The short of it is, take the magnesium pills. Keep talking to that solicitor. Your H's idea of fair will be whatever suits HIS needs. Don't be generous at all with him. If you get enough and then some for yourself, you can always help your H out if he needs a leg up financially. He will NOT do the same thing for you.
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2017, 08:40:13 AM »
Stayed, thanks for the links, I am working my way through them.

Learning, I will definitely take on board what you say, working up the financial agreement this weekend.

Went to see GP this morning as I now feel I need a bit of help to cope over the next couple of months, IC thought that AD might help.  Meeting H on Saturday, providing all the pension information arrives in the post, to work out a financial agreement feel - sick to the stomach thinking about it. 

H says we need to do it this weekend (though why wait) as he won’t be in town the next couple of weekends after that, didn’t say why and I didn’t ask - as I already knew.  He is running a marathon on 9th April at the other end of the county -300 miles away, I also found out today from a mutual friend that ex training partner / EA / fantasy is also running in the same marathon, don’t know why I am surprised.  I understand from same mutual friend that Fantasy / EA and her H are working on their relationship as over the last 12 months things have become a bit strained (that would be around the time I insisted that H stop training with her), her H will be travelling to marathon town to cheer her on um awkward!  Also now know that fantasy / EA has recently contacted H to invite him to join her team (her and 3 other men) to run in a total warrior race in August, H has apparently jumped at the chance.  Not sure if fantasy / EA is aware H that has booked onto the same marathon, H only booked on 7 weeks ago (probably around the time she contacted him about Total Warrior), her 7 months ago – maybe he is going in the hope accidentally bumping into her - of all the marathons in all the world you had to be running in the same one as me.

Frankly think I will be glad when flat has eventually changes hands and H has moved away, I may then get a few months of stability to regroup and regain strength.  Just need to hold it together for another 6 to 8 weeks.
On a different note had a really good chat with one of the partners at work.  They are aware that I am struggling (with everything) at the moment.  I said if it was a problem then I would take time off, but I felt that being in work was a distraction.  They are happy for me ton come in and do what I can, they are very understanding, I know that things will settle down for me eventually.
 
Enyo
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #40 on: March 29, 2017, 09:54:29 AM »
Times like this you find out just how good your employer is.
Mine was good but then again they knew work commitments
Was part of the problem
Good luck for negiotions. Remember it's your future and this
Isn't your real H. 
DW

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2017, 01:27:46 PM »
Good for you Enyo, getting some help when we most need is a healthy sign.  Shows you value yourself and want to feel better.  You will be amazed at how much easier you will cope with just a very little bit of help.  Most of us, didn't need the help for much more then 5 or 6 months. 

I must confess I am not surprised to hear that the Xtraining partner has emerged again.  Sadly, these things almost always involved another person, even if they don't reach the physical stage, emotional connection in many ways can be much worse, as we all know how fantasies can keep us attracted to even the most inappropriate situation.

I'm glad your partners are being so understanding.  It is nice to know you have friends in your corner and being able to work when you actually are up to it, extra helpful.  Working honestly can keep us distracted.

Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #42 on: March 30, 2017, 06:31:07 PM »
Enyo, I am also sorry that the Fantasy/EA has reappeared. Just remember, if it wasn't her, it would be somebody else. She is really nothing and just a symptom of his issues. My xH is with his spin instructor.  :P I even took the same spin class and it was appalling how the 2 of them interacted with me present. But of course, the EA was all manufactured in my head. ::)

I hope you do get the financials sorted out quickly. The sooner in the crisis you do it, the more generous they are.

((((HUGS)))) I know you are having a tough time, but you are hanging tough. I am proud of you!
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #43 on: March 30, 2017, 09:06:00 PM »
Welcome to our exclusive club Enyo, sd you can see there is plenty of support here.  You are the same age as me and my H and mine went into MLC in 2013 ans is still going strong ::)

My H has been going through OW's like hot dinners ans has a mirror like relationship with his parents as yours.  All the same complaints and worries about death, crazy exercising and all the other hallmarks of an MLC.

It's good you are going through the financials as it will make you feel more secure when this part is over.
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #44 on: April 13, 2017, 03:58:59 AM »
Thanks guys for your support.  I haven’t visited my thread for a few weeks but that doesn’t mean that I haven't been on the community, quite the contrary.  I haven’t written anything on anyone’s else’s thread, for two reasons really 1. I catch up on the community using my iPad and I really hate typing messages on that as they usually turn out to be gobble dee gook and 2.  Every else seem so ‘together’ and I am not sure that I have anything useful to say as even though I no longer feel like I am in a washing machine on spin cycle - I still feel that I am on an ‘anti-crease’ cycle, spinning but less frequently.  Will start just letting people know that I am reading their stories and following along with them on their journeys.

Quick update.

It will be 3 weeks on Saturday since I last saw or heard from H (today is Maundy Thursday), I have only initiated contact once in the last 10 weeks and that was the e-mail I sent 3 weeks ago though up until 3 weeks ago H did contact me for one thing of another most weekends, and I acted a normal as possible.  The sale of the flat is going through, yes I have signed without a financial agreement as I think that the sooner it is sold the sooner he can move away and the sooner he can get past this next phase of his escape and avoid life.  He has not contacted me to let me know what is happening, I just receive letters in the post from the conveyancing solicitor.  He is avoiding me like the plague, I don’t know if it is just the financial thing (he really isn’t being reckless with our finances – yet!) or he doesn’t know how to handle the guilt he is feeling.

The weekend after I last saw him as far as I know he spent it alone in the flat, he didn’t contact the boys much just one text to S24 asking him if he wanted to go to dinner, I think S24 ignored it long enough so that he didn’t have to go.  On the Monday S25 called his dad as he hadn’t heard from him.  He later told me that dad seemed a bit odd, as even though S25 didn’t ask H kept saying ‘I’m fine, everything is fine, I’m absolutely fine’!   :-\

Last weekend was the marathon, H called both sons on the Saturday (day before the marathon), he was on his own, and as he couldn’t get accommodation in the town where the marathon was being held he had to travel in from a nearby town.  He was on a bus going to check out the start point etc.

He didn’t finish the marathon, he sprained his ankle at the 11 mile point.  He contacted S25 on the Monday morning to let him know.  S25 said he nearly text back that he was a wuss and he should have limped the remaining 17 miles but then he remembered that H has lost his sense of humour so didn’t.  H is travelling to Majorca tomorrow, I think with young colleagues from work, for a cycling trial weekend, apparently he thinks his ankle will be fine as he won’t be running on it!

He took the boys out to dinner last night and they came home with 4 enormous Easter eggs for themselves and their girlfriends.  They said he was acting really odd and sentimental, he said ‘I know I am moving away but I will get to see you often’ they asked how that was going to work and he said ‘I will be doing most of the work, I won’t be taking holidays but using my leave to take long weekends to come and see you’  H said ‘we can do fun things together like football golf (wth is that!!!!), or pitch and put’, they thought this was funny they later told me that it felt he was acting like they were 8 or 9 and they wondered that if they were good whether he’d take them to MacDonalds for a happy meal! Unfortunately both boys have lives and don't really want to spend their weekends entertaining their dad, they also don't want to hurt his feelings and they know that if they refuse he is likely to blame me!

Is this normal that MLCers try desperately to reconnect with their children whilst moving further away from their spouse?

As for me!

I saw the GP and got AD, took two but they made me feel really ill so stopped them.  I carried on for a few days, was fine over the weekend but on the following Monday on the way to work the panic attacks started again, I was not really coping with work, my memory was shot and not only couldn’t I remember what I needed to do I couldn’t remember what I had done!  I have now been signed off work, this is my second week off and I have a note for next week as well.  Since I have been off I have halved the AD dose (the lowest it can be) and taken it at night.  I am feeling calmer and seem to be sleeping better, and actually finding some joy in my days.  I have another appointment with my GP in 10 days, will see how I feel then.  I do know that I have been neither use nor ornament this last couple of months at work so it is only fair that I get myself on an even keel before I go back.

Whilst I have been off I have not sat around too much.  I have got the decorators in and started updating the bedrooms, I plan that by the end of September to have updated most of the house (S24s man cave I will leave - quite frankly I wouldn't know where to start :o).  Next week I plan to go out and buy new accessories for my bedroom – my choice.  I have been making sure I get out and do some exercise, my aim is to walk at least 20K steps a day (around 9 miles), which I am managing so far, not sure how the dog feels about it though!

I have been practising meditation (with the help of some of the websites posted in some of the threads) and I have booked a refresh weekend at the beginning of June at the Buddhist centre in the Lake District which involves guided meditation.  Looking forward to it

I am also getting out meeting friends, I met with a friend whose husband has just come through a MLC, I will write a separate post after this one.  It's always nice to know that some people make it to the other side.

Enyo
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #45 on: April 13, 2017, 04:43:03 AM »
So as I said I will relate what is happening with a friend of mine.

I did my professional training with this lady 17 years ago, our paths don’t cross very often but when they do it is nice to catch up.  She is around 10 years younger than me (45 ish) and has been married for 25 years, she has two children S23 and D20.

When we (my family + H) went out to celebrate S24 birthday at the end of February we all visited a bar after the meal.  I spotted a couple in the bar who seemed really ‘together’, you know like a new relationship, they only had eyes for each other.  I then realised that I recognised the women, and also realised that she didn’t have her wedding ring on.  When I went past to the rest room the man she was with had gone to the bar so I stopped for a chat.  Being nosey I pointed to her ring finger and asked what had happened, she rolled her eyes and said ‘Mid Life Crisis – don’t laugh it’s no joke!’  I said I know exactly what you mean and told her that my H had left 6 months before.  She said we must meet up, you can’t go through this on your own (by that she meant without someone who really understands) we swapped numbers.  The man she was with was her husband.

We talked on the phone and have since met for coffee (we have pencilled in another afternoon – this time for wine :D) and her story is this.

Her Hs MLC went on for around 3 years, he had a EA with a women from work.  This women was 17 years younger and actually in a 9 year relationship with another women.  Her H told her that this girl had big brown puppy dog eyes and was always happy to see him whilst she (my friend) was always tired and looking old! He spend his evenings at home exchanging texts with this girl whilst sitting with his wife.  She thought that he was showing signs of depression (but didn’t connect it to MLC at that time), persuaded him to see a counsellor, even drove him there herself, she said that when he came out of the session he had a big grin on his face, high fived her and said, ‘I knew it, there is nothing wrong with me it’s the marriage that is making me unhappy – I’m outa here’.  Long story short, he eventually moved out, was gone for around 3 or 4 months then moved back in.  After another 3 or 4 months he moved out again.  She said that before moving out this second time he sat on the bed banging his head on the wall saying ‘I have to leave but you are making it so hard’, she obviously just then let him go.  This was followed by 9 months of NC even though they lived only and couple of miles apart.  She did know what he was up to, drinking with this other women and new friends in bars in town, always drunk.  My friend, even though she says she never really believed that this was the end of her marriage, actually start a new relationship with a friend.  She said that this new man made her feel like a million dollars, and boosted her flagging confidence and was a really lovely man.

Anyway the week before Christmas (2016) my friend received a phone from work colleagues of her husbands, apparently his phone was broken (dropped it whilst drunk), no one had seen him and he wasn’t turning up for work.  This was 11pm in the evening.  She got up, dressed and went round to his flat.  She found him in the foetal position on the floor sobbing inconsolably.  She got him to the GP the next day and I think he was given ADs.  My friend then just left him to it.  Over Christmas and into the new year he began texting her, just things he was up to commenting on the weather etc, he started ending his texts with a kiss X, she said it was the first time he had done that in 2 years.  At this point her and her new man ended their relationship, he told her to go and see if she could make her marriage work – nice guy!  Her and her H started meeting for Coffee, going on dates and out for meals.   She said that over the next 3 months she saw more and more of her old husband returning.  He moved back into the family home 10 days ago.  I really wish them well.  They did miss their Silver Wedding Anniversary as they were living separately and having NC at the time.

She said that even though she had had a close relationship with his family, his mum actually introduced them, they cut her off.  All except her BILs wife who she met on a weekly basis and basically gave her a shoulder to cry on.  They are all reconnecting now.

Enyo
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #46 on: April 13, 2017, 05:23:46 AM »
Hi Enyo
Was going to drop you a message to see how you were doing this weekend..

Wow Enyo. What an interesting 2nd update(not that the first wasnt good either ha ha ha)
The part that struck me was how her H left straight after seeing a councillor as if the councillor told him what to do or maybe he could say the councillor showed me the way to happiness. Of the 3 times W has left me twice was within 3 hours of seeing a councillor...
I'm please you have reconnected with your old friend. As well as virtual friends on here you have a physical friend to help your thro the mess..

As for taking time off work etc. My GP signed me off for 9 weeks at the start of my journey. Then I went back 3 days a week for 3 weeks then 4 days for 3 weeks. now I do 4 days in the office and work from home on the other day. (i know I'm lucky)I think for the first 4-6 months when I returned I was still not my old self. But around Xmas people at work told me they began to see the old me again. Its a long journey so you just do it at your pace. slow, quick, pause, back a bit, quick, slow, back abit... You get the idea??

Good plans to redo the house. Its not only passes the time but helps clear your mind. I'm still clearing cupboards after 17months.

Have a great easter up "in the norf"

DW

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #47 on: April 13, 2017, 08:12:53 AM »
Hi DW

You just reminded me of something that I had forgotten.  The counsellor thing has happened to me too - twice.

The first time was Feb 16 when we attended a few Relate sessions, after a few weeks H went to a session on his own, he came away saying that the counsellor had said that he (the counsellor was male) thought it would be best if we separate, I remember being horrified, I had gone to relate to save our marriage not break it up.  Of course I now know that there was nothing wrong with our marriage, well nothing that was a deal breaker anyway, it was MLC.  H took this nugget of gold with him and quoted it every two weeks until he eventually left at the end of August 16.

The second was at the end of last year, H came to see me two weeks before Christmas (he had moved out 4 months before this) saying that he wasn't sleeping, was drinking too much, smoking too much and was messing up at work and it was because of the pressure from me and our sons to come home (at this stage we hadn't actually had a R conversation for around 8 weeks)and that he had  been talking to his counsellor, a 'really lovely lady called Sarah', and apparently Sarah, who worked for Relate when he first saw her had by this time left Relate and 'gone private' as she didn't agree with Relates boundaries of not giving advise, he had been seeing her as a private client.  Her advise was it was obvious to her that he wasn't happy in our marriage and that he should make the decision to leave, also that he shouldn't wait to after Christmas to tell me but should tell me before Christmas as he wasn't responsible for my happiness.  8 weeks after this at the beginning of Feb H again let me know he wasn't going to come home and that his counsellor, the lovely Sarah, thought that I should have 'got over it' by now.

Not sure if what he said he was told is actually what he was said or just his interpretation.  Not sure if he is still seeing this counsellor, but until the are actually ready to do some work and themselves counselling is really a waste of time.

Have a lovely Easter too, hope you have something planned.  For me its coffee with friends and then sorting out the garden - again!  Apparently it's going to be colder on Easter Sunday than it was on Christmas Day - now there's a cheery thought!

Enyo



Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline stayed

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #48 on: April 13, 2017, 08:51:54 AM »
Good to hear from you Enyo, I wondered what you were up to.  You are sounding better. I am please that you reduced your AD's and have continued to use them... hopefully your GP will be able to remedy the dose and get you on them full time.  You probably will not need to take them much more then a few months... most of us didn't need them for long.  Once we got a few good SLEEPS under us, ate a few decent meals, we began to feel better about ourselves. 

I love that you are redecorating your house.  Decorating is a form of RECLAIMING your own space.  That is a particularly good thing to do at this time in your life.  It's similar to a new start without moving.  Also, it makes the place... ALL YOURS.  Good for you.

Wow, quite the story from your friend.  Yes, I do agree that MLC is real, although I am not sure that everybody's situation is MLC.  Not sure it really matters though, as the approach is still the same.  GET ON WITH YOUR OWN LIFE... let them go!  Somehow, if it is meant to be, you will reconnect.  If not, you will go on to have a wonderful life without him.  Fortunately life doesn't usually let emotional pain, last forever. 

Hugs and keep us posted.  Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

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Offline LearningIamOk

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #49 on: April 14, 2017, 06:18:16 AM »
Hi Enyo! I have to agree that you are sounding so positive and making great decisions in self care. I applaud you also for the redecorating. You should make the space your own. I also understand about the man cave. My S29 lives in total turmoil. I have cleaned it up, but it took days and now it looks like I never went in there. UGH! Waste of time.
trying2bok

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #50 on: April 26, 2017, 05:09:48 AM »
Just updating my thread though not much has changed!

I saw the GP on Monday and was signed off for another 3 weeks, she also changed my ADs as the original ones made me feel like I was wading through sludge and very sleepy.  I have been off work now for 3 weeks and it feels like no time at all.  I am continuing to get stronger, mentally and emotionally, only a few blips and I am recovering more quickly.  I feel calm and most of the time I am ‘happy’.  Spending my days catching up on things in the house and garden and walking, and walking, and walking- if my dog could talk she would be begging for mercy, but getting out in the fresh air feels good.

Also continuing with my house update, my bedroom is being decorated as I write and next week I am having new carpets fitted in the two bedrooms I have had decorated as well as the stairs and landing.  Have also been spending a fortune on new bedding, lighting and accessories for MY bedroom.  Really excited as its going to look fab.

As for H.  Not much to report.  He text on the 14th (after 3 weeks of silent) saying that he was still waiting for information so we could sort out finances, he said we could meet on the 22nd if the information had arrived.  I didn’t reply to this text as it didn’t need a reply.  He didn’t contact me again last weekend.  I have only initiated contact once in the last 12 weeks but I needed information at the weekend.  So on Sunday I sent him a text, because I need information about house contents insurance and the policy is still in his name.  Also my washing machine is playing up and I knew that H had a 3 month old machine in the flat garage from when I renovated the flat so asked if we could pick it up.  He replied that he has sold the machine so he could fit his (classic) car in the garage but that if I was desperate to do some washingI could get the keys from the Estate Agent (he was going away for the week) and use the machine in the flat.  I told him I appreciated the offer but that if or when my machine finally died I would sort something out. 

He was spending the day on Sunday watching S25 play cricket.  For those not familiar with cricket the ‘innings’ are long (hours!) so watching S25 play cricket was just that, sitting for 8 hours on his own (as he doesn’t know anyone at S25s new cricket club), he left at the end of the match for the airport to fly out on business for the week.  He text me on Monday night saying please use my machine if you need to, and that he would be back on Saturday and would come round to look at my machine to see if he could do anything (not sure looking at it would fix it!) or he could take me to buy a new one!  I had also asked that he let me have the ‘family’ drill, I need to hang new blinds though I didn’t tell him what I needed it for.  He text to say he had left the drill with S25 but if I waited until the weekend he could do whatever needed doing.  All this when I hadn’t heard anything for nearly 4 weeks and he hasn’t done anything around the house in 18 months.  Still don’t know when he will be moving nor do the boys but they don’t discuss it with him.

Thats all for now.  Going for a walk now, listening to Serial 2 (This american life) on podcast whilst walking.

Enyo
Feeling chilled at the moment and actually feeling quite detached, when I think about any difficult conversation I will need to have with H over the next few weeks (about finances and moving) I don’t feel anxious about it just determined to stay neutral and make sure I get what I want.    I do know that he needs to move away so that he can begin to realise that the fantasy life that he has mapped out in his head (though seems unable to put into practice) probably won’t make him happy and then hopefully he may begin to realise that I am not responsible or to blame for everything bad in his life and that after a while living in rented accommodation be may realise that home life wasn’t so bad after all.
He is still trying to reconnect with the boys and has even started texting the boy’s girlfriends asking them out to dinner with him and our sons (sons unaware of this), maybe he feels he needs help reconnecting.

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #51 on: April 26, 2017, 05:54:08 AM »
Your sounding really good Enyo.
I totally get the dog walking it's all I did
At the start of my journey.
Stay strong in those finance talks.

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #52 on: April 26, 2017, 06:30:40 AM »
Thanks for the update Enyo,  we worry when we don't see our members for a while.  it's good that you are not too dependent on the site but we start to wonder when we don't hear from each other.

Pleased to hear you are looking after yourself.  The medication definitely needed to be changed, you are not suppose to feel all groggy, although, I would have killed to have been able to SLEEP my way through this thing.  No such luck it :) .  H sounds a bit desperate, texting his sons girlfriends is probably not a very good idea.  The boys are liable to see such a gesture as going behind their backs and chatting up their girlfriends... lot's of room for confusion there.  Sadly you can't warn your MLCer after all, "you're the enemy, you would obviously be trying to set him up"!  Ugh!

I don' think it is possible to over walk a dog, heheheh.  Your decorating sounds great.  Hugs Stayed
Married 39yrs.
Reconciled July 5, 2006

"Don't be so open minded your brains fall out".  by Stephen A. Kallis, Jr.
"We believe marriage is sacred, but it is not our job to save marriages; it is our goal to empower each of you to save your own marriage."

Stayed Husband Letter
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
LBS SCRIPT

Offline No expectations

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #53 on: April 26, 2017, 06:51:39 AM »
Enyo,

My H actually has been in more conversations with my son's wife (DIL) then with anyone, at first.  I think he felt it was a safer way to try to re-connect, since she wasn't as truly "family"?  I do know that she is a very mature and caring young lady, and I was happy to know they were staying in touch, even before H and I would have any regular contact.  At least it was safer than him feeling that OW was the only person he could talk to.

Sounds like your house is coming along so well!  Isn't it a wonderful feeling, to make it "yours"!  I have been so happy with the things I've done here.

Take care!
Married 10 1/2 years, together 17.  BD 9/2016, 2nd BD 10/16.  H moved out 10/16.  2 AS's from my first M.  Me 55, H 49.  OW 23.

"And once the storm is over, you won't remember how you made it through; how you managed to survive.  You won't even be sure if the storm is really over.  But one thing is certain; when you come out of the storm, you won't be the same person that walked in...that's what this storm is all about."

"The trick is to enjoy life.  Don't wish away your days, waiting for better ones."

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #54 on: May 04, 2017, 08:06:24 AM »
H contacted me by text in the week again offering the use of the washing machine in the flat and reminding me that he would be willing to do any jobs around the house that needed doing!!!!  I was initially going to bat back this offer however S25 said he thought that as H had told him 3 or 4 times to remind me that he would do the jobs he thought that I should accept, so I did. 

H came round on Saturday afternoon and it took quite bit longer than expected to do the job so I am glad he came.  As he was there, with his drill, I also asked that he hang my washing line properly which he was happy to do.  This is the same washing line that he put up (badly) over 2 years ago and despite my asking numerous time before he left he never found time to fix it, I now have a outdoor washing line for the first time in 2 years.  He was also adamant that if there was anything at all that needed doing around the house then I was just to let him know and he would come and do it, I told him that I thought that I had everything in hand and he said 'You certainly seem to have'  8) – I haven’t been able to get him to even change a light bulb for over 2 years!!!!!

He was quite surprised at the amount of work I am having done around the house.  I would have really liked to have had it all finished before he saw it but still he went away knowing that I am not sitting around waiting for him but getting on and doing.  After he had finished the jobs I left him at the house talking to S24 and went to walk the dog, I asked if he would still be around when I got back but he said no as he had lots of washing and house work that needed doing, he couldn't help but notice that all my work was up to date (including the garden)  8), I said 'I would invite you to dinner but I'm not making it S24 is' S24 didn't invite him!!!.  H had given me a hug and a kiss when he arrived and as I was walking out with the dog he said 'Come here and give me a hug' :o he then reminded me again that if I wanted anything doing around the house I only had to ask.  I am not sure what all this means, maybe he is just checking that I am still where he left me, I’m not!, or maybe I it is just a touch and go.  He is definitely trying to reconnect with the boys, is this him trying to reconnect with the house?  Time will tell I suppose, for now no expectations.

Whilst we were talking (I made a point of not asking him anything) he said he was still waiting for the information on his pensions.  He said that he was away this coming weekend (he is going to staying with some very dear friends of ours, I am in touch with them regularly and have been to stay with them recently) but said we could get together the weekend after. At that point I said ‘You do know what that weekend is don’t you’ and he snapped back ‘Of course I do’.  It is our 35th Wedding anniversary.  I welled up a bit but pulled myself together very quickly and told him that I would be away on the Sunday and Monday of that weekend (our anniversary), but didn't yet have plans for the Saturday.  After that one angry retort he went back to being normal. 

So how did H look.  Well it is 5 weeks since I have seen he and quite frankly he looks like he has aged 5 years in that time!  He looked really tired but what shocked me more than anything was the amount of weight he has put on around his middle!!!  When this MLC thing started (over 2 years ago) he began to work really hard on his ‘six pack’ saying that he needed to make sure that he didn’t turn into a middle aged man with a big belly!  Unfortunately its not working now – also unfortunately for him I am still looking very trim after the LBS diet.  He took sons and their girlfriends out to dinner on Sunday, I don't get invited to these meals and it still feels like I am the only kid in class not invited to the party.  When they got home S25 said ‘It really is not a party that you would want to be invited to mum believe me, it is really strained and a very odd atmosphere’  When I asked what they talked about they said nothing really we don’t ask him anything because we are not interested, we only go because he is our dad and we love him but we don’t like him very much at the moment and he is very difficult to talk to.   They did say that he was looking really old, when I asked if they did feel sorry for what he was going through they said 'No, he is being an ar**h*l* and has brought it on himself', and I thought I had sold them on the MLC idea  :o

We still don’t know when (if) he is moving, he hasn’t mentioned anything to my or the boys and I looked at the estate agents website today and the flat is still listed.  Not sure what this means as the buyer was pushing to move in by the middle of May.  I’m sure we’ll find out sooner or later.

Well the good news is that my new carpets went down on Tuesday and my bedroom and the spare room are now fully functioning.  I am really pleased with the way they have turned out.  My bedroom looks great!

Enyo

Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online Mae

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #55 on: May 04, 2017, 10:46:36 AM »
Hi Enyo,

Joining your thread to say what a good update and that it looks like you are moving forward and making the house yours, the changes you have described sound great.

As I read your thread and the changes you and your sons have noticed in your H as he goes through his MLC......I think how similar our stories are. I have not read yet one thread where the LBS describes their MLC H as looking great, younger, happier etc....it's all the opposite, looking like a wreck, looking tired, looking like they have aged terribly, have put on weight etc etc. The internal dysfunction of the MCLer comes through externally as well.

BUT you are sounding good and obviously GALing. Yep their hugs are not an indication of anything future related, if we can understand that we can avoid trying to gaze into our crystal balls.
Me: 50
H: 40
S19, D15
Together for 19 years
BDay in 2004, 2011 and now March 5 2017
Ran away on 5 March BD
No OW
Returned home 'underdone' 1 July 2017.
Left again 22 October 2017.
H - Silent and non-communicative
Me - Letting go and moving forward

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #56 on: August 15, 2017, 04:13:01 AM »
It has been some time since I have updated my thread, in that time a not much has happened with our relationship but a lot has happened in our lives, we are moving forward.

H moved from our home town at the end of May and now lives in a rental flat 200 miles away near his family.  Before moving he started really trying to reconnect with the boys and this has continued since his move.  We have also been on more friendly terms, he now invites me out to dinner when he takes the boys out and we have also gone out for coffee, just the two of us, a couple of times, which has been pleasant.

In the ten weeks since he moved he has visited twice (three times including yesterday which I will write about later) and both times we have spent time together on a friendly basis. 

My approach is, and has been for the last 7 months, not to initiate contact but to respond when he contacts me.  I am friendly and approachable when we talk.  I never question him about his life, ie work, family (who have effectively cut me off) or social life but he does volunteer information about all of these and I do act interested though not prying.  I also do not volunteer information about my life but I do answer honestly when he asks.

I had 8 weeks off work during April and May and during this time I managed to find some ADs that didn’t make me feel exhausted.  I dropped out of life for this period, not wanting to talk to anyone but a few close friends and my sons.  I walked miles every day and somehow at the end of this time managed to somewhat get my head straight.  I still miss and love my H (well we have been married for 35 years) but I think that I have managed to detach enough so that I don’t get caught up in his drama and am able to get on with my life without (unduly) obsessing about what he is doing.  I will survive and be happy even if he doesn’t come back. 

I’ll post this then write about our meeting yesterday.

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #57 on: August 15, 2017, 05:00:20 AM »
Over this last weekend I have visited Rome and met with S25 and his girlfriend who are inter-railing around Europe.  We had a wonderful weekend.  I came home knowing that S24 was going to see H on Monday, staying overnight and spending the day together on Tuesday driving racing cars.

Unfortunately on Sunday morning H sent a text to S24 asking if he had received the rail tickets he had sent.  He followed this immediately with another text, to S24, that was obviously meant for a women.  S24 told H that he didn’t want to see him until H had come clean and admitted to me that he was seeing someone.  I got a text from H at lunch time yesterday asking if it was OK if he came up, I didn’t know what he wanted to discuss but S24 informed me of the text and even showed it to me.  Just before H arrived he called S24 and asked that he not to show me the text and S24 asked that I did let on that I had seen it, which I didn’t.

At BD I felt that he was having an EA with my ex training partner/married ex friend who for the 12 months or so before BD had started training with H, but I did not have any proof and H has always denied it.  I began to think that he just had a crush on her and it wasn’t reciprocated, and that the only alienators were work and exercising to extreme.

Well now the gas lighting has somewhat ended.  H admitted that he was seeing someone but I feel that he is still lying though I didn’t call him on it.  He said it was a women that he had met a fitness camp (within the last month) and they had just ‘clicked’ he had seen her a couple of times but not alone and always in a group.  I know this is a lie as the message in the text was obviously to someone that he had a close emotional relationship with, with ‘I’ll call for our usual goodnight beautiful’ lots of kisses and a ‘I love you’ at the end.  Definitely not a message to someone he had met twice and never been alone with.

I asked, cards on the table, were you having an affair with training partner at BD and he admitted that he was.  He claims it and EA and not PA but that it was reciprocated.  He says that they are no longer having this EA but that they do talk on the phone now and then.  I think, though I have no proof only my gut feeling, that the text message was meant for her and the EA (possibly physical) is still ongoing.  It may have stopped and restarted again over the last 18 months but I think that it is ongoing now.  She is still living with her husband and sons so I think that even if it is a PA they won’t get to see each other very often.  I don’t think that her husband is aware as he is not the type to let her stay if he knew. H saying that it is ended and not admitting to it continuing is probably adding a bit a spice the relationship as it is still illicit and secret, having the affair out in the open would shine some reality light on it and I don’t think it would stand up after that for very long.  Strangely this is like a weight being lifted off me; I now know that I can trust my instincts.

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline bvFTD

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #58 on: August 15, 2017, 07:59:47 PM »
Hello, Enyo:

Please look up a common neurogenerative disease that tends to strike people in their 40s to 60s, and decide whether you think your husband exhibits the signs and symptoms.

If you think he does, please take him to a neurologist at a university hospital.


Offline bvFTD

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #59 on: August 15, 2017, 08:15:47 PM »
The disease is called frontotemporal dementia, and it is common but under-recognized. Do not waste your time by taking your husband to a GP unless it's to get a referral to a neurologist or neuropsychiatrist. Forget going to marriage counselors. They have no idea what they're dealing with. Read up on frontotemporal dementia and make your move.


Offline Savoir Faire

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #60 on: August 16, 2017, 12:37:30 AM »
bvFTD, I understand that not all people described as MLCers actually are,  but most won't go near a doctor, psychotherapist or other medical professional so I don't know how you expect Enyo to get her H to a doctor or a University for assessment?

She can suggest but the likelihood of him co-operating is slim.  Dementia is obviously unlikely in a man of his age and will become apparent with time.  I understand people with dementia can become sexually uninhibited but actually starting an affair is less likely.

Most of us here would like a different diagnosis rather then MLC as we know it isn't 'curable' as such and we are going to be in for a long wait until their brain chemistry levels out. There are many online assessment tools for dementia which may help but in the long run, it's still a waiting game.
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #61 on: August 16, 2017, 01:03:10 AM »
Hi Enyo
Its really good to hear from you. I'm sorry to hear some of your news. But I totally get that feeling of being able to beleive and trusts your own instincts again. Isnt it wonderfull!! And I took it that it was a sign to show I was recovering and slowly climbing out of a big black hole. Still some sad time but without doubt you are getting there too.
Take care  DW

Offline bvFTD

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #62 on: August 16, 2017, 06:24:58 PM »
Savior Faire:

I have followed Enyo's sad story, but have noted she has 2 sons who love their mother and father and are wondering what is going on. A son said he realizes his dad has lost his sense of humor and also mentioned that dinners out at restaurants are odd and uncomfortable.

If Enyo is unable to convince her H to see a neurologis, perhaps her sons can.

Offline bvFTD

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #63 on: August 16, 2017, 06:30:45 PM »
And as I have already mentioned, dementia is common is people in their 40s to 60s, but the Alzheimer Association has become very powerful so everyone thinks dementia means memory loss in the old, not irrational, shocking, erratic and uncharacteristic behavior in the prime of life.

Offline Thunder

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #64 on: August 17, 2017, 05:20:58 AM »
Enyo,

I agree listen to your instincts, their usually right.  :)
With her permission, a quote from a recovered MLCer: 
From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did.

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #65 on: August 17, 2017, 06:01:37 AM »
Hi all, thank you for reading.

bvFTD, thanks for the comments.  I really don't think that H has dementia, he is acting in a typical MLC way.  That said there wouldn't be a cat in hells chance that I, or the boys, could get him to a doctor because 'there is nothing wrong with me!'.  Time will tell, he will either come out of this or not, I am just concentrating on getting on with my life.

Dogwalker, how are you?  I do keep up with you when post.  Did you manage to get up to the Lakes to walk?  The weather has been pretty dismal but I am sure you could have dodged the rain.

Journaling

When H visited on Monday as I said I was poised and confident.  We talked for about 4 hours, some relationship talk but he initiated.  Here are some of the things he said:

* I haven't been happy for years!  I told him that I understood that that was how he felt but I couldn't resist telling him that I didn't buy it and felt that he was rewriting history just to justify his behaviour.  I know this is not something I should have done but I did it in a non-confrontational way and I think got my point across.

* We talked about what happened over Christmas and into January, H said he was in a bad place at that time, he had not spent Christmas with us and on boxing day MIL was admitted into hospital and H spent all his spare time in January looking after FIL who is 91 and has Alzheimer’s.  I asked him about some of the subjects we had had text conversations about and he says he really can't remember any of it.  I asked, do you feel like you were in a bit of a fog he said yes I think so.  He also can't seem to remember a lot of things we did or said in the last 18 months ~ though what he does remember he remembers it in a very negative way towards me.

* He now seems to have stopped vilifying me and seems to be accepting that not everything bad in his life was down to me.  He says 'it is me (him) that has changed'.  He also now acknowledges that I didn't criticise or bad mouth him to our sons.

* He is desperate to reconnect and rebuild his relationship with the boys, though the weekend damaged what progress he had made.  He asked my advice on the best way to go about it, he thought that he would leave them alone and let them eventually come to him.  I did say, I couldn't advise him, but if it were me I would not walk again but I would keep plugging text and phone calls, he sulked and said but they don't text back, I let him know that they both love him very much but are very hurt and I felt that he should just persevere without judging them or blaming them and that they would eventually come round.  I honestly believe that, regardless of what happens between us, that H and our sons should try to have as good a relationship as they can.  He sat and cried on Monday and told me who much he missed having them around.  I, gently, told him that maybe this was one of the consequences for his decisions / actions.

* He was upset that I hadn't let him know that my Aunt had died (her funeral was yesterday), I said why would I? and he said 'Because its family', six months ago my contacting him about anything like this was pressure.  We talked about MIL, who is ill, she has heart failure, COPD and seems to be bleeding internally but the doctors can't seem to find were from, she is attending hospital for blood transfusions.  She now gets very breathless, due to the heart failure and needs a wheelchair when she leaves the apartment.  He asked my opinion on what I thought was going on and seemed happy, and comforted, with what I said.

He was obviously surprised by the way I reacted and responded to him, he gave me a hug and a kiss when he left and, strangely sent me a text when he got back to his flat at midnight.  This is what he wrote

Hi Enyo... Just back now and I hope your phone is on silent but wanted to say thank you for seeing me today and for the way you handled it.  I am truly sorry about the circumstances.  I will do my best to build my relationship with the boys properly as I know they must be very angry and upset with me and they have every right to be.  Hopefully S25 will accept me being there on the 1st and I can start from there.  All the best H.

Very corporate!  and still woo is me but at least recognising he is the cause of their upset, in the past he has told them just to get over it, this sort of thing happens all the time >:(  S25 arrives back from his European travels on the 1st and H was supposed to pick him and his girlfriend up from the airport on his way to the house.  S25 turns into S26 on the 4th and we were all going out as a family to celebrate on the 1st.  H felt that now he probably wouldn't be welcome (woo is me!) I said get over yourself! I don't have a problem with it and felt that he should come.  I even offered him the spare room to stay over in - I feel I am detaching well ::), don't think he will take me up on the offer as then he wouldn't have an opportunity to see OW!  S25 is due to play cricket all day Saturday 2nd, he moves into his new flat in Liverpool on the 3rd and starts on his two year Graduate Scheme on the 4th his birthday.  I will miss him but he is only moving an hour away.

My close friends and confidants now feel I should string H up by this parts but bizarrely enough I don't feel like that.  Knowing for certain about the OW has allowed a lot of things to fall into place and I feel calm.  I have been listening to Joe Beams podcast on limerance and have  found them to be quite comforting.  Joe maintains that when the affair ends (and most if not all do) that if I am still standing for my marriage I have to make sure that I am the better option, he calls it working on your PIES, you need to make sure you are Physically, Intellectually, Emotionally and Spiritual strong.  Basically work on yourself for yourself which is what everyone on here says, and it works, I have gone from H saying that I was needy at BD to him being surprised at how act around him.

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline Thunder

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #66 on: August 17, 2017, 06:35:58 AM »
It's funny, isn't it?  Once you know the truth and you don't have to wonder anymore, at least you can start to accept it.  Not like it, but accept it.

I think it's great that your H took some of the things you said in a good way.  Not the twisted way some of them do.
At least it shows you he trusts what you are saying, which means he trusts you.
Also it goes to show you what a thick fog they are in.  They can't remember a lot of things.

I hope he can repair his relationship with his kids.  It's so important.
With her permission, a quote from a recovered MLCer: 
From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did.

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #67 on: September 08, 2017, 06:10:46 AM »
Just Processing

Last weekend I spent a lot of time with H.  On Friday I met him as the airport to collect my S26 and his girlfriend after their 4-week European tour.  They have had an absolutely fabulous time, very envious!

After they landed H had 55 minutes to get S26 into the centre of the city so that S26 could sign they contract for his new flat.  Long story but the letting agent changed the goal posts whilst S26 was on holiday and they insisted that he attend the flat by 4.30pm on that Friday or he could not have access the accommodation for another week.  Flight didn’t actually arrive until 3.50pm so it was a mad dash, but they made it.  I took the girlfriend home.

We all (H, my, S26 and his girlfriend and S24 and his girlfriend) went out for a meal on Friday night and it was very pleasant.  The boys (and their girlfriends) really did not want to go as none of them wanted to be in H’s company after textgate, but me being there helped them to relax and enjoy the evening.

Saturday evening I made a meal but by the time it came to it only H, S26 and myself ate.  As soon as we had finished S26 left to join friends on an evening out.  H said he would leave too but after having a drink he stayed for another 2 hours.  We talked about his parents, both of us getting quite emotional.  It seems MIL is now extremely ill and H and his brothers have been told that she probably will not be here by Christmas.  Doctors have initiated a do not resuscitate instruction and tried to talk about preferred place of death with MIL but she told them to talk to her sons. 

H has effectively cut me off from his family, I haven’t see MIL or FIL for just over 12 months and as things stand I probably won’t get to see MIL again.  I let H know that this saddened me and he said things are difficult with ‘the situation’ as he calls our separation.  He told me that he and his brothers have already but a deposit down on a dementia care home for FIL (he’s nearly 92 and suffers from dementia) I shed a few tears at that because FIL (who is a lovely man) wouldn't last very long in a care home.

After these 2 hrs H left after hugging and kissing me.  Half an hour later he rang and his attitude had done a complete 180, he told me that he had bought S26 a ‘Welcome to your new home’ card and thought he ought to tell me as he didn’t want me accusing him of doing something to suck up to our son.  I calmly said ‘Thank you for letting me know, the card is a very thoughtful idea’  I also let him know that I wouldn’t judge anything he felt he needed to do with regards to our sons.

Sunday he arrived at the house just before midday, I had made a brunch for all 6 of us.  We (H, I, S26 and his girlfriend) were all going down to the new flat with our cars loaded up to help him move in.  H was very cold towards me, he didn’t even greet me when he arrived.  He then proceeded to micro-manage everyone and everything and seemed very stressed.  I just kept out of his way.  By the time we had unpacked the cars at the flat and H left I was glad, if not to see the back of him, but glad of the relief from the stress, it brought back how he had behaved for the 12 months before he left, I will never be going back to that!!!.  As he walked out of the door to drive home we all just sat on the sofa and said ‘Now breath!’

Now a number of things could have happened between him leaving me on Saturday night and him ringing me ½ hour later.  He may have met or had a conversation with OW, who planted hatred in his ear or he may simply have felt guilty and confused about having a nice time with me when he trying to convince himself he wants out of our marriage.

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #68 on: September 08, 2017, 07:05:03 AM »
OK.  Over last weekend nobody mentioned OW, the fact that H is living another life was just not acknowledged. 

I found out from S26's girlfriend that S26, whilst on holiday had spent 2 days in tears and extremely angry after ‘textgate’,  S26 now feels that he needs help coping and his girlfriend has got him to agree to look for some IC.  Both boys, and me, feel that H is still lying. 

OW is someone who was a close friend of mine.  Although she is 17 years younger than me but I was well able to keep up with her in the training stakes  8).  We ran together at least 3 times a week as well as attending early morning bootcamps, she also joined H and myself  at our personal training session and road races and events.  While out running we talked about all and everything, as you do with close friends, she often would reveal that her H frustrated her (he is an arrogant arse), he is 17 years older than her (my age - coming up to 59  ???) but is very rich, she often said how she wished that she had a marriage like mine as H and I always really got on, had a laugh toether, there never seemed to be any drama in our life and we enjoyed the same things.  She met her husband she was 19 and he was 36, they have been married around 22 years and have two sons aged 14 and 18.  Her H and my H also became friends but had a falling out just over 2 years ago (around the time that the affair started coincidently enough :o), also at this time she stopped replying to my calls.

H always gaslighted me about their relationship, we are just friends, you are over-reacting, etc etc.  Well at textgate H admitted that he had had an EA with her but insisted that it was over and that the text was to a new OW who he had just met and seen twice and then only in a group, the text (which he doesn’t know I have seen) indicates otherwise.  I have always felt that the affair with my ex-friend was still going on.

Well H has a very busy month coming up, Great North Run (1/2 marathon) this Sunday, I have a feeling that OW is also running in it but not confirmed, a 100 mile closed road cycle race, near where he lives, in two weeks, according to FB OW is definitely doing this, then another ½ marathon the week after.  Also to my knowledge H did a marathon (well he had to retire after 11 miles due to a sprained ankle) with OW in March.  And all the while she is still living in our town with her H and two sons, living the ‘perfect’ life.  She is playing at being wonder women, participating in lots of sports events and her husband, who in the past complained that she was away a lot is now singing her praises, taking her away for ‘romantic’ weekends, and in a recent post after a sponsored walk he wrote ‘Well done my wonderful, beautiful and fabulous wife, you are amazing’. Puke

I would never tell her H, even though I really don’t like him, I have always said I wouldn’t wish what I have gone through on my worst enemy.  Also I wouldn’t wish what my sons have gone through on her sons.  But how I wish I could shine a stream of reality light down on this affair.  I have fantasies about letting her know what I think and feel about her, it somehow feels worse that the OW in my case was a close friend and she used her knowledge of me and my marriage to get what she wants, but two years (or more) on she is still living the life, with her family, going on holiday etc with them whilst keeping my H on a lead for S**ts and giggles. 

I haven’t spoken to H about what I know (or feel I know) but he is denying he is still having an affair with her.  Do I just leave it be, pop the popcorn, sit back and watch to see what happens?  Do I actually need confirmation? What will I gain from it?  Think that my best policy is to carry on as I have been doing, doing my mirror work, learning to love myself (which I actually now do - I am a nice person ;)) and make sure that I am the ‘best option’ when all is said and done.  But I oh so want to ruin her life the way she (and my H) have ruined (not sure ruined is the right word but disrupted seems to mild) mine and my sons lives, and actually my H’s life, but I know that by doing that I would be ruining 3 other peoples lives and that would just not be fair. 

Feel so much calmer now I have written all this and got it off my chest (at least I have a chest, she was trying to get her H to pay for breast augmentation, I know TMI).

Thoughts?

Enyo x


Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #69 on: September 08, 2017, 07:31:28 AM »
Hi Enyo.
Im having a busy day so Just a quick note for now
With my W I know of at least 2 more OM and with the current one I would dream of doing all sorts to them. Id love to share with family and sons what iknow but havent, As I wouldnt want to be told Im bitter and twisted.
Now its not so bad for me but i still get moments of anger and have arguments in my head with both of them  and plans on what I could do. But so far they have stayed in my head and been part of my healing.
And Today I can still look myself in the mirror and say I have always taken the moral ground and any sleepless nights are not down to my own guilt or dealings. Which I am very gratefull for..
Vent it out on here and stay on the dignefield route is my advice.
Have a good weekend matey
DW

Offline Notinlimbo

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #70 on: December 10, 2017, 05:14:49 AM »
Hi enyo. I'm attaching as I find  your story similar in a few ways to mine. I also love Joe beam and the pies!  H`s EA/PA OW is also still with her H.
We even are the same ages!

I would definitely say pop the popcorn. Any mention of contacting her h would drive the whole thing further underground than it is. Let em at it. You don't want it to take any longer than it has to for him to realise she is not leaving her H. She is taking him for a ride. The longer it goes on the less chance of her leaving ....when the limerence starts wearing off.  ::)

I would like to think if I was in her shoes I would let the affair partner go. Wouldnt you?


I always tell myself that he is missing out not being with me. He is going to realise that eventually. Soundslike your H is peering out of the fog like mine .

Xxnot
Me 59
H 57
D 25
BD March 15
OW ex from 33 years ago PA

Offline Treasur

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #71 on: December 11, 2017, 05:09:06 AM »
Enyo - different situations but similar timescales. Two things jumped out at me. Your H could not be more MLC if he was wearing an MLC Hat. And you are extraordinary. If it's ok with you, I'm going to add you to my mental list of LBS Graceful Role Models.  :)
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #72 on: December 13, 2017, 05:08:42 AM »
Hi Not

Thanks for popping in.  You are right our stories are very similar, your BD was before mine but around the time of your BD I was aware that something was amiss but despite me repeatedly saying I wasn’t happy with our situation and could we discuss it all H would say was ‘Do we have to do this now’.  I think that his MLC was brewing for around 4 years (maybe MLT turned Crisis when he got his new job).  Around that time he got a tattoo (though very discrete!) starting weighing himself daily, started exercising to extreme, bought himself a classic sports car and was self-medicating on alcohol ~ how did I miss all that!!!!

Unlike you I haven’t had a lot of contact with H and even though this has allowed me to detach and heal I do find myself wishing there was more.  I really hope you are right in that he is peering out of the fog

Treasur

Thanks for your lovely comments believe me I do have my moments but I try to let these pass and never act on them as I feel that if I was to hold onto anger ultimately the only person that this would hurt is me.  I am fortunate that even though H was verbally very cruel at the beginning when we see each other or talk now I am very friendly (which he mirrors) and don’t let him bait me, this works for me.

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #73 on: December 13, 2017, 02:14:23 PM »
Journaling ~ Warning Long Post

It has been 3 months since I last updated my thread, and I haven’t seen H in that time, nor has S24 H has however visited S26 and taken him out to dinner once.

It was my birthday at the beginning of October and in the past we have always celebrated birthdays as a family, we celebrated mine this year without H.  I am not sure that this was a conscious decision but no one invited him.  H did send me a birthday card which read ‘Have a lovely day, Best Wishes H’.

The week after my birthday, having not heard from H in 6 weeks (I do not initiate contact) he called me, he said he had thought ‘long and hard’ about whether or not to call me on my birthday and whether calling would be the ‘right thing to do’ he apologised for not calling.  It seems important to him that he is seen to be ‘Doing the right thing’  He said he definitely didn’t think that us not keeping in touch or ‘catching up’ with each other was right and that we should talk more often, I agreed that that was a nice idea and said that I had enjoyed talking to him.  Well I don’t really talk I just tend to listen as he unloads, I don’t ask any questions about his life (social or otherwise), I definitely ask nothing about OW, he usually tells me all about his work (still very busy) his parents (still ticking along) and the rest of his family, I also do not tell him about my life or plans, if he asks something directly I will answer but I don’t offer up information.

I don’t check up on him in any way, I deactivated my Facebook account 4 months ago, as I see no point in shopping for hurt, and it only leads to me making assumptions and monkey braining, its more peaceful not knowing.

It was Hs birthday at the end of October and I sent him a card with my ‘Best Wishes’, He invited our sons down to his town for a meal with his family, it was FILs birthday two days before H’s, he was 92.  Both our sons refused, though I understand H told his family that they both had to work.  H spoke to S26 to ask why he wasn’t coming and S26 told him it was because he was very angry with him and didn’t want to go and play happy families and pretend that everything was OK.  I think H lost it a bit then, he turned on the emotional blackmail ‘Grandpa is very old and may not last much longer, I wouldn’t want you to do anything you would regret’!!, the conversation went on like this

H   ‘I am sick of this, you are all keeping me out of the loop, you don’t talk to me or tell me whats going on and you are all
         arranging things together and leaving me out (suspect this was with reference to my birthday weekend)
S26   ‘But dad you left, what else did you expect would happen!’
H   ‘I didn’t leave’
S26   ‘You moved to the other side of the country, that’s leaving’
H   ‘There are two sides to every story you know’
S26    ‘Well tell me your side then’
H   ‘I don’t want to burden you’!!!!!

The sad thing is that S26 said he would love to have seen Hs family but he couldn’t face his dad at the moment, S24 feels the same way.  Although the boys are both very hurt by the way H has behaved they are even more hurt by the way he has dismissed their feelings saying this sort of thing happens all the time you just need to get over it.  Since Textgate in August H has just left the issue hanging and not mentioned it to them again, they feel very betrayed and I feel that H needs to acknowledge their hurt and his part in that hurt.  In the mean time H is really trying to connect with them he is just going about it the wrong way (we all know that begging, crying and emotional blackmail doesn’t work).  I am very proud of my boys, they do send out truth darts but do so in a very calm way and they also try not to be too hurtful as they do it, they both still love him for the great dad he was.

H then managed to get S24 to speak to him he started by saying ‘Your brother said that I left but I didn’t’ to which S24 said ‘You kinda did dad’

The weekend after his birthday H sent S24 a long rambling text (sent late on a Saturday night ~ I suspect he had been drinking) the text went something like this

I didn’t leave you, that’s the Gods honest truth, I wouldn’t leave you.  You don’t know how I feel, I cry myself to sleep at night because I miss you so much.  Its nearly Christmas and I am really sad, I can’t go into any shops because they are all full of Christmas things and it upsets me too much.  (Still all about him!)

S24 replied.

Dad this was your choice so don’t try to make me feel sorry for you.

Since the phone call the week after my birthday H has called a few times and we have had text conversations.  He called to say he was worried about S24 as when he spoke to him he sounded depressed.  S24 has been very down recently as he has been having girlfriend trouble; he found out that his girlfriend of 5 years has been sending text messages to an OM ~ big trigger as far as S24 is concerned.  I didn’t discuss the reason for S24 depression with H, if S24 wants him to know he will tell him.  I did share with H that both are sons are struggling emotionally at the moment and both had asked me to arrange IC, H said it was a good idea and even offered to pay!  We did not discuss why they are struggling though.  During a conversation with S26  later that week H said he had also seen an IC, I don’t know when this was but hopefully this is a good sign.

In the absence of answers from our sons H text me saying he was thinking of coming up on Christmas Eve and taking the boys out for an early dinner and he said it would be great if you could join them.  He said, I understand if you all already have something planned but I just thought I’d ask.  I answered that yes we did already have plans, the boys and I (and the girlfriends) had a table booked for dinner on Christmas Eve (planning things without him again  ;)) he was, however, very welcome to join us, he has gratefully accepted.

He then rang me to check what I had bought the boys for Christmas and to volunteer to buy their usual ‘joke’ presents and chocolates.  He also doubled checked that I was truly OK with him joining us for dinner on Christmas Eve so told him I wouldn’t have you asked if I wasn’t.  He then proceeded to let me know how busy he is at work, he is travelling abroad every week for the last 4 weeks before Christmas he told me ‘All I seem to do is work and sleep and then look after dad’ then he insists ‘But it’s all good, it’s all good’ not sure who he is trying to convince. MIL is back in hospital so H had just spent the weekend looking after his 92 year old father who suffers from dementia.  I just said that I thought it was great that he had the opportunity to create some nice memories with his dad whilst he was still around and I was glad he was making the most of it, he agreed and said he was grateful that he got the chance to do it.

I received a Christmas card from H this week, I am not sure where his head is or why he felt the need to send it.  He had written inside 'To Enyo, I hope you have a wonderful Christmas and a happy 2018, Very best wishes H’.  He hasn’t put kisses on a message since last Christmas, in fact for the most of this year he hasn’t even put my name at the beginning of messages or not even signed them off with his initial or name.

Much to her surprise H also sent my mother a birthday card last week and a Christmas card to her and dad, strange really when he hasn’t spoken to them for nearly 2 years!!!!

So peeping out of the fog or just beginning to realise that there are consequences to his actions?

Enyo x
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Offline Treasur

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #74 on: December 13, 2017, 02:57:48 PM »
Maybe a bit of both? It was gracious of you to invite him along on Christmas Eve and I hope it goes well, and perhaps helps you boys a bit if nothing else. (in the spirit of hope without expectations  :))
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #75 on: December 14, 2017, 03:18:31 AM »
Hi Enyo
So good to hear an update from you my friend. Glad to read your boys are being supportive. Sound like peeping out of the fog and scarying himself a little. But Xmas eve shows he can also be brave. i hope it goes well for you and how you want it to go.

Take care  DW

Offline Notinlimbo

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #76 on: December 14, 2017, 03:50:06 AM »
Hi enyo
You sound like your going well. Boys have a bit of hurt to process. Here's hoping H is a bit more understanding. Your Christmas eve hopefully will go well. 'No expectations" but you sound like you have got that sorted.

Xxx not
Me 59
H 57
D 25
BD March 15
OW ex from 33 years ago PA

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #77 on: March 02, 2018, 03:50:51 PM »
[justify]Just updating my thread, I really wish I had done this more often but we live and learn.  This update will come in 5 or 6 parts.  Here’s the first two[/justify]
[justify]Part One[/justify]
[justify]Christmas – from talking to H at the end of Nov beginning of Dec, I didn’t hear anything until the 23rd Dec.  H had been very busy throughout December, working up to 100 hrs per week and travelling all over Europe and North Africa.  He arrived back in the UK on the evening of the 21st (Thursday).  Over the month of December H’s parents, particularly MIL who was the main carer FIL, had deteriorated and H and his brothers had taken the decision, with the full acceptance of MIL, to move them both into a care facility.  They had managed to get two adjoining rooms so that they didn’t need to be separated.  H and one of his brothers had a traumatic day on the 22nd moving them in.  FIL (92 and suffers from dementia) was very confused.  Consequently H had spent most of the 23rd at the Nursing Home trying to care FIL down.  BIL called my home (by mistake) and it was then that I found out about this, H had not bothered to call and let me know.  H then rang, guilty that I had found out from BIL, saying ‘I wasn’t keeping anything from you’, but he obviously he was.[/justify]
[justify]He came up on the 24th, when he arrived I was out walking the dog so he spent some time with our sons.  When I got home I left him and the boys to catch up, he obviously hasn’t travelled up to see me so I didn't feel the need to spend time pretending to entertain him as a visitor, I was very polite offered him more coffee, gave him some home-made soup and rolls and then I went about being busy and eventually settled in my den to enjoy and coffee and a read.  The boys felt very uneasy entertaining him without me and eventually the all came to find me, and sat with me to chat.[/justify]
[justify]We had a very nice meal out and shared Christmas presents before H left to go back.  I didn’t enquire how H was spending Christmas day but he did say he needed to work.  He had to do his washing and packing from the Thursday and was set to travel to Eastern Europe early on the 26th (for work); he was actively trying to change his flight so that he could travel on Christmas day, but wasn’t having much luck.  I suspect this was so that he didn’t have to stop long enough to wonder where his family was.  He arrived back at his flat at 1am on Christmas day, visited MIL and FIL over lunch, washed cloths and packed, had an early night as he had to be up at 3am on the 26th to catch his flight.  I would not say these are the actions of a happy man.[/justify]
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #78 on: March 02, 2018, 03:58:29 PM »
[justify]Part Two [/justify]
[justify]The next time I heard from H was lunchtime on Saturday the 13th January.  He rang to tell me that MIL had been taken into hospital and they had been warned that she would probably pass away within the next few hours.  He rang again at lunchtime the next day to let me know that she had just passed away, H was at her side.  He insisted that I do not tell the boys and that he would contact them individually to let them know.  How do you not tell them, they were both in the room with me when I took the phone call!  I then heard nothing at all from H but a couple of days later I did receive a phone call from SIL, first contact in over 12 months, the last contact I had was a text saying ‘Sorry it hasn’t worked out between you and H’.  She let me know how stressful things had been down there and said I was lucky to be out of the loop – tactful not!  I ended this call by asking if there was any news as to when the funeral would be.[/justify]
[justify]On the 18th I got a text from H, very business-like but he seemed miffed that I had asked SIL about the funeral arrangements.  He just text the date, and time and again said don’t tell the boys I will let them know.  I then had the dilemma of whether or not I would be welcome but as H’s mum had been my MIL for 36 years I really wanted to pay me last respects.  Our sons said that if decided not to go then they wouldn’t go either as they weren’t prepared to play happy families, they are not very close to my in-laws.  H rang that weekend and I let him know that I intended to come down with our sons and that I had booked hotel accommodation, he lives in a one bedroom flat so no room for the boys, though he did say he could put up a double blow up bed for them – these are adult men and both 6’ 3”, I tactfully said for £60 they would probably prefer a proper bed.[/justify]
[justify]We arrived the night before the funeral and H meet us at the hotel, he carried my bag to my room and came in to tell me about his mother and how FIL was coping.  I just let him know how sorry I was, and he was hugging himself, I said do you want a hug, and he immediately stood up saying no I’m good, its all good, I said OK but before I could change the subject H said ‘Go on then’ to the hug.  We all went out to dinner that night.  He invited us all to his flat for breakfast the next morning – I didn’t really want to go as I wasn’t interested in seeing where he was living, it feels like a trigger – but we went anyway.[/justify]
[justify]H’s flat is the basement of a Regency House in the spa town he lives in, the building was renovated last year and all the tenants moved in the same month as H, last June.  H’s flat is very nice but very very tiny.  After breakfast we all went out for a walk and coffee before going back to get changed.  I asked where the funeral was so I could set up my Satnav and H said ‘I’m driving we’re going as a family’.[/justify]
[justify]The funeral went off OK and it was nice to see all the family again, H’s brothers and their wives all asked individually, ‘What’s going on with H, he never says anything’ – how do you answer that one?  Both SIL’s asked if I would take him back I just said ‘I would like a chance to talk it out and get some answers’, they wouldn't understand about standing - to which they both said, if it were me he wouldn’t get back through the door, even to answer questions. [/justify]
[justify]After the wake we all went back to H’s to change to go home, over coffee H was telling me about some cycling events he was planning on doing this year, he mentioned on in September one in the Isle of Wight (a small island off the south coast of England) and I could help it and said ‘Oh that’s the day I fly to Bali on holiday’, his face was a picture and even though it felt good to say, that statement would come back to bite me![/justify]

[justify] [/justify]
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #79 on: March 02, 2018, 04:02:23 PM »
[justify]Part Three [/justify]
[justify]A bit of reflection before I continue the journal. [/justify]
[justify]At MILs funeral I realised that I felt absolutely nothing, that I was numb.  Before MLC came into my life if I had gone to a funeral I would struggled to fight back the tears no matter who it was who had died, I just found funerals sad.  At my MILs funeral I was just numb.  [/justify]

[justify]I had watched a Brene Brown Ted Talk (2010) on shame and vulnerability and in this talk she talks about numbing, and if you numb to stop yourself feeling the bad emotions then you also numb the good emotions like joy and happiness.  I realised that this is what I had been doing in order to cope and I have begun to realise that I no longer wanted to live this way, that I wanted to feel emotion again.  So I began to take down the wall that I had built around my heart and to my surprise the first emotion that I encountered was ANGER, absolute fizzing anger, and this was not something that I had felt through all of this.  Not anger that H had had an affair because intellectually I can understand how these things happen, I am not excusing it but intellectualising it - but anger that I had (still do) love my H unconditionally and wholeheartedly and that this man who I would have trusted with my life had betrayed me in the most traumatic way, and that I would never be able to love and trust that way ever again no matter who I had a relationship with.  I decided that as one of my goals, should H ever leave the tunnel, was to be able to sit down with him and get him to explain why he thought this had happened and I realised that this could not be possible unless I discharged this anger in a non-destructive way.  I found a new therapist, my old therapist was a lovely lady but I now need someone who would not just stroke my head and say there there, but someone who would question my thought processes and make me think – I think I may have found one, I saw her two days ago.[/justify]
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #80 on: March 02, 2018, 04:18:25 PM »
[justify]Part four [/justify]
[justify]S24 turned into S25 last weekend.  At the funeral H mentioned to him that he was planning on coming up to take him out to dinner.  Since H left he likes to celebrate the boys birthday as a family, none of us (me and the boys) enjoy this happy family facade, but do it to keep the peace.  Well I had heard nothing from H and the boys had both had very little contact. since the funeral 4 weeks before.  S26 normally has one duty phone a week from H and S25 just lets calls go to voicemail and text go unanswered. [/justify]
[justify]Both boys are having a bad time in their relationships, S26 has been with his girlfriend for 5 or 6 years but she is now saying that he doesn’t show emotion or shows he loves her, she has told him it is over, so he doesn’t contact her, she then panics and contacts him (pursuer and distancer?) but he says he feel numb.  He has however had the occasional bout of anger (very very unlike him and scary to see) and he asked that I find him a therapist – which I have and I think this is helping.  S25 found out that his girlfriend of 4+ years has been cheating on him, he keeps letting her back in (no judgement here) and then he finds out more of what she has been hiding, he is very down about this and says he can’t deal with H’s Cr@p.  H sent him a woo is me text saying why won’t you answer my text. [/justify]
[justify]Anyway neither I nor S26 had heard from H, S25 thought that H was coming up last Saturday but didn’t know what the plan was.  I spent the week getting more and more anxious and more and more angry, not a good mix.  I text H just to say that if he was planning to visit S25 over the weekend could he bring the large drill with him as I needed it for a job.  H replied that he was planning to come up on Saturday and had booked a table for us all at 7pm on Saturday.  I replied that I had plans on Saturday but hoped to be home in time to walk the dog in day light, that I didn’t know what the boys plans were but that he had a key and if noone was in to just make himself at home.  Well…….  On Friday I started with Norovirus which lasted into Saturday so I couldn’t leave the house on Saturday.  S26 was particularly stressed as (ex) girlfriend was leading him a merry dance and S25 found out on Friday evening that yet again his girlfriend had been lying to him about contact with OM.  So the stage was set!!!![/justify]
[justify]H arrived around 2.30pm, S26 had travelled to the other side of the country at (ex) girlfriends behest and S25 was sleeping having been awake all night after revelations about girlfriend and OM (we all know how that feels).  When H arrived the whole vibe in the house shifted, I knew instantly that he was spoiling for a fight and with my increased anxiety and emerging anger unfortunately he got one!  I am not sure how it started but very soon after H arrived he made a (very unjust) comment about my parents, who have loved him like a son for 35 years and I saw red.  H then pointed out how bitter and twisted I was and the fact I hadn’t moved on in 18 months!!!!, seriously untrue – he monstered and I really hadn’t seen monster for nearly 2 years.  H ended by saying I think I’ll just leave, nobody wants me here – he had only been in the house 20 minutes and it had taken him 4 hours to drive here.  I can’t remember what I said – probably something angry – he followed it with:[/justify]
[justify]‘I wasn’t going to mention this today but I want a divorce.  Why should I pay you any money so you can swan off to Bali.  I have spoken to a Lawyer and he thinks its ridiculous that you can afford to go to Bali on my money.  I do not have to give you anything my Lawyer says as long as you have enough money to survive, that’s all you need’[/justify]
[justify]12 months ago we came to a financial agreement.  We added both my salary and H’s salary, made allowances to each of us for all our bills in each home (it costs us more for H’s small flat where he lives two days a week than my family home).  We then split the remaining income and had 50% each.  He has as much disposable income as I do only I help our sons out financially when they need it. (Paying for therapy sessions etc)[/justify]
[justify]At this I left to walk my dog for an hour and fully expected him to have left when I returned but no.[/justify]
[justify]We then spoke again, this time more calmly.  I think H had just reached a time where the lies and deceit are killing him. Up until this point – and even earlier on Saturday afternoon – H blamed me wholly for all our problems, too controlling, too needed, bitter, angry – you get the picture.  Then suddenly he unloaded. [/justify]
[justify]Yes he had been having an affair with OW, my ex friend, yes the text of text gate was intended for her and now her husband had found out and her life was currently a mess of marital strife (my heart bleeds).  H said that when he put our flat, in our home town, up for sale (Jan 17), it was because he was ‘getting too close to her’ and he had to get away.  I asked if it was an EA or a PA, he just said looked at me and said ‘What do you think’.  I then said ‘So she has been down to see you’ and he said ‘No never’.  So if this was, at one time a PA, then that was happening between Sept 16 and Dec 16 when I was fighting like a lioness for my marriage (before I knew about MLC), Oh how they must have laughed. [/justify]
[justify]H then went on to say (and strangely this bit I believe), ‘She did all the perusing, but yes I enjoyed the attention’  He claims that he has ended it, and it had been over for a while (not sure how long) but that she continues to call and text him but he doesn’t answer.  I supose all it will take is for him to have one bad day and bang, its back on, though I thing laterly it was just a EA. [/justify]

[justify]I then had a mini meltdown, not about the affair but I told H honestly what he had done to me, how much he had hurt me, and what the trauma had cost me.  Well surprise surprise H apologised, said he was so so sorry for all the hurt he had caused me and our sons, and he would never forgive himself for what he had done.  That none of it was my fault.[/justify]
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #81 on: March 02, 2018, 04:26:19 PM »
[justify]Part five – The email from H [/justify]
[justify]He text me when he got back to his flat and I emailed be a short reply the day after, below is the reply I got to that email.  I haven’t sent any reply to this, I am not sure where to start, or really what to think - If in doubt do nothing and I think it is better to let him work things out again on his own. [/justify]
[justify]Hi Enyo [/justify]
[justify]Thank you so much for the note below, it must have been difficult to put together under the circumstances and you should be very proud for having written such a balanced, magnanimous and thoughtful reply, very few people could have, or would have done so.  In answer to your question, yes, it was the most difficult thing in the world to have to finally admit, but I’m sure it was twice as hard to have to listen to and for that and everything, I am truly sorry, your genuinely don’t deserve it…. [/justify]
[justify]Yet again you’re correct in that living with all of this (lies and deceit) for so long and not being brave enough, or man enough to tell you and the boys has slowly pulled me apart, but that’s my problem to deal with now and no-one else’s, and it’s something I’m going to have to live with for the rest of my life and truly, I wouldn’t wish that on my worst enemy…. [/justify]
[justify]You say that there is probably more to tell and hear, but truthfully, there isn’t.  However you should know that OW husband knows about everything as well, which is why I guess he has been so horrible to you.  I don’t blame him for his anger but wish he would have vented his anger at me and not you.  None of this is your fault and you shouldn’t have to suffer the consequences of my actions in your own town.  I only mention this so that you can walk through that town with your head held up high…. [/justify]
[justify]The reason I have asked to proceed with the divorce, isn’t for the reason you think it is.  I am not planning on moving in with anyone, but simply want to buy a place that’s big enough for me to hopefully, some time in the future, invite the boys to come and stay if they ever find it possible to forgive me enough to do so.  We both need financial security to move forwards and this is the only way to achieve it…[/justify]
[justify]I truly, truly wish you all the best and hope beyond anything and I mean this, that you find someone who will treat you better than I have.  Please don’t tar all men with the same brush there are a lot of very kind men in this world who, as you put it, are able to find happiness and joy in what they have and are not always seeking something else to gain fulfilment.  I guess I am not one of those people and that is, for sure, not a good thing or anything to be proud of. You said yesterday ‘Can you just look me in the eyes’ the truth is, I find it very hard to even look in the mirror right now, as I don’t like what I see looking back at me!!! [/justify]
[justify]Your thoughts on what I should do right now, are simply too kind.  But yes, I am seriously thinking of taking sometime off.  Problem is that in my line of work, sabbaticals are not an option, so I might have to reconsider my future plans completely, but right now, I’m seriously considering it, because as you said, life is getting shorter all the time. [/justify]
[justify]Anyhow, I’m sorry for the late reply, but this has taken all day to write and I’m still not sure if it’s good enough, so I will close by saying again, how truly sorry I am and that’s the truth.  I am simply not worthy of your graciousness and most certainly not worthy of my children and I will not ask them to forgive me.  I will just pray that in time things will heal enough for them to accept me as someone who loves them more than life itself and let me back into their lives.[/justify]
[justify]I want to close in the same way as you did, by saying ‘your friend’.  Simple truth is, I don’t deserve to be, but hope we can be eventually?[/justify]
[justify]Enjoy Bali, if anyone deserves it, you do and I hope you have the most wonderful time.[/justify]
[justify]Take care and remember that I am here if you need anything[/justify]
[justify]All the best[/justify]
[justify]H [/justify]


[justify]Any thought?[/justify]


[justify]Enyo xxx[/justify]

[justify] [/justify]
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online EnyoTopic starter

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #82 on: March 03, 2018, 04:50:09 AM »
So my thoughts on divorce  :-[

I am not 100% convinced that H has actually seen a solicitor about a divorce.  The way he stated (when he monstering on Saturday) what I would be entitled to finance wise followed by 'Why should I have to pay for your trips to Bali', makes me think that he is extremely unhappy that I am actually moving forward with my life without and and that he has been complaining to his new friend (who I have never met) who lives in the same building as H.  This man and his wife moved in the same week as H and within 8 weeks he and his wife had had a bust up (literally, they both ended up in police cells for the night - classy ::)), and then the wife walked out.  They are now getting divorced.  This is a second marriage for both of them and they have been married for less than 4 years!  So as I said it feels like H has been getting barrack room lawyer advise from this man, rather than an actual solicitor.  However just in case I am wrong I have an appointment with a solicitor next week - more about this later.

When H brought up the subject of divorce (he can't move on it for another 6 months and I really don't think he will go for unreasonable behaviour as this argument wouldn't hold water - see email above), I just said well this would be your divorce and whilst I would not argue with you about it I would not help you achieve it either. 

At the moment we both have a good standard of living, money wise, but getting divorced would mean that I would have to sell the family home.  I fully intend to do this when I retire in 2 or 3 years as I want to settle in a rural area close to my family, about 40 miles away.  Selling the house now would mean that I would either have to move twice in the next few years with all the resultant cost or move once and commute back to work until I retire, which would add around 2 hours onto my working day.  Also I have one of the boys living with me, he also works for me and has recently reduced his working hours to 30 per week and started studying part time for a second degree so me moving and commuting to my work is not an option as he could not afford the commute or the time (the additional 2 hours per day), so it really is not good timing for me.  Also moving house and getting a divorce are two of the most stressful things that you can do and having only just got my feet back under me after BD I really would like some time to just breath before the next onslaught.  I was going to email H and ask for a two year pause before proceeding, but have decided not to ever mention the divorce again until he brings it up and at that stage I will state my case.

For me divorce is not just a financial settlement, sign on the line thing but a deconstruction of a live together, and unless we are both on stable ground emotionally, which means that we both have done the work, it won't end well.

I actually don't think H is in a good position (mentally or emotionally) to start proceedings, stressful job, marriage breakdown, affair breakdown(?), death of mother, and I suspect (even though I have never done it) that divorce would take energy that I don't think he has as the moment.  His email showed that he didn't know what direction he wants his life to take at the moment so the reason of wanting to settle down doesn't hold true.

My solicitor  ???, well having never been around divorce or really known anyone who has gone through it I was unsure who to get advise from.  A colleague had a friend who had just divorced and and used a 'sh1t hot solicitor' who was really good, this solicitor is based in my town.  So I rang and made an appointment  and the sh1t hot solicitor answered her own phone as her assistant was out and OMG I know her.  She is a friend of OW and when I gave my name she said, 'I know you, you are a good friend of OW.
What - you're getting divorced, why'  I explained that I did not want a divorce but might be pushed into it so I wanted to be prepared and no I was no longer a friend of the OW as she was the reason I maybe getting divorced.

Solicitor assured them that she could definitely represent me and would do a good job for me (she has a fearsome reputation). She said that she has her business and livelihood to protect and confidentiality was something she would never break (the OW would never know that she was representing me let alone any of the details).  She also said that all her work comes in by recommendation and she would never jeopardise that.

Well we had a bit of a talk, she said she can't understand why we would divorce, that it didn't seem that long ago that we were all a function together and that H and I would a lovely couple  :-\.  She went on to tell me that OW had spoken to her recently, and that she is having trouble in her marriage (sad  ;)), she said that OW had told her that she really loved her husband (by the way OW's husband and my H both have the same name) but that he had been cheating on her and she was deciding what to do next, she is considering within the next two years moving back to Australia (where she spent her teenage years - sorry Australia!) so that her youngest son could go to university there.   Maybe her relationship with my H was a tit or tat thing, maybe my H is supporting her in her bad times - he does have a KISA syndrome and had obviously found his damsel in distress.  So it seems out of us two couples I turned out to be the collateral damage!

About 3 weeks ago, one Saturday morning, I met friends for coffee in town.  My friends got there before me and were already sat at a table when I arrived.  Unfortunately on the next table was OW and her husband.  I completely ignored them and within minutes they both paid and (the only way I can describe what they did was ) 'scuttled' out like to little cockroaches.  My friends hadn't recognised them and in fact if I hadn't known them so well I may have missed them, OW looked at least 10 years older than her age and her husband looked really warn down (no sympathy here though), add to this my H who admits to being 'deeply depressed' since he moved away, I think that out of the 4 of us and me being the only one who didn't have a choice of what has been going on, who was forced to do the work on myself and move forward with my life, is the only one who seems to have found a way through this. 

Enyo xxx

 
Me 59
MLCer 57
M35 years, Together 37 years
S26 & S25
BD1 Dec 15 - you've been a wonderful wife and mother but it's not enough!
BD2 - 8/21/16 - Moved out into our rental flat locally,
Feb 17 - Unhappy, need to move and start a new life with new friends
May 17 - Moved to his parents home town 200 miles away
Emotional (has bee physical) affair with my ex married friend continuing - since around summer of 2015

Online Mitzpah

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #83 on: March 03, 2018, 05:06:03 AM »
Enyo,

You are sounding good and obviously have your head screwed on in the right way ;D

Like you, I have had a very long marriage and BD  (and subsequent divorce) was a real shock to me and all who knew us :(

I just wanted to say that what your h. wrote echoes very similarly to what my h. said. He also said it was him and that I needed to move on and find someone better than him. In our case, he has continued on with ow, he lived with her and her children for over four years, he now lives alone in a small apartment loaned to him by a close friend of my SIL. I don't know how long that can go on ??? He is still in a relationship with ow and seems to think that I am the difficult one as I refuse to share family occasions with her. Maybe I am just old fashioned...

He seems to be following the script closely, so I would just carry on as you have, making decisions when you have to - if not, just let things flow. My h. took over four years to be able to divorce me, threatened a whole lot of things that I can't even remember now, that never came to pass. I don't like being divorced but it is what it is and I find that life goes on and God has taken good care of me and my three children!

M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline dogwalker

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #84 on: March 06, 2018, 06:18:19 AM »
Hi Enyo. Just catching up and you are sounding sooooooo good.And Its clear you have been working on yourself and thinking things thro. Its funny how deatchments things get cleared and and time goes by(Yes time is now my friend and I quite enjoy time on my own) we begin to heal, plan and move forward. slowly at first It maybe not what we thought or really ever wanted  but its the cards we have been given and we make the best of it all. I am so pleased to read and hear how well your doing. DW

Offline Savoir Faire

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Re: Just jumping on this rollercoaster! Long journey ahead I think
« Reply #85 on: March 13, 2018, 07:09:07 PM »
Hi Enjo, you sound so good on paper, I bet the emotional roller coaster is not easy though.

A word of warning about your solicitor - my first one ended up being a guy m y H went to school with and H said it was a conflict of interest to have him represent me, so after paying a sizable sum to get 1st solicitor to do the groundwork, I had to change lawyers.  It's a long shot in your case but just warning that if things get nasty and they often do, that your H might complain about your lawyer.  If the OW is still around she will find out who your lawyer is as they send copious amounts of paperwork, she'd be blind not to see some of it.

It's good to have the financials sorted rather than proceeding to divorce.  I would a have preferred to take this road but H had other ideas ::)  He had to get rid of me to be happy :o
"And when they ask you about me and you find yourself thinking back on all of our memories,
I hope you ache in regret as the truth hits you like a bullet and you find yourself replying: ""She loved me more than anyone else in the entire world and I tried to destroy her."  He failed by the way. 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8412(Denjef's thread)

 

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