Author Topic: My Story Standing on a path I didn't plan...  (Read 7066 times)

Offline MaraTopic starter

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My Story Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« on: May 14, 2017, 12:28:22 PM »
Hi all :)

This is my new thread.
Welcome to follow me, and support me with your wise comments and experiences.

Links to my other threads are
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=7949.msg589000#msg589000
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=7327.0
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=6605.0
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=6408.0
Still standing on this path....doing better, being wiser, and still totally committed to standing for my marriage, husband and family.

Mara <3
« Last Edit: May 14, 2017, 12:31:22 PM by Mara »
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #1 on: May 14, 2017, 12:47:11 PM »
Continuing on with you on your journey.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2017, 04:52:06 AM »
I am here too  :)
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #3 on: May 15, 2017, 05:54:35 AM »
Yes OR and Mitzpah! Welcome :)
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2017, 05:59:03 AM »
And me...  I agree with your title, a path I didn't plan, it's spot on...

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2017, 05:25:04 AM »
Nice to see you here T&L

Meanwhile:
I'm dealing with lot of things in my head.
The coming weeks there will be some events of the kids where I and H are invited,but also other family.
Today number one. Son15 has a concert with his trumpetclass.It is the examination for this schoolyear too.

Son did not invite his father, but in the court was decided, I have to give H all chances to let him be part of kids lives.So I sent him an email so now and then to let him know about their activitities.

I feel tensed about being there where h and also my parents will be.
I don t know why, but my allways thinking to fix the tension problem is coming up again. I can not....
And I know, H will let the tension exist, my mother will wisely keep her distance, but I am not at all sure about my dad (he s not happy with h behavior towards me) and I will feel bad.
Son15 was not amused his father is coming.

well so we have some more events and it makes me laying awake during the night.

I think my biggest problem is the two dominant men in my life, my h and my father, who both are there and will not give in. My father will behave himself,I believe so...
He is a Christian man and a pastor, but hey, he s also a father and grandfather seeing the crisis in my h having destructive consequence on his daughter and grandchildren.

So this is what I struggle with....
I am standing for my marriage, but in lot of things dependant om my parents help.Here is my twist.

Well....I cannot fix it...

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2017, 12:07:19 AM »
Wow, I m so cycling down lately.

H did not even show up on the concert of his son. In a way it made it easier for me, but I felt such anger inside of me.

He did tell in court, he wants to be part of their lives. he s not doing any any effort to contact d17 and s15. I have to tell him every thing about schoolexams, concerts, sportgames...
I do that, also giving him chances to be involved or to get started to be involved.
And he s not even coming. Not even changing his program for seeing his son, supporting him on this big event in his life.
He s just not taking any of us seriously, but blaming me for not doing that.

S15 said to me: I did not miss him, and I do not want him in my life. He s not interested.
Wow, how this hurted me to see this.
FOr h, but also for s15. But I can not blame s15 for protecting himself.

And besides that, the tension I have to deal with, if he is coming or not.... It makes not feeling very good.

Last weeks I m really fighting depression. Not sleeping well, not eating well, working too hard for only just enough money to survive.
Fighting with thoughts of giving up standing.
I am so so tired.
My job helps me in a way, but working in therapy and social work, is also confrontating. Most of the time it distracts me from my own pain, but last week I m confrontated that maybe this is too much for me.
And I m not a quitter....this is why my marriage with h, who was suffering a psychiatric desease from the beginning, last for so long. I simply do not quit. I just go on and make things work.... In my own therapy that has been an issue for a while. I am afraid to let things happen...to let them fall down just like that,,,so other people can see their responsibilities. H never had the responsibility to solve anything, because I always backed it up. In my job people can go on like they want, because I always fill in every empty space, I always make it work....
I am so tired.

First things first. My h can not be my priority now . My kids are. Especially because H is not here too. So me being a single parent  having the both two roles to handle, doing two jobs .... I think that s enough.
I leave h where he choose to be. I can t do any different.

I pray for him daily as I feel I continue to love him. But I also feel other feelings. I think I m finally getting very angry over everything.... I can not really understand why I was not before. It makes no sense showing it to a MLCer. But I have to let it come out. Because I will not survive myself if I don t.
I know myself, my H will not know this.... because even if there was a chance I see or hear him today, I would not let him know I m angry.
What s wrong with me?

I m sorry, this is all spinning in my head, keeping me off my sleep.

But I know God is with me, helping me on my feet again.
My kids are a challenge to me, going through puberty but also being more open to me then ever. I feel this is a gift God is given. The four of us are stronger together then ever.

Thanks for letting me ventilate.


Have to prepare for work. We had a storm last night after a few hot days. So I look forward now to bike to work and feel the wind in my head.

Mara <3
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2017, 01:39:25 AM »
Keep venting, Mara, we all need to.

I will write more later, just wanted you to know that I'm reading long, and that I get it.

Having them blame us when we know we have behaved blamelessly is horrible.  And being angry about it is OK -- I agree, little point showing it to the MLCer for the most part, but we do need to get it out. 

xx

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2017, 04:28:53 PM »
I'm so sorry he is continuing to let you all down Mara. This is sadly exactly what all MLCers seem to do.
Demand the earth and then blame us when they fail in their responsibilities. 
MLC and MLCers tend to make zero sense.

You have been amazingly patient with him and your family's rock.
A bit of anger is timely.
XX

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2017, 10:51:12 AM »
Went to church this morning where afterwards someone asked how I m feeling lately.
Wow, this was the wrong question, tears coming out and not stopping at all....

Now, a few hours later, I feel it relieved me a lot.

It has to come, these tears, only rather not on public places  ???

I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline xyzcf

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2017, 12:15:56 PM »
Dear Mara,

I just wanted to drop by and say hello and tell you that I very often cry at church..I used to cry all the time...and now, it is not very common...but at mass...and I have been told to do so...for what better place for Christ to hear our prayers and see our tears than kneeling in prayer.

My husband and I always attend mass together and so I think that is part of why it is hard for me to be there without him, and surrounded by many families who are not broken like ours. But I have come to know my church community very well, and many many people are shouldering some kind of suffering.

I also read back a bit on your thread where you were asking about waking up and thinking about your husband and the thoughts of him that cross your mind throughout the day. Strange isn't it, that we cannot turn these thoughts off....But I too, have thought about him every single day and throughout the day for many, many years. I know others as well so for whatever reason, this is "normal" for some of us.

Standing for a marriage and family is hard...so very very hard..thus, sometimes the tears have to flow and if in public, so be it. I have discovered that people really do care about me, and sometimes they need to know when I am having problems or a bad day....I believe that God places these people in my life for a reason and always at just the right time.

May you find some peace on this Sunday!
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/site-map.html
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #11 on: May 22, 2017, 01:40:35 PM »
Thank you xyzcf

I agree there is no better place then church to let the tears come out. I prefer not to draw attention towards me though...
My church is also this place where we came together, where we were married. I never said anything negative about my husband there, because I pray the doors will stay open for him to return.
An elderly lady told me recently that she s praying for my h everyday. I know there are more.

Feeling better today

Crying helps

Mara  x
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline xyzcf

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #12 on: May 22, 2017, 04:48:42 PM »
I am glad that you are feeling better. I seem to still have trouble on the weekends, I have many activities during the week, but not so much on weekends..and I miss the way we used to live.

I have tremendous friends at my church who totally understand, including one wonderful woman whose husband was gone for 18 years..and they celebrated their 50th wedding anniversary last year. She gets it though, she knows the pain, and even the pain still and is always available for a cup of tea or lunch.....

I know that many people pray for me and for my husband.

I know that God loves him immensely and His ways are not mine.

Have a nice week.
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see" Hebrews 11:1

"You enrich my life and are a source of joy and consolation to me. But if I lose you, I will not, I must not spend the rest of my life in unhappiness."

" The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it". Flannery O'Connor

http://www.midlifecrisismarriageadvocate.com/site-map.html
The Hero's Spouse Mission Statement
Survival Instructions for Newbies
The Mentor Program
Report Technical Problems

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #13 on: May 30, 2017, 08:37:15 AM »
I am having a new courtmeeting tomorrow. About the finances and the holidays for the kids.
I am feeling a bit weary.
Just the thought I have to go to court to talk about these things? What happened to us.....
I never loved anyone so very much as my h, and I would never do something that would hurt him. And what he does? Treating me like some who is not to trust, I feel like a criminal....
I am sorry, although I am doing pretty ok, this evening tears are falling down.... Facing my h in court....and not in my house, in my bedroom, in our dreams together....
It is just too hard.


I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #14 on: May 30, 2017, 08:49:16 AM »
Mara,

None of this is easy. Lean on the Lord for He is your strength.

Thinking of you as you go through this difficult time.

You are not unstrustworthy or a criminal - you are strong woman who is fighting for her family, for what is fair - stand tall and know that you are supported by your many friends here  :)

xxxx
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline Shining Star

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2017, 11:42:12 AM »
Mara:  None of any of this is easy.  It is incredibly painful and nothing most of us ever expected to happen.  We lived with the partners we loved and they were our best friends.  In the end, they lied, cheated, and we became the enemy.  I am also having an extremely difficult past few days, so sending you a hug!
H:56, I am 54
BD: March 2014, Left Sept 2014, Back Nov 2014
Left again in February 2015.  Asked for D on 9/22/15
Said he was "sure" he wanted a D in Dec 2015; 
Admitted long term affair - May 14, 2017 - says he is in love with the "symptom" but wants to build a relationship with me with "clear expectations" WHATEVER THAT MEANS!  Settlement Agreement signed 9/20/17.
Divorce final 3/14/18.
NC - by choice - 1/2018

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2017, 01:39:59 PM »
Hello Mara, I remember the weariness of having to go through all the legal steps that I never wanted to have to take.  Hang in there!

I'm also a crier at Church.  The other places are my car and the shower.  Tears are a release, and it's okay to cry.  Up until recently, not a day went by that I didn't cry, at least once.  Now lately, I've noticed that the tears are not every day, but a few days go by without tears.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2017, 11:08:38 PM »
Sending you all my thoughts and prayers, Mara.  There is no easy way to do this.

Crying is OK, I will admit that I still do it, even after a long time.  it is a release, it keeps things from building up in ourselves. 

It might help to just have one clear goal in mind for the day, and to focus on just that, rather than on the whole mess.  And remember that YOU are the one standing up for what is right, you haven't done anything wrong against your H.  Even if you aren't perfect, no one is. 

Thinking of you..

xx

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2017, 01:13:42 PM »
dear all of you , T&L, Mitzpah, FW, SS and other followers

Thank you for all the prayers, hugs and words.
It helps you understand me.

@Faithwalker It is true, tears are a release.... They help me.... today I did not cry... I had some tears, but I know I am starting to get stronger.

@Shining Star...Really, the one I almost trusted the most, I can not trust now.


The MLC part of this is almost not to explain to others.

How was my day in court.
If I were a journalist watching the show to make a report I would rather have been thinking: What is happening here?

The mediation judge ( I don t know all this terms in English, but this is not a judge who makes decisions but she s helping us coming out of some agreements together, we both have a lawyer involved too).
started the thing with the childrensholidays. Actually h had asked we split up every holiday in two and so the kids stay with him 50% during schoolholidays.
Today we should discuss that, because my kids are not willing to.
But H started before anyone could say something: I do not want the kids more than max. once in fourteen days.
THe judge looked at him, with a face as...'whats wrong with you?' He then said he s sick, he s depressed and has no energy for that.
I have agreed, but in my heart I felt pain...for him and the kids.
At first he s making a bombdrop again in the house by these demanding through court to see the kids, who were never kept away from him anyway...and we go through this for months...and now he s saying the opposite.
Besides he s not even asking if I am having enough energy to be a full time double parent all in my own... nobody asks me... I just do it.... I love my kids, I want them to have a normal as possible life even if it s costing me all of my energy.
So yes, thank you h, for the past few months driving us crazy to now just conclude you do not want another settlement then we already had... even less than that.

The second thing was a bit harder. I asked the judge that I did not want the company on my address. H got angry and asked why. I said: because you are not working. There is no money coming in, and I get letters from lawyers and I do not know who for the company. I save them for you, but I m not sure there are no problems. if there are debts, what will happen. They can come to my house, my income, the kids belongings.
He waved it away, but forgetting he was sitting in between of two lawyers and a judge. These three said my concern is fair. And if there are debts, I can be hold responsible. He started to deny that....in front of people who sleep with the law..... It was almost ridicoulous but so sad. The judge asked him about the company. He said he has no debts. She said the bookkeeper should make an attest where he says there is no risk for the company nor for me. If so he can keep the company on my address.
He stayed angry here, and especially my lawyer got a dirty look of him.

THe financial agreements for the kids were more easy. As long as he has his insurance-money he has 3000 euro so he s ordered to pay some for the kids. Here he said : OK, but then I want half of the rent of the room Mara is renting out in our house. Stupid from him, because the judge took the half of it from my income then and so he have to pay more childsupport through that. So now he needs to pay me almost 700 euro childsupport and I need to pay him 175 euro rent back. If not for the rent, he had to pay me 175 euro less.... He insisted on doing it this way. The lawyers and the judge started to see there was no use talking sense into him.... So...ok...

The insurance money he gets is temporary. And I m not sure if he s very motivated to find a job after this. He s saying he s depressed and sick (something he never would admit during our marriage when he suffered some severe depressions). I felt like he was using this now, playing the victim.

The divorce is delayed to september. They wanted to do this on the day in june our d17 is graduating from highschool. I asked for his empathy on this. This must be a festive day for her, not the day of her parents divorce. He admitted that, to my wonder. THe first date after was only in september (summerreces in court).

So, I m going to still be married for some months. I pray things will change before, but with my human eyes I can see he s still deep in MLC.

When leaving court he suddenly was friendly towards me, saying bye. And looking me in the eye .

I was really amazed....Is he really not seeing how he s losing things, losing his children by his own actions? Is he not seeing how the people in court, even his own lawyer by times were looking at him with faces like: Are you serious?

My heart cried when biking home. Yes, Right happened towards me....but my love for him made me cry about him.

Is this ever going to change? He s not happy, he s not having a better life but a worse life....
I feel so so sorry for him.
And I felt ashamed also.

The judge said after the session; I wish you both good luck. She saw I got tears in my eyes. She was so nice.
But she stayed of course neutral.

I told the kids....
D17 : what....he really does not have enough energy to see us once in a while?
S15: I don t mind ....(he does , I know)
S10: Poor dad, he s so alone
ME: I know guys.... We can only pray for him, and love him despite of everything.

This was my day.

Thanks again for all support here. You are right Mitzpah.... I have my friends here who understand

Hugs
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2017, 03:07:06 PM »
Wow, some good things but very tough too.  (((HUGS))) Mara.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline Puzzled

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2017, 08:18:44 PM »
Hi Mara,
It is so sad to see in what internal state your spouse is.  And, yes, he seems to be very depressed and thus selfish, not thinking about what you are going through raising three children on your own.
Sending good thoughts your way,
Puzzled
Me: 46 (43 at BD1)
H: 52 (48 at BD1)
D: 10 (6 at BD1)
Met in 1995, married since 2000
BD 1: August 2014
BD 2: October 2015, moved abroad

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2017, 10:39:26 PM »
A person in crisis is not capable of being responsible for anything much, despite their protestations otherwise. 
I used to enormously resent having to be responsible for everything that my MLCer walked away from.  And then someone said to me that I had a choice.  I could do the same and walk away.  I argued that that wasn't a choice I could make.  And they said well then.  You are choosing what you need to do. 
I fought with this reality for a long time, but I now understand. 
Thank goodness we can be our children's rock during this time.  They will never forget it Mara. They know who they can 100% rely on. 

The flip flop is MLC typical. 
As confounding as this all is, I am very glad that the lawyers and judge got to witness this from him.

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2017, 11:23:39 PM »
Hi, Mara,

It sounds like you did superbly well -- kikki is right, your kids will forever remember that you are their rock.

Regarding your H's admitting to depression, I am glad that the court saw the truth.  It doesn't excuse him, not in any way at all, it does show them that you are being the responsible one.  And it is one less lie. 

And what you said to your children was spot on. 

None of this is fair on us, but kikki is right, we choose to be the ones our children can rely on.  And that is worth gold.

x

xx

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #23 on: June 02, 2017, 07:55:16 AM »
Thank you for all the responses.
After Wednesday I know again and for sure my h is suffering MLC. I have been thinking a lot about what happened, just that one hour in court and thinking.... you can never be prepared for this.
I was armed with lot of arguments for the kids to lower his demand on the 50% split up during holidays...and he...just asked for practically nothing, no He asked, please keep them with you I have no energy...

I now am glad this was before court, because it is on paper there. This Flip flop as you call it Kiki is so real. Next week he can say he never said this...

Yes Kikki, I have a choice, to walk out too....
I once said to h, you know what, I walk away too...then what..
He said: I know you will never do that.
True...it is no option. I would not be able to live with myself> My kids deserve to be happy and loved.

Next sunday my D17 is doing confirmation in our church. Her father is not coming. Also my MIL is not coming although she really wants to. She s not understanding what is happening with her son (my h) and said to us she s worried if she comes to something of us, he will get more depressed.
I am over that question. It will happen anyway...
It s just sad for D and MIL they can not join this together because of h s MLC.
D is not reacting the same way. She s understanding but also putting the responsibility of things on the right place. She said to me: Dad has no right to keep people in this kind of jail this way. And Dad knows he can not get me in there. If he s sick, depressed, as he said in court, he has to go see a doctor.

It was said here too, the depression is making him selfish... and that s not fair.

I am not contacting my inlaws to persuade them to come. It was my D s idea and she has the right. Of course.

Thanks for all the hugs again.
Feeling it!

Hugs to all of you
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #24 on: June 03, 2017, 12:02:15 PM »
This evening I m feeling very very down.... :'(
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline bluerose

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #25 on: June 03, 2017, 01:35:29 PM »
     Are you ok?

Offline Still Hopeful

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #26 on: June 03, 2017, 03:33:18 PM »
Praying for you
and sending you a big hug
Still hopful

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #27 on: June 04, 2017, 12:05:04 PM »
SH and BR, thanks for caring.

I m feeling better. Today was a special day because my D17 did confirmation in church. The thing making me sad was my h not wanting to be there.
The separation of the man I love is harder on days like these.

I focused on the special day and am thankful. My h is in my heart and I keep all these things he is missing in my heart.

Thank you
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline bluerose

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2017, 01:34:02 PM »
    Congratulations to your daughter. Im glad you are feeling better. Special days make me very sad also. Hugs

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #29 on: June 09, 2017, 10:45:47 AM »
Today first time s10 is going to sleep at h place.
Every two weeks on Friday h will pick him up till Saturday in the early evening.

S10 was starting to look forward to it. I also tried to make it as positive as possible for him.
But the sleeping is a little problem. He does not want it. He likes sleep overs, but does not want this at his dads place. He wants his dad to come home and not getting used to the idea dad has another home.

For me it was another confrontation with the brokenness.

H was nice when picking up son.
H also did what was supposed and payed me all alimony for the kids.
It s giving me financial more perspective.

Just not sure how long we will be able to stay in this.

missing son 10, but trying to think positive. It will give him at least the chances to have a bond with his father.

The teenagers start their final year exams next mondy. S17 will do her end examination of secondary school.
So next weeks will be tense in the house :)


Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #30 on: June 10, 2017, 01:01:41 PM »
This evening h brought back our son. One half hour early...and before they got here, he picked up a woman who he was going to a party with.

I was not prepared for this. Opening the door, my h started to talk to me, he fixed my sons bike, and so on. But there was a blond younger lady standing at the car saying very loudly: Hi ...to me.
I did not say a word, gave my h the key of our garage to put the bike inside and then said to him: it seems like you have big plans, bringing son home earlier. But remember you have two other kids in the house. Maybe there is one minute left to say hi to them.
He looked at me and then got into the house to say hi to the teens.
I asked him who the lady was, and he looked at me , said her name and looked away from me... I saw he did not know how to respond to this.

After he left, I got tears and was angry.
Could he at least keep this out of my area. Could he please bring son home before...

Son said he was just picking her up for a party with lot of people. I think to believe that. But anyhow.
There is another thing...He claimed he had the right to see our kids.... he even got me in court for that...
But..now he was with son, he is bringing him home early?

He tells in court is to sick (depressed...) to see the kids a lot. He saw the teenagers one minute in 4 weeks, and has energy enough to go out on a party.

And me.... I am taking care, taking responsabilities, am doing nothing for myself, because I don t enjoy it without h. Am mourning about him.

I feel cycle just started again. I know what will come. Next nights I will not sleep. I will think, cry, pray...
until also that is normal....

I want out of this. I want really want out of this.....

Please tell me one thing to do so I can loose all of this pain...

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Shining Star

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #31 on: June 10, 2017, 01:13:10 PM »
How horrible for you to have him drive up with a woman.  I am sad because I know how much it hurts.  I don't have an answer to help you ease your pain.  I am still trying to figure out my own.  Just wanted to send some support.
H:56, I am 54
BD: March 2014, Left Sept 2014, Back Nov 2014
Left again in February 2015.  Asked for D on 9/22/15
Said he was "sure" he wanted a D in Dec 2015; 
Admitted long term affair - May 14, 2017 - says he is in love with the "symptom" but wants to build a relationship with me with "clear expectations" WHATEVER THAT MEANS!  Settlement Agreement signed 9/20/17.
Divorce final 3/14/18.
NC - by choice - 1/2018

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #32 on: June 10, 2017, 01:31:12 PM »
I am so sorry Mara, the only comfort I can send you is a chapter from Broken Heart on Hold by Linda Rooks.  A Safe Place for Your Heart. Pages 48-49

It says ... trust it [your heart] to the one who binds up the broken-hearted. He knows how to put together all the pieces so your heart will be safe and strong, yet soft, supple and warm.

...

The peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus. Philippians 4:7
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline And breathe

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #33 on: June 10, 2017, 06:37:05 PM »
Oh Mara.. I too cannot offer much support other than my thoughts are with you.
This is sooo painful...back to 1 hr, 1 day until you feel stronger again.
Hugs and strength to you Mara xx

Offline bluerose

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #34 on: June 10, 2017, 07:34:43 PM »
   I am sorry for you to mara. We all on here know thst pain all to well. You could try and get a court order that no other women are allowed around tour children for a period of time. How dare he do that to you and them.

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #35 on: June 11, 2017, 04:46:45 PM »
Reading along, Mara,

Deep breath, deep breath, deep breath. 

Going to parties, all that -- it's a way to chase away the depression.  As are OWs.  Anything for a high that keeps them from the darkness.

it's so hard for us to get our heads round the fact that they can't cope with their own families, that they construct fantasy lives. 

And it is hard for us to get our heads round the fact that yes, we have to be the responsible ones, the ones doing the actual taking care of our families. 

But it's true, we have to be the stable ones, the ones our children look to as role models.

You have done so well in telling your children that all you can do is love him, while not saying that his behaviour is OK.   It's OK to say that you are sorry things are this way, that you don't really understand it either, that it's not their fault.  That it's OK to think that it's horrible. 

So deep breath, and concentrate on kids' exams, the things that matter. 

x


Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #36 on: June 13, 2017, 12:49:59 PM »
Yes breath...breath


I ve managed coming through the sunday. During the last nights I started to make the rational decision to start to let go. I have to heal.
I can not heal, if part of me is always running back to h. who is able to hurt me with the smallest things, just because I am vulnerable towards him.
So I decided to detach again as far as possible.
Only strictly things that need to be shared I will share.
I need to be hard for myself.
I am someone that always try to be nice to people.

So yesterday h started texting to me> He let me know he payed a bill for the taxes and something else too. (btw I transferred the money for this to him,so I was happy in a way he let me know he did pay it, because I needed to know). Before yesterday I would have sent something back to him. Thx or a smiley. At least even if small a sign of attention.
I did not now.
I even did not want to get a text from him. I want to be not interrupted by him. This feeling is very strong at the moment.
But the memories and longing to good times and the nice guy h was are also there. I try to divide them from the person he is now. I was married to that man and we had very good times, even with his social handicap of PD, we were in love and able to handle it. That man seems to be dead, and I mourn over that man. The man he is now, is by times a monster and other times a cold, different person.
While writing this it seems like I m dissociating him (is that an expression in English?) . Sometimes he seems to be multi-personality or a having a dissociative disorder. But here I am splitting him up in the person he was and I loved, and the person he is.
I don t know, maybe this is going to help me.

Am I giving up standing? I don t know. I don t think so, but I think I am starting to put myself and my healing before everything now. I read the sentence: healthy attracts healthy.... Although it s just a sentence, it got deep into me. I will not be able to attract healthy persons (relationships or friends) as long as I do not heal. So here is my goal: I do not want to be or become a victimized sad person, I want to be a healthy happy person.
Yes, If my h can be the one again for me, healed as well.... I will be the happiest person.

So besides all the standing material I read, from RMM, standinggroups, HS, I also read a Christian blog (daily) healing after divorce and a book "Healing from hidden abuse', which is related to the NPD of my h and his behavior caused by that towards me.
It feels selfish , this choice, but I m in a stage in standing that I need to do this.

I cherish every good moment with my h in the past. I detach from him and his behavior now for my own sake, and I focus on healing for myself.
What h will do, I don t know. He will never be far away, as for he still needs things from me. And we have kids.

I leave him in Gods hands.
With Gods help....

Hugs

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #37 on: June 13, 2017, 03:20:12 PM »
It's not a selfish choice, Mara, and it doesn't mean you have to stop standing for what you believe in.

Getting yourself healthy is always the first priority.  In general, if something is not healthy for you then it can't be conducive to any possible marriage restoration either. 

I know exactly what you mean; it can feel like taking detachment too far, but I don't think it means that. 

I think it means exactly what you said -- getting yourself healthy.  Doing your best for your children. 

It's not punishing him, it's not to get him to do anything, it's to take care of yourself.  And that matters.

I, too, have stepped way back; my kids have as well.  It doesn't mean we don't love him, or at least love the person he was; it doesn't mean that we don't think that it's possible for him to come through, it means that we are taking care of ourselves.

One foot in front of the other, just keep going...

x

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #38 on: June 13, 2017, 03:58:11 PM »
I agree Trust&Love, our boundaries need to be protective of ourselves and our children. It is for us, not to punish them.

Letting go does not mean not loving or caring for our spouses, it means that we detach ourselves from the negative effects of their 'monster' and it can't touch us or make us suffer...

We heal over time and a tender heart is not necessarily a bad thing.

Love to you

xxx
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #39 on: June 14, 2017, 12:22:13 AM »
thank s T&L and Mitzpah.

At first I thought this was giving up standing. But through the days, I realize I am still standing, but not for my old marriage or the 'monster' h to come back. Standing for him as my beloved, to heal too. And for my family to heal. So in order to do that, I have to heal. I was on the healing path, but contact with h always opened the wounds who were not healed good enough again.

Yes, one step after another step. It is what I tell my ladies in the helpcenter...You do not have to take the whole stairs in one step. Chance you fall is very big. One step, then the other.

Thinking over things, I am in a far better position than my h. Yes, doing everything on my own..Being a single parent (actually being a double parent on my own is a better definition), but at least having my kids around me and be loved and loving. I m making 'career' in my job, what I think is a calling from before I met h. My marriage did not allow me to grow on that path.
H is not working, and seems to be not thinking about it either.
H has to invest everytime in new persons. I have longlast friends and family.

So making my balance, I m going to appreciate what it is I have. And cherish it. Making the best of it.
I never will be able to close the door of my heart for h. He knows it. When he s ready to see that that is what he wants, he s free to use that door.

Writing it here, helps me to formulate these feelings for myself.

Thanks for supporting me dear friends

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #40 on: June 14, 2017, 12:48:59 AM »
Sometimes you just have to cocoon in and take care of yourself. It doesn't mean you aren't standing, it just means you are standing for yourself first. You've had a very hard week. I know this last time I saw my H was the first time I could manage without feeling sorrow. And I know I can only manage it because he is not much of a boomerang or clinger. I barely see or hear from him, and for me, that was the only way to heal.

Yes, your position is much better than your H. Hard, but worthwhile. And as I always say, you can look at yourself in the mirror and know you gave your all for your family. Your kids know that, too. And I believe your H also knows this.

Hugs, Mara.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline MaraTopic starter

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I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #42 on: June 28, 2017, 04:43:23 AM »
This evening we have graduation of our D17. She made it through secondary school :D

H will be there, and sitting with us, he promised D. My family (parents and sister) will be there too.
I m praying the things will just go and it will be a happy night for D with her family around. I cannot control the tension of my h, so I hope I just can let it go.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Puzzled

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #43 on: June 28, 2017, 09:51:10 AM »
Hi Mara,

Congratulations to your D17 for graduating from secondary school!  I'll be thinking of you this evening and hope you will have a good time.  Don't let your H and his moods get to you.

Hugs,
Puzzled
Me: 46 (43 at BD1)
H: 52 (48 at BD1)
D: 10 (6 at BD1)
Met in 1995, married since 2000
BD 1: August 2014
BD 2: October 2015, moved abroad

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #44 on: June 29, 2017, 03:35:00 AM »
I hope it went well for your D, Mara.  I know how excruciatingly hard this all is.

x

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #45 on: July 01, 2017, 04:09:46 AM »
Thank you all.

My daughter had a wonderful evening.

For me,  I had a migraine before, really from all the tension, but it was gone just before I had to leave to the graduation.
H behaved well, distanced himself from my folks, but they also did not do anything to make tension.

After this, h hugged me even goodbye.

Two days later he sent me a text... About how he feels not relaxed around me because he knows I am having difficulties with the situation of us being separated and he asked me to please not remind him of our separation and coming divorce all the time, because he s also having troubles with it.
I was thinking: I am detaching from him, only this week had to let him closer for the events around our kids. I am not texting him, not calling, not doing anything, so actively I am doing nothing to remind him of that and making him feel uncomfortable. He s feeling not only guilty, I think there is sometimes regret too, but he still has enough reasons and ways to stop the regret and say to himself he s doing the right thing.

Then he started to text to me : have a nice weekend, and I hope you will not miss the kids too much (they are on a church camp now), I know you don t like being alone.... So playing the understanding and comforting mate of me??? why ? Because I am detaching from him, I think and he s trying to get the control back.

So I did not react on his texting. I actually did need to go to his house for a camping bed (air mattras.. don t know in English) for one of the kids, but I even chose to ask another familymember if I could borrow one, just to keep the distance now.

Thanks all for supporting me.

Lots of love

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline 1phoenix

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #46 on: July 01, 2017, 06:27:13 PM »
Mara,

Sending hugs.  You are making it through so well.

Your h is probably looking in the mirror reminding himself of what he has done and has a hard time with it...imagine that!

Take care of yourself & congrats on the graduation.
I learned that courage was not the absence of fear, but the triumph over it. The brave man is not he who does not feel afraid, but he who conquers that fear — Nelson Mandela

I never lose.  I either win or learn! - Nelson Mandela

For we have fallen from our shelves, To face the truth about ourselves.  "The Gift", Annie Lennox

"You must do the thing you think you cannot do."  Eleanor Roosevelt

Grace makes beauty out of ugly things.  U2 "Grace"

We have all been dealt a hand of cards in this game of life.   Are you going to play or fold?

"Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose." Yoda

Offline Velika

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #47 on: July 01, 2017, 09:15:37 PM »
Hi Mara, I am not sure if you have read about "hovering" in NPD, but it seems your H is doing a version of this. I mean from an outside perspective it is comical (I know not really funny IRL) to cause you this much trauma and then complain your reactions are brining him down ... only then to reach out to you to see if you are okay.

I'm sorry you have to deal with this on an ongoing basis. Keep on detaching and if he is making this hard, see what you can do to create a very firm barrier so he can't attempt to draw you in over and over again.

Big hugs.

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #48 on: July 02, 2017, 05:31:32 AM »
Thank you for your hugs and compassionate words 1phoenix and Velika.

Velika, I am actually reading lot of NPD lately, most of things are so spot on my situation.
Hovering is a word I need to look up but what you said, is what I experience.
You know, I m thinking more and more 'why?'.... in my opinion he s not feeling better after all of his actions to bring me down. I m starting to get tired of this. Detaching is my only 'weapon' or 'shield'.

I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #49 on: July 04, 2017, 12:29:36 AM »
Hi Mara,
Congratulations to your daughter! I know how hard the "family" get togethers can be, though.

I sometimes think that the mlc spouse wants us to feel certain ways and when we don't it upsets them and they try to distance themselves some more. Like your H hugged you and it scared him, so he has to tell you not to remind him of the divorce, when it is all of his own making, not yours. It's crazy making sometimes.

Detaching is good for you at this time. You and your kids will be ok. You are doing a very good job with everything.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #50 on: July 08, 2017, 10:40:49 PM »
Hi Mara,

I have some time this summer and having been catching up on posts.  I am so sorry to hear how your H has continued down his mlc path even making a laughing-stock out of himself in court by contradicting himself.  You are doing amazing, though.  You are taking care of everything by yourself and still keeping your love for H.  You have a gentle spirit and when I read your thread I wish I had the kind of patience and unconditional love that you show for your H.  I think he knows, but in the tunnel everything is twisted.  You mentioned going dark in your thread, and I agree that is the best way for you to truly detach.  You have made enormous progress already.  I used to fear my crying and depressed cycles.  But now I realize that when I allow myself to experience all of those feelings, I emerge much stronger.  I know the same will be true for you.  Also, I can't believe he brought a woman by your house.  That is just insensitive and rude.  I'm sorry you had to go through that!
M-43
H-52
D-12
S-8
D-4

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #51 on: July 11, 2017, 11:58:57 AM »
Thank you RCG and OR.

I had the chance to detach from h for two weeks. I did go dark as you said RCG. Interesting that he now is sending me messages. Most of them are business-style. About a bill or the year-bill of 'our' company. I know he likes me to react, but the thing is also written just like a notification so I read it, he can see that, but not reacting.
Tomorrow he s taking the children our for a day and he handled this all with themselves. I only asked my D17 to give me the times so I can make my own plans. This evening he sent a message in our family-whatsappgroup, which he never used for months. He was talking to the kids, but he has a group with the kids themselves, so it was clearly he wanted to involve me.

In a way it feels good to not be in stress all the time. I feel a little bit more nerves now he s coming to pick them up.

Last week kids where on a camp and I was alone. I was a bit stressed in the beginning to be confrontated with the lonely feeling.
But I had a good week. I went out with a new friend, collegue (female) from my work. She went through the same things, and is further in her timeline. Her husband actually wants their marriage back. She will not exclude that, but is not trusting him. Other similarity is we are both christians, and both Flemish married to Dutch guys, So this was a nice evening. She opened my eyes to live again. Take your life back into your hands, it can go together with standing. But it gives you energy.

During the week, besides working a lot, I visit also another friend and I made plans for a short vacation with a friend end of July.

It may sounds strange but since I start to live again it feels like h is trying to get in touch with me. And at this moment I am not in the mood. Not that I do not love him, but I do not want to have the stress, the fear and so on....

Maybe this time is a stage I need. I call it healing, reconnecting with myself.

But it s not all like this. In the beginning of this week I discovered my son 15 is seeing this girl who is 13, and I was thinking about how I think they are cute together but way too young.... And how I was thinking how I am going to handle my son who is clearly deep in love and blind for all real concerns of his mother, and there I was missing my h, and tears came out. I was crying as if he was near me saying: Don t let me do all of this all on my own. I miss you.

I continue standing, but am focussing on other things. My work, my kids, my life together with God.

Thanks for reading along.

Am thinking how I will feel after tomorrow where there has to be a little contact. I hope I can stay detached, because he knows he only needs to do one look at me, to change me

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #52 on: July 12, 2017, 01:42:24 PM »
Well .... it went well. Meeting with h after two weeks.
He came into the house to pick up the kids, who were not ready in time (haha, hey, they are teenagers....:D)
So there was the two of us alone for a while.
I did not give him chances to be personal with me. Only about the kids. Then he asked for paracetamol so I gave him some.
He then said: don t know when I we are back.
I: you said yesterday around 9 in the evening. So I have plans until then. I do not expect you guys back before that.
H was a bit surprised after that and then said, Ok... I will keep them with me then until you are home....
I could see he did not even consider my life was going on during this day without my family.

This evening I was home around 8 ( I worked longer and eat something together with a friend in the city, nothing special) and I got a message if i was home already. So I told them they could come home.
H did not come in, but later he sent me an email about something of our taxes.
I did have to respond to him because it is important to understand and then said I would sign the papers on Friday when he was coming to pick up son10.

H: i am not coming to pick up son10.
Me: It is your weekend. We are counting on that
H; I have an appointment. He can come week after that and I can take him one day extra when you are at work or something like that.

I did not yet respond on that, but feeling something strange.... As if he s trying to get me unbalanced. I was quiet on whatsapp lately, not responding, not being sad of my family gone for whole day but doing something of my own, so he needs to do something to unbalance me again?
It s a feeling. Maybe I am just thinking too much of it.

So now I think i can go dark again for a week until he makes his appointment for our son 10 with me.

I told son10 who said; It is ok, I saw him today, that is enough for this week. I asked him if he had a nice day with his dad and grandma. He said he had, but he was missing his mother in the company.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #53 on: July 13, 2017, 03:22:18 PM »
Hi Mara!

I am glad to find you sounding much stronger. The path our husbands are on will take a very long time, so I think you are doing the right thing by having a good time with your friends and focusing on yourself.  I believe you are right that your H is sensing you pulling away from him or rather being happy in your new circumstances and he is trying to "shake things up again."  He has a different attachment style than my H who just leaves me alone all of the time and does not say anything to me unless absolutely necessary.  I think this type of mlcer is exasperating because they keep giving you hope and then begin acting terribly again. 

It's so great that you have a friend that has been through this before so you can confide in her.  Keep doing what you are doing!  And remember, your H has changed.  He's not the same guy right now that you love.  So please protect yourself.  You are so sweet and kind and you care so much about your h and his well-being.  I admire that so much.  I also want you to be careful, though.  Protect your heart and your future.  When your H comes out of his tunnel someday he will appreciate that you did that.

I am continuing to think about you!  I feel for you about your 15 year old with a 13 year old girlfriend.  My oldest is 12, and I am terrified about dealing with all this dating stuff by myself.  I wish we had partners to help us with these things, but it seems that in the state they are in, they probably would not give good advice. Our children may be more mature than our husbands, I fear. 
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #54 on: July 20, 2017, 01:55:14 PM »
Thanks RCG

Journaling

So today worked my last day and am off of work for 10 days and really am in need of rest :)
The weekend the kids leave again for some camps and I will go on a short trip with a friend. I m looking forward to be in a different place for a while, doing no working :)

I was not gonna tell h about it. But he found out again. He asked me if we could meet in the week our kids were on a camp.
I asked him what for (I could feel it was not just for the company).
He then said he was thinking about the divorce and the house. Although he is the one threatening to sell the house all the time, he now 'suddenly' is rethinking this and hoping we can find a solution.
But the things he s writing me are maybe nicely formulated but are feeling like he wants to stay in control. I have the feeling this is because I am dark towards him. I might make him feeling uncomfortable a bit. Beside he did know ( I do not know how) I was talking to someone about the house lately ( I am finding out my own information just to be strong). So he might be trying to find out what my plans are and so sharing a little of his and making an appointment with me on a very short notice.

So I answered him I was not available during the kids campweek. He said it must be possible I could some time in a week alone...well in the end he found out I was going on a short trip and not all by myself. He asked me where and who I go with, but I did not tell. Just because....I feel it s the control thing, it is not because he s interested. I never know where goes and who with. Besides I am not seeing other men. He s going out with younger ladies all the time (not dating as he saying but finally having a live ....)

Ok.... he stopped asking.
But then. This weekend, before camp, son 10 has to go to his dad first. I tried to reschedule for son he could go during this week instead of the weekend, and although h first did say ok about that, he later came back to this decision. So s 10 has to go to his dads place, before going to the camp, and son10 really did not want to go. H sent me a text he wants to come for s10 tomorrow by bike. And I had to get him back by bike on Saturday evening. I simple do not have choice besides this one: You can also get him by car on Saturday, and I will return the bike next week (the week I am not home and he knows that...he is just playing a game with me I think). So I first was bit confused. Then later replied: You can return the bike the second of august. Nothing else.
he s coming the second of august to see if we can talk about the house, I said kind of yes to that, but am not really convinced I should.
He answered: Ok fine....BUT....and then there came another restriction about the time on the 2nd of August. I know it sounds maybe stupid to fall over that, but it is because I feel he has the need to win this, even if it is only a little.

I am a little upset about this all. I am in this house, when I am not working, all the time. He s not coming or not wanting to come. But in the week, this one week in a whole long time, I am going somewhere, he is interfering in that....

Well, I now did expel it all until when I am back. For this moment I hope he will leave me alone for some time. It is because how he is and acts, is not the man I married. I miss and love that man, not this man who is wanting to live independent from me, hurt me to get this position, but not giving me the room to start to live instead of surviving. He knows I am standing. But standing is not waiting and mourning until he maybe comes back...
I do not want to lose my marriage but I also want control over my life back. Want to live healthy.

It feels for the moment this is not what he has in mind....

What you all think?

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline bluerose

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #55 on: July 20, 2017, 02:54:51 PM »
    I think its a control issue with him. It always is.

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #56 on: July 20, 2017, 05:25:09 PM »
I agree with bluerose.  I really don't understand the MLC mindset, but those that love to pop in and out of our lives seem to want to have freedom to do whatever they want, whenever they want it, however they want it.  While they seem to expect us to sit at home where they left us, and freak out a little when we are not where they left us.  So try to wrestle back some control.
It's exasperating.


Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #57 on: July 21, 2017, 08:45:24 AM »
Hi Mara,

You sound so strong since the last time you posted!  I am happy to hear you sound this way.  Your H's behavior sounds like a little kid.  He wants to live his life freely but also restrict you from going on with yours.  You are doing the right thing!  Stay strong and show him that he cannot mess up your plans so easily.  Treat him like a four-year old who is throwing a tantrum, because that is basically what he is right now.

I am so proud of you the way you have taken control of this situation and you are taking care of yourself and kids while living your best life.  I think that this is the lesson that mlc teaches the lbs.  We are amazing, and we can stand on our own two feet when we need to.  If my H had not had his crisis, I would never know the depth of my strength.  I think these things happen for a reason sometimes.  I still don't know exactly what it is, but I am trying to find the lesson in this.

Stay strong and I promise that you will continue to transform and grow for the best.  I am almost 4 years in, and now I am not sure if I recognize the person that I used to be before mlc came.  Don't get me wrong, I was a good person, but I was a little immature believing that nothing bad could happen to me. 

Always thinking about you and sending you love, Mara!
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #58 on: July 21, 2017, 02:52:37 PM »
Thank you Rose for you lovely words. Thinking of you too.

I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #59 on: August 01, 2017, 11:58:16 AM »
Journaling

I m not sure how to tell what I am going through.
It seems like I am in different stage then before. My friend/therapist but also people around actually are kind of relieved I am finally in this stage. For me this is very confusing.

The thing is I am angry. Not a bit, but very very angry. As if my eyes are opening for all the things H did to me, not only since MLC started but way long before, since he has a diagnosed PD since before we got married.
I feel confused about it. H actually is trying to contact me about stuff, and it is no big deal, but I feel I am mad at  him. I distance myself to heal, and he s breaking this distance the whole time. About little things and big things.

I actually do not know what to do with this feelings. I am confused. For my whole marriage and during this MLC even I knew what I wanted, and now I do not know anymore. For now he should not come close, because the whole inner me is fighting against it.

Is this a stage in LBS, is it temporary, or what to think of it?
My therapist, who is well known with PD, mlc and is a Christian said to me: I am so happy you are FINALLY ANGRY. You need this to heal. Whatever the outcome, if you get back together or not, it is needed to heal.

I know he is confused by my distance. He also feels insecure. But then hey: We are in a divorceprocess which he did start and was not my choice.I never agreed to that, but I feel like I am coming into some state of acceptance or something like that. Knowing there is life after divorce??? Or there is life without a man who promised me things, but the most I got was controlling behavior and things like that.

I was actually a bit shy to post this. I know I need this stage to heal.... I do not want to say negative things about my h out in the open. I just keep distancing myself.

Will see in some time where I stand.
I try to keep my trust on God. He is with me in this.

Sorry if this is confusing...

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #60 on: August 01, 2017, 03:05:20 PM »
I understand Mara.
It feels disloyal to post negative things about our spouse, but it is part of accepting that we are two separate people, and that our MLCers have actually been very very unkind to us.

It's a process, like all of this.
I too am glad that you are detached enough from your MLCer to feel angry. 
It's a stage that you will come and go from, like the layers of an onion.
You might think you are over the anger one day, but then out of the blue, another thing may trigger it and around you go again for a while.  It takes time to process and work through all of this.

Be kind to yourself. 
Hugs X

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #61 on: August 01, 2017, 04:52:01 PM »
I agree with your therapist, Mara.  I have felt the same way when I read your updates.  You are so kind and sweet.  I feel like your H doesn't expect you to stand up for yourself.  Some of the things he has done I just can't believe.  One example is when he took money out of your account without permission. 

Of course, our husbands did not choose to have a crisis and we feel sorry for them and still care for them, but at some point enough is enough.  We have a right to stand up for ourselves and say "this is enough."  I am glad to hear you sounding like this, because you are coming to terms with your situation and understanding that this H was not perfect, even before bd.  Me too.  Anger is a difficult emotion to handle, but as your therapist said, it is necessary for healing.  Keep up your strength, Mara.🤗
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #62 on: August 02, 2017, 04:12:09 AM »
thanks RCG and Kikki. So valuable to hear you on this.

I start to see the difference between love which give you the freedom to be your self in a committed relationship and a controlling relationship with (co-)dependency. I might have been in both in different stages of our relationship. The good times covered the bad days (when counting the time after BD in the marriage, the bad was more than the good, I can admit that now).

I am starting to decide things for me without thinking if my h possible will be commenting on that that it is wrong or strange or whatever.... and this is feeling is so valuable. So I can do this because I think I like it at this moment....and I do not have to reject my own feelings about things out of anxiety my h will reject me.

Yes RCG, I still care for him, I even love him. But I don t love the way our relationship is and was anymore. I see now...this was not good, even abusive. And I see how my part in it was: let him do it... let him change my boundaries until I was only a shadow of me anymore. And this is what is changing now....

I can imagine my family and friends being concerned about me for these years. They now are telling me: finally we see the real you back.... you are standing up for who you are.
I think even h sees it. He said to me: You remember me of the girl you were when I met you and fell in love with you.
But I am not that girl. I am not that naïve anymore, I have a big time life experience now, which will make me very careful, also towards him.

Kikki, I still will try to be respectful about h towards others. He is my childrens father and I do not exclude us being together again in the future but at this moment this feels like far far away (will be a stage too I think). People that know him will not hear my ventilation about this. Maybe this forum is a place where I can safely sometimes ventilate about it.
But I agree, venting it out this anger now, is therapeutic and relieving.

Thx for your reactions

Hugs Mara



I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Whyus

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #63 on: August 02, 2017, 04:47:34 AM »
Hi Mara, I just caught up on the last few ages.
Im sorry but i dont know your timeline but it seems like your H and my W and playing the same games. Ive been distancing myself from W to protect myself and its working. W has seen/ heard of my GAL and is now reaching out and being really nice!! She is basically terrified that if I meet somebody then its game over... Its easier walking a tightrope with a safety net than without one..

It might be interesting for you to read the last 2-3 pages on my latest thread, nearly identical behaviour. Just enough to get me spinning again, although very slowly....

Stay strong girl
Married - 19,5 Years pre BD
Together - 21,5 Years
Me: 45
W: 45 (Acts 25)
BD 1: 10.01.2017
BD 2: 24.02.2017 OM 28 (now 30) Trainings partner. Still together but never seen.
2 Sons - 18 & 20
2 Dogs and a cat.
Own home . Sold!
Divorce Filed
T1  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=8671.0
T10. http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9547.0

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #64 on: August 02, 2017, 06:22:49 AM »

Yes RCG, I still care for him, I even love him. But I don t love the way our relationship is and was anymore. I see now...this was not good, even abusive. And I see how my part in it was: let him do it... let him change my boundaries until I was only a shadow of me anymore. And this is what is changing now....


Good for you, Mara!  It seems like many LBS have issues with boundaries.  It may be part of what makes us attractive to the mlc types.  For me, I always want to be nice and avoid conflict.  For most of my marriage, I was not getting what I needed, but I always excused H's behavior.  He's introverted, so he doesn't want to go to the party with me.  Or he just doesn't say he loves me because his culture doesn't do that.  I'm okay with that.  The truth is we were really complete opposites and he never wanted to meet me half-way.  I let him get away with it and just focused on the positive.  He works so hard.  He's not controlling.  He lets me do whatever I want and doesn't hold me back.  All true, but probably not the healthiest for building us as a couple. 

I am glad that we can commiserate about this together.  You are a gem, Mara.  I am glad that you are beginning to see your true beauty and value! 
M-43
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #65 on: August 02, 2017, 07:01:15 AM »
<3 RCG (What is a gem???)
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #66 on: August 02, 2017, 07:26:18 AM »
Mara,

gem:

a cut and polished precious stone or pearl fine enough for use in jewelry.
something likened to or prized as such a stone because of its beauty or worth:
His painting was the gem of the collection.

Definition of gem
a person held in great esteem or affection.
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Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #67 on: August 02, 2017, 07:38:49 AM »
oh thank you.... xxx
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #68 on: August 02, 2017, 07:53:05 AM »
You are welcome, Mara!  ♥️
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Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #69 on: August 02, 2017, 08:43:31 PM »
Anger is definitely a phase and we can find ourselves cycling back to it.  Last Fall I was so angry.  So very, very angry for a period of time.  I did not even want to see him.  And he was scheduled to have the kids every other W-Sun.  I was living with my brother, and would drop the kids off at youth group Wed's and he would pick them up, so I didn't have to see him.  However, on Thu's and Fri's during school, instead of going to his house after school, they would choose to come back to our house and hang out until he got off work, so he would then come and get them on Thu and Fri.  Since technically, his parenting time started on Wed. and they chose to come back to the house, I didn't want to see him when he came to get them, so I would end up leaving the house right before the time that I knew he would come get them.  My Brother and my SIL were usually there and I just was so angry I did not want to see him.  Then I would only have to see him when I picked up the kids from him every other Sunday at his house.  I told my brother that I was driving around looking at listings as it was around the time that I was shopping for a place.  It was not that I didn't still love him, I was just so very angry at him. 

I think we all go through anger.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #70 on: August 03, 2017, 11:48:13 PM »
HI FW,

I can relate to this feelings.
How are you now?

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #71 on: August 03, 2017, 11:55:10 PM »
I heard a psychologist/relationtherapist on the topic restored relations ships.
He stated that when a couple comes back together, after one of them had left the marriage because of adultery or other crisis, and the LBS was not heard in all of this....there should be some compensation for the LBS. Because restoration is probably only possible because the LBS let the partner time to go through this time, and would have also taken lot of hardship because of this.
So he stated to prevent this anger or revenge comes out in the beginning of a restoring relationship, which can break it up again immediately, the LBS should get the chance to get even by doing something like a big trip or making a dream come true which was not possible before.
It is not that I actually want revenge or get even or something, I think, also out of faith, more is possible.
But after reading this, I understood the anger. It is hiding somewhere inside and has to come out.

I relate to FW's story. I actually do not want to see h for the moment. And he has to come pick up son 10 this evening. But I know, he will not even notice I m angry, he feels the distance.
And no, my love is not gone, I still love him, but I do not know anymore how to love him... does it make sense?

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #72 on: August 04, 2017, 12:27:36 AM »
HI FW,

I can relate to this feelings.
How are you now?

Mara

Mara, it lasted a couple weeks and that was it.  I was much better, and then it came back for a bit earlier this year.  I wrote down all the things that I was angry about in my journal, and then I went back through them and turned them over to God and wrote I forgive you after each one.  It was a good release to do that.  It doesn't mean that I have forgotten, but forgiving him did help me move on from that and let it go.  Sometimes those feelings rush back and I have to do some more forgiving, but it's a process.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #73 on: August 04, 2017, 12:29:05 AM »
I relate to FW's story. I actually do not want to see h for the moment. And he has to come pick up son 10 this evening. But I know, he will not even notice I m angry, he feels the distance.
And no, my love is not gone, I still love him, but I do not know anymore how to love him... does it make sense?

Mara

Yes Mara, that makes total sense.  (((HUGS)))
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #74 on: August 08, 2017, 12:14:44 PM »
Journaling


A month from now our courtdate for divorce. There is no reason for court to delay it again. I don t even have to be there. They just are going to approve the divorce.

I don t know how I feel. I feel really mixed up about everything.
The angry feelings, the relief of finally being angry about all that happened, the confusion about husbands changing moods ( if he doesn t hear me he contacts me, if I respond he rejects, if I do not or be short, he start to flattering me until I am responding....to reject again). Somewhere very deep down I miss the man he was, but there is more and more doubt I will ever see or have that man back. The man he is today, I actually try to avoid.

At the moment communication is nothing more then about practical things especially about son10.
But he forgets what we communicate, so last minute he s starts to text me and mixing up my program, which mostly is working last minute. It gives me some stress, because I really also want son 10 not to be in stress but enjoy his holiday, so it is much easier to arrange plans with his friends or with my family to entertain son on my workingdays then to ask h for it.

Maybe it is the tiredness about this crisis, about the stress and about the neverendingstory that makes me feeling like I feel.
NExt to that finally seeing the abusiveness of his attitude towards me for years, especially the controlling part makes me being that angry.
I mostly am happy not to hear or see him for now.
This is so different from the time before where I was always even in silence happy to see him, even for one second.

Here is a summary of my feelings: I do not know anymore..... what is good, what I want....


Trying to focus on my children and work for the moment.

thanks for listening
Mara

I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #75 on: August 08, 2017, 01:00:35 PM »
Mara,

This is a difficult time, no doubt. Very tiring and stressful.

I feel for you having to deal with an unstable h. along with a young child. I can well understand not wanting to see your h. - I have gone through times like that too - I wanted to be invisible so that he couldn't see me when he came round to pick up or drop off the kids in the beginning.

It changes over time - I think that when we feel less vulnerable or when they cannot do anything else to hurt us, it doesn't matter so much to see them.

I will say at the moment that it is quiet without my h. coming round so much and I find I can rest more in my spare time :P  And he doesn't particularly threaten me at the moment.

Do the children go back to school before the courtdate?

Thinking of you!
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #76 on: August 08, 2017, 05:29:27 PM »
(((HUGS))) Mara.  I understand your feelings.  It's so emotionally draining.

I can understand the confusion over his changing moods.  Reading about them definitely continues to strengthen the thought that he is indeed in MLC.

I can also understand the anger, as I did the same thing looking back at some things with my MLCers attitude as well.

Hang in there, Mara!
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #77 on: August 14, 2017, 10:51:03 PM »
For the moment I am doing ok.
One of the things helping is, I finally sleep better. I have some kind of medication on natural base with Melatonine and Vit B6 which are really getting me through my tiredness, which started at BD 33 months ago. Because of h taking twice all the medication we had in the house to try to suicide I got rid of all kinds of medication and even when he left the house two years ago, I was not tempted to have anything like this anymore except my necessary meds for high bloodpressure. But this is natural and so good to finally make good nights every night, not just occasionally.
So it helps.

The detachment from h helps me too. To see ...to know and to heal from things. These last days were quiet, cause he had no reason to be here and is not contacting. I noticed I am letting go of it.
Although he shows up in my dreams (the other side of sleeping :) )

End of the week we (H and me) have an appointment to talk about the house. He s thinking of not selling it. I am investigating all of my options. Things are not all on the same timing, which makes it a bit stressful for me.
I have an appointment with my lawyer tomorrow to talk about the proposition of h and to see if this is something good. I think he wants to stay involved in a way, and staying owners of the house together is a way for him to do so. I am financially not independent enough to buy him out, although it might be a more healthy option. So here is some thinking that needs to be done.
I notice I am not telling him any of my plans or doubts, trust is gone too far. I m not sure what he will do that information. It makes him kind of nervous, I know it. For me it is not a psychological game, but it feels that way.
Being strategic in what you say or do, because it can be used against you. This is something I really am sad about. The man I used to be the closest with is now the person I do not trust. Maybe this is also the key thing in what changed my feelings and influences my stand, I do not trust him. And it is only him that causes these feelings in me.

At the moment I think I am ok. BUt september 8 will be here soon. that s our new courtdate for divorce. I do not even have to be there, and I will not go. I do not want to hear it, or be present on this.
I pray God for a miracle before that. Something changes so my broken family can be restored and healed. I will continue to do so, even now I do not know how I myself should handle these things, like trust, and healing.

Last weekend my grandmother celebrated her 91 birthday. We had a family party. It was really joyful. Lot of familymembers I only see once a year (we live in different European countries). But they said to me I looked better and shine again. I get this compliment a lot lately from people around me, saying I finally am me again, real smile, looking better then before... So this is an answer for me the detachment was so necessary to finally happen.

My h is not looking so good. He s gaining weight again (at the start of BD he started to live overhealthy and doing sports in an extreme way. Now he s not doing anything anymore and also eating out of frustration again). I am sorry for this to happen. He definitely is not finding a way of normal living, but living in extremes.
He seems depressed.
I do feel sorry for him.

My D17 is on her vacation in Barcelona. She went there by herself and visits my brother and his family over there. She s having a good time before starting university in september. I am so proud of her. I know she is very disappointed about her father. She gives him some space in her life, but not very much.
Son15 sees him occasionally but also is not giving him the role of being a father. Son10 sees him every other week and likes the time together, as long as he s not too tired from things. After a school or campweek he mostly asks me to change the appointment so he can relax at home.

 Three years ago I could not have imagined some drama like MLC would come over my family. As deeply in love with my h, although I now see so much how things were not good for a long time already, then I thought we were doing great in given circumstances (married with a h with diagnosed psychiatric desease).

There is a beautiful summer day coming on and I go prepare for work. Although it s a holiday officialy (Roman Catholics celebrating Mary today, and in my city it is mothersday because of that :) )  but my work in the womenscenter for HT-victims is not stopping on holidays. But it gives me energy to be there and mean something for someone today.

Hava a nice day. Hope you all are okay.

Big hugs
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #78 on: August 15, 2017, 05:54:18 PM »
I'm glad that you are sleeping better Mara. 

Congrats to your grandma on her 91 birthday, wow!

Good luck with the upcoming meeting with your H about the house, and I'm sorry to hear about the upcoming court date.  I'm glad that you don't have to be there.

It is so crazy how alike all of our stories are when we talk about our H's and some of the extremes they are going through.

It is good to read your update, Mara.  You take care.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #79 on: August 15, 2017, 06:58:31 PM »
Hi Mara,

I'm so glad to hear that you are sleeping better.  Sleep is so important for our health and emotional well-being.  If your friends and relatives are telling you that you are looking like your old self, that is a great sign!  It means that the hard work of detaching and focusing on yourself and the kids is working! 

I am sorry to hear about the court date, and I know it will be a sad day for you.  I have heard of instances where people get divorced and then remarried.  Nothing is impossible.  The alien who is your H right now is not somebody you want to be married to anyway.  We do not know what the future will hold.  You are making a difference every day for the people that you work with and your family.  I think you are doing very well.  I will keep you in my thoughts, Mara, and I hope you have time for a little bit of fun as the summer finishes.
M-43
H-52
D-12
S-8
D-4

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #80 on: August 15, 2017, 08:27:36 PM »
Hi Mara,
I'm catching up. I understand about the anger,it's a stage of grief. And we do grieve, for the loss of our martiage, our family, our friend. The relationship we knew is dead. We didn't deserve what happened to us. Who wouldn't get angry? But like all stages, this too shall pass.

You are wise to tell your H nothing about your thoughts and feelings about the house. You might be better off to sell and get your own place if your H will not give up his half of the house. Otherwise, he could use it to threaten you whenever he's being monsterish. If you and he both decide you should stay in the house for a time, put an end date on it: when S is 18, or 16 or on x date. If you do that, he can't threaten you to force sell the house. Just a thought.

My heart hurts for you. This is a lot of stress, and you've managed with class. Be well.  We will be here for you.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #81 on: August 18, 2017, 06:57:51 AM »
Hi OffRoad, good to hear you.

Thanks all for reading along.

Today normally h and I should have a talk about the house. He was the one asking for it. I had the impression few weeks ago when he asked, he was having second thoughts about selling the house and forcing me and the kids out of the house.
This week started to feel a bit nervous about the coming meeting. I talked with my lawyer about few possibilities.
I myself do not have enough financial possibilities to get a decent loan to buy him out or to buy a new house.
So hear is some problems for me.
But I am in a process of sollicitating a new second job and in my other job I m getting a promotion. The thing is the timing. It ll take two months before I really know everything and the bank needs to see me having a few months of stable income and the workingcontracts. The both jobs are really exciting for me, and seem like made for me, so I do want to actually wait for these two things too.
But I will not tell h about this uncertainties, because he did hurt me before about my choices. I do work really hard in a center for human traffic victims which I m involved in from the start of it, and we are now going through a transition fase from being a pioneer-organization towards a profession organization which I partly also organized. I really love the job with the ladies and the team, knowing we make differences in lives of victims daily. The other job is more creative, a project of a museum in my city, who wants to picture refugees of today in our society. My job would be interviewing them and project their stories through texts, pictures and other creative ways in the museum. It would be a 3 year project. They were looking for my profile (traumatherapist and writer/interviewer) and I when I read the jobapply this was like made for me and looking like the perfect marriage. But it is kind of flexible job. My h knows I am the best in jobs like that, with making my own hours and plans and being payed at the end of each project, but I know he will criticize me for not applying enough for regular jobs. But hey.... he has the right to go through MLC, stopping everything, all of his jobs and projects, stopping his marriage, stopping being properly involved in his childrens life as a father, stopping going to church, stopping everything..... and then wanting me to work 9-5 and doing all of the house and familythings on my own. I now feel going into a stage of getting my own income in a way which will give me also satisfaction, which will give me energy to take care of my kids too.
So I am not in the mood telling him that now before all is sure...

But he did a proposition few weeks ago, and I thought he was coming to talk about that. I asked the lawyer her opinion. Yesterday h started to text me about it and if I had a proposition. I said I was not ready. He first said that I was the asking party for this (which is not, he was...)He started to be angry, He said I was just trying to stretch the time, and if I was not cooperating I was not trustable in his eyes.
I felt attacked by this and before knowing I said in text to him that trust indeed is the keyproblem for me....
I probably got him on his heart here because he immediately threatened me that I leave him no option but selling and that the kids would know he did try but I was not to talk with.
I stopped the conversation but had a bad night, thinking if it was me ruining the little bit of hope to talk constructively between the two of us.
I reread the texts and saw the way of manipulating before I directly pointed him to the 'trust-problem'. And I start to see this is what happened so much, but because of the detachment I am losing my tactics of keeping that under control. I walked on eggshells for years and kept everything in order for so long, but I can not anymore, I lost this and am starting to see the manipulation and controle.

I am now waiting for him to pick up son10. Before this day he sent me new text with what he expects me to do if I want to keep the house.
I only said thank you and will talk about it with someone. Nothing more.

I feel I m losing this battle of standing for him and my marriage. I feel like I want to run out of the manipulation so badly.

I want to see the meaning of all of this. That this suffering is not for nothing. I can see I am growing as a person and growing to be me again. But there is this pain everytime I have to be in contact with him, about what is lost, broken and gone. Is it forever? I can not see it. I can not see the man I love in the angry texting and the commanding way of communicating. But I know he was before, I just did not see or notice it.... Maybe I am changing instead of him...

It is confusing, but as you all know, I am in a confusing stage of being an LBS now.

Thanks all for 'listening' :)

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Milly

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #82 on: August 18, 2017, 03:20:25 PM »
Mara, I'm just catching up on your thread. I've been going through the exact same emotions as you. I'm 39 months since BD. I still get angry moments and they help me. I don't recognize the monster my H has become. I still love him, although I wish I didn't.

Good luck with the divorce hearing. I have my separation (maybe final hearing) in February 2018. I no longer hope it won't happen. I think it might need to happen for both me and H. He did say about 4 months after BD, that first we needed to divorce, and then we could talk about getting back together. This was after I had discovered he'd been cheating on me before BD and was living with OW. Weird thing to say if you are living with your soul mate.

Once the separation/divorce is final, I will no longer be legally attached to H, and he will not have me anymore either. His choice, sadly. But we shall see. My H has delayed his separation so that it's 2.5 years since he started it.

I would sell your home and move to a new place, which would be all yours. I fought to hold onto my family home, but now that I've sold it, because I could no longer afford it, I realize it's a blessing. My home was keeping me stuck.

Take care, Mara.
Milly
Married 1989, together since 1984 
BD May 2014,
D23, D20, S13
OW Physical Affair. He and she said she turned 34 the month of BD. She turned 50 last year.

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #83 on: September 02, 2017, 01:22:06 AM »
Thank you all lovely people.

Journaling.

As september started, the summerholiday is over. S10 started again yesterday in his last class of primary school (wow time flies...) and s15 starting next Monday. D17 will start her university at the end of the month. She s now still working as a student in a coffeebar.

Less then a week from now our divorce will be finalized.
As I told earlier I did not fight against it. I have a lawyer who protects my rights. She wants to do more then that and fight a lot, but I refuse to fight against the man I loved so much I wanted to grow old with. I start to accept that he does not want that, so I am also not trying to get things back together. I have my self value ( I refound it) and I will accept and see how my life will turn out after divorce.

This thing of acceptance started after our last courtmeeting in beginning of june. I know I needed these three months before finalizing. Acceptance is also a door to healing from the past. I no longer hold on the past where were good times and also bad times. I am definitely healing from the past. The things happened since start of MLC are also to be healed of, but wounds are hard to heal because I still have to deal with a man in MLC.

He s still really not acting normal. Yesterday he came to pick up son 10. He still has a key. Since short he s not using the key, but I can not get the key back. That is a control thing...he needs to have a key towards 'his' house and 'his' family. I m not fighting that. But when he comes he rings the bell and waits for me to open up. Not always like that. Sometimes he just pops up in the house and I am not prepared for him to be there.
So I opened the door for him, and he walks in the house, without greeting me, but coming in as if he s always there and start to talk to our D an S10 as if they were talking every day, just taking up in a conversation.
I understood his signal like this: He is not here for me, he has to allow me in his life because of the kids, but I am not a valuable person to talk with or even to say hi to. So I took it as it came, and did not interfere, only made sure s10 had all of his things to take with him packed.
H had a conversation with our D about her drivinglessons. He is giving her drivinglessons and my sister had offered to drive with her, when she had a few basic lessons, because she works in the same city as my D s university, so they can carpool and take advantage of this time in the car together.
Good solution.
H also accepts that. But he needs to be the one getting the credits for the driving lessons, so he asked: did your auntie started the driving with you. D said no. H: I am sure she s scared.
Wow h.... I really felt my inner started to fight him.
D said: NO...it is because University did not start yet. It s only next month. That s all. Before that, you can train me the basics.
My sister is a very good driver and drives a lot more than my h. He only has a bigger car and a bigger ego.

While he said the things, he looked at me. I knew he only want to feel me, or my family feeling less then him. So I swallowed a comment I was going to say and said nothing.

Then he started with D a conversation about going to a sauna together.
He apparently give her this for her diploma as his present. D felt not comfortable to tell him, she does like that with her friends and not with him together. There was no room for her to say so.
I did not interfere but did see it.
She then said to me, Ok, I will enjoy it. Just weird to do this with my father.
I asked her (later) if he s doing this more because he talked about it like he s going there sometimes. She said: no, it s  his first time, but she also felt like he wanted to impress us.
In my head something popped up like: he s going there with his new (lady)friends.

He then left with son10 without saying goodbye to me. I tried not to feel rejected. Thinking of all of my friends, family and also new friends not ever rejecting me, but telling me how valuable I am. So I let him go.

I start to see the patterns of his NPD. He s feeling little low inside but showing the opposite. I guess I always knew that because before BD I was the one that could neutralize these feelings of him. I could say to him to not putting himself above or beneath other people, because he was valuable himself as a person. But something went wrong, MLC or what, and he started to see me as a threat for his ego, and need to push me beneath him.
I start to see more and more that this happening and happened. Before BD I adapted myself to this, but now because of the distance, detachment I see more how unhealthy this was for me either. I also am losing my capability of how to handle him in this. So I do not anymore, which is communication also. I know he sees it as either weak, or fighting against him. It s nothing of these two, but he will draw his own conclusions anyway.

So because of all of this.... I am in a process of letting go of our marriage. I still love the man he somewhere in there was, but I do not love the relationship we had, or the relationship we would have if we reconcile at this moment where he obviously still is in MLC / and not working at his NPD ( as it is possible)
There is only one thing remaining in this standing for me, that is faith in God. In believe with God everything is possible.  So I stand on Him to interfere in things. But I also believe God allows things to happen or to go different ways. So am looking for what He wants in this for me. That is also a process where I am by times more sure than other times.
One of the things is I believe God not wanting divorce. But He also do not want people to be oppressed in relationships or abused. So this is a big tension for me, which I try not to talk to much about it,  because everyone is saying something different. Even Christians are not agreeing. So I think I have to find out what my personal road will be in this, with God.

In the meantime:
I am thankful I still have the house, a roof over my head and my three kids under my roof almost every night.
Thankful me and the kids grow to an open family with communication in a healthy way. And our door open for their friends and other people. This was really not like this before. We were a closed, almost isolated family with hardly room to breathe. I see it now.

I also am thankful for getting strength to endure this pain of separation and divorce every day. God is with me.
Last weeks I have more panicattacks again. I think about not knowing about the future, or more not knowing how h will try to make me dependant on his 'goodness' and so I try to get control over my life. This meant a life change the last 6 months from a person that would try to get everyone and everything in peace, no matter if I would not get any rest myself to a person that is taking stand for me and my children in a way that is hopefully respectful. Working and getting my own salary, making my own decisions, no matter what H wants to judge about that, making the life of people around me comfortable. Having peace with everyone even if that means no peace with h.

I am not sure if this make sense? Especially feeling hard to translate it in English. Next Friday will be a hard day anyway. I m not going to be present in court ( I don t have to) so I am going for a walk with a friend. Having coffee and will hear about everything after.

Thank you all for listening again.

Wish you all strength and lots of love
mara

I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #84 on: September 02, 2017, 06:37:22 AM »
Hi Mara,

It sounds like you are reflecting a lot and coming to acceptance with what has is happening right now with the divorce and also your past.  I know it's hard, but you are right that you have so many things to be grateful for.  The truth is, you have been holding your marriage together alone for a long time and now that your H has gone crazy, you are single-handedly putting your life back together and providing love and a stable environment for your kids.

I hate that your H did not acknowledge you when he came.  My H treats me that way all of the time even though he lives at home and even though I tell myself that it doesn't matter, it crushes my soul a little bit every time it happens.  We just have to remember that it is not about us.  Who is so rude that they cannot say a quick hello to someone?  I would not do that even to a coworker I don't like.  It's basic common decency to greet someone when you see them.  They just are not decent people anymore.  :(  Maybe they will be again someday, but we need to heal from being disrespected that way.

I understand what you mean about religion and God being against divorce.  I am not a particularly religious person, but I also never believed that I would ever get a divorce.  I felt like I would hang on and try my best no matter what because it was the moral thing to do.  But now I have also changed.  I have realized that hanging on is making me lose myself and who I really am.  It's not worth it.  I know you will find your path in life and God will always be proud of the choices you made.  You tried very hard.  You are human, too, Mara.  We can only do so much.  This MLC business causes us to have shifts in our identities.  Our spouses change, and we change also.  This has been very true for me lately, but I feel like I am slowly finding my center again.

Stay strong and keep up with all the good things you are doing.  I will think of you on Friday and send positive thoughts your way. 
M-43
H-52
D-12
S-8
D-4

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #85 on: September 02, 2017, 11:53:53 AM »
Thank you RCG, your are always spot on what is happening with me.
And kind to me.

Hang in there yourself.  Your h must be blind not seeing the beautiful person you are...


Mara xxx
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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  • How I long for your precepts! Psalm 119:40
Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #86 on: September 02, 2017, 01:29:44 PM »
Dearest M,


I so understand your 'accepting'  of where you are.

God understands, even more....

May God give you peace and trust to go on...

It seems that sometimes it is necessary  for them to go through with this (maybe we do too). From now on, things will be different but the same, if you know what I mean. Our love is undiminished and their confusion is the same :o

M, you are in my prayers and will be constantly this next week - take care of yourself and hug those kids close to you - you have them with you - that was a great comfort to me when divorce came :-\
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #87 on: September 03, 2017, 03:45:18 PM »
Mara I am glad that you do not have to be there and that you are making plans for that day.  That room is the saddest room in the world.  I will never forget that sad little room and sitting there and listening to other people's marriages dissolving before they got to me.

You are in my thoughts and prayers Mara.  It is never easy, this D that we don't want.

((((HUGS)))
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #88 on: September 11, 2017, 12:13:46 AM »
Update

Last Friday it was D - day. Since I did not have to be lively present I did not go to court but went out for breakfast with a friend.
I can not describe what I felt the whole morning. My body, stomach, everything seemed to be fighting, so the breakfast was not really enjoyed, cause I could not properly eat anything.
But the company was comforting.
I was again in a reflecting mood.... I wonder when this phase will be over.
The friend I was with was involved in our situation from the beginning after BD.  I remember she was the one I went to in desperate the day before I decided to run out of the house with the kids, in december 2014. My h was in such monster modus that days and it was not responsible that time to stay in that kind of situation, also because he did monster towards the kids too.
I returned after two days concluding that going away did not help a bit in coming closer, but it only gave him the confirmation that I was the monster....
After that we lived in the same house apart for 8 or 9 months, h in the officeplace, living like he was in his early 20 bachelor years, only giving me attention the nights he was desperate to have sexual relation. He moved out 2 years ago, and we went closer and further until I decide myself to detach more since the beginning of june this year.

Last Friday I was afraid, afraid of how I would react on the message: Divorce is finalized. I so remembered BD and how it was the first time I got a panic attack, the first of many. Last year panic attacks were not there anymore, but the anxiety to get them.... Before that first panic attack almost three years ago, when there were things were I started to panic, my h was there for me, and despite of everything not good between us, he was the one knowing me and capable to calm me down just because he was there, protective and loving.
I now see, he was overprotective towards me, which caused me to be isolated and the kids too.... but in these situations, especially when I was really hurt or afraid or whatever, he was the best.

After breakfast I got home and got a message from my lawyer which I did not really understood in the beginning. It was: Divorce is in consideration. Next courtsession is October 6th.
So I asked her what it meant. What I understand now (because everything went by texting) is, that court agrees but gives another month to reconsider to both parties. Since I am not the party asked for the divorce, and we also not divorce with agreement from both sides, it means H gets another month to reconsider and I again will be in another month of not really knowing and building up tension.

Of course, I know h wants the divorce. And with my head I know, it just is another four weeks. But I know the last days before October 6th will be a repetition of last week with sleepless nights, reflections and anxiety for panic attacks.
But the extra time is welcome on the other hand, to get more things in my own hands like my income and me considering how to handle things on my own, like my house.

Yes, I not only start to accept things, I also see there will be a way to survive this trauma and live again.
I start to feel proud of myself in handling things in my own. Being a person, the person I was or should have been. Being able to make decisions without thinking: What would h have to comment on that.
I also start to make plans for myself for the coming time, something I thought was not possible 6 months ago.
And am enjoying what just comes. Like last weekend one of my nieces had her birthday. She got 13 years and she called me: Auntie I would love you to come to my party...
So I could not resist this of course. Her little sister of three did not leave my side all afternoon, so I spent my time enjoying reading the little one all of her books she could find and playing with her. After that, I thought: I enjoyed my time so much. This is so valuable. These two girls were happy to see me (and their other siblings too), why should I mourn over rejection of my h, if all the rest of the world is happy with me (because it is only my h who rejects me, I have my family, friends, old an new, my collegues, neighbours...and I can see they all accept me for who I am and are happy with me).

So.... I will survive.... (the song just popped in my head :D).

I love the man I once married and I keep that man in my heart. I put all the beautiful memories in a box with a heart on it in my special robe in my heart and keep there. They are my treasures. I will not throw away our relationship of 21 years in the trash because it was all bad, because it was not. They were 21 years of my life, and I know I lived that 21 years with no regrets, of course it could have been different, it should have been different.

I do not know what the future will bring, but I know God knows... and He holds my future.

I will keep you all updated.

I hope everyone is okay. I keep you all in my prayers, knowing God knows who you all are when I talk about you with all of your HS-nicknames.

Mara

BTW, because D is not finalized yet I still not know if I would have had a panic attack...that freaks me out a little. Instead of that I ran into my fleeing-modus and slept for hours.... It was not resting, It was a reaction on the stress of the days before.
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #89 on: September 11, 2017, 06:08:43 AM »
M,

I hope you are having a better day today, it was great to hear you had such a good time with your nieces :)

It seems hard that you still have another four weeks to go through until a final decision is reached, however, this is what has been decided for you - I pray that you will reach a peaceful state of mind when the time comes - it is the waiting that feels so hard. :(

I wonder if your h. will reconsider, as the court suggests? Here, we don't have this kind of thing, basically, you can divorce straight away as long as there is no dispute over finances, custody of kids and property.

xxx
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #90 on: September 11, 2017, 07:01:36 PM »
Aww Mara, I am sorry that you are in another month of waiting to see what happens. 

Yes, I not only start to accept things, I also see there will be a way to survive this trauma and live again.
I start to feel proud of myself in handling things in my own. Being a person, the person I was or should have been. Being able to make decisions without thinking: What would h have to comment on that.
I also start to make plans for myself for the coming time, something I thought was not possible 6 months ago.
And am enjoying what just comes. Like last weekend one of my nieces had her birthday. She got 13 years and she called me: Auntie I would love you to come to my party...
So I could not resist this of course. Her little sister of three did not leave my side all afternoon, so I spent my time enjoying reading the little one all of her books she could find and playing with her. After that, I thought: I enjoyed my time so much. This is so valuable. These two girls were happy to see me (and their other siblings too), why should I mourn over rejection of my h, if all the rest of the world is happy with me (because it is only my h who rejects me, I have my family, friends, old an new, my collegues, neighbours...and I can see they all accept me for who I am and are happy with me).

This is all very wonderful.  Your H is the one who is missing out right now.

So.... I will survive.... (the song just popped in my head :D).

I love the man I once married and I keep that man in my heart. I put all the beautiful memories in a box with a heart on it in my special robe in my heart and keep there. They are my treasures. I will not throw away our relationship of 21 years in the trash because it was all bad, because it was not. They were 21 years of my life, and I know I lived that 21 years with no regrets, of course it could have been different, it should have been different.

I do not know what the future will bring, but I know God knows... and He holds my future.

Yes, you are so right.  Keep those memories of your H in your heart and remember that the man he is right now is not your H, but a mid-life crisis replica of him, one that you do not know.

I hope everyone is okay. I keep you all in my prayers, knowing God knows who you all are when I talk about you with all of your HS-nicknames.

Mara

Thank you for the prayers, I will pray for you too.  Yes, I agree that God knows who we all are by our HS nicknames, and I think if I were to meet you all someday, I would be tempted to call you all by your HS names.   :)
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline bluerose

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #91 on: September 11, 2017, 11:01:18 PM »
 Im sorry mara that you arecon this path you do not want. My h's d will be final soon too. Even though we have been living apart for almost 2 years it is still gutwrenching to know that it will be over soon. I still do not want a divorce. That word is so dirty to me but thete is nothing i can do. Sending you strength and hugs. Lots.

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #92 on: September 12, 2017, 09:12:24 AM »
Thanks all.


Having a bad day today. I react on things with so much emotion... I know I am processing all things and pain and at the same time being the parent my kids need, being (or trying to be) the responsible person at work, trying to keep all balls high at the same time and being so tired.

H sent me message he s going to pick up son later this Friday. I just said ok. But was thinking... he s never able to take over when I have something else to do, so I handle everything at the same time as I have my kids... and he s only responsible for son 11 once in two weeks for 18 hours and he shortens it all the time.

Wow all of you, I am just so very tired.... I feel I like to go into wintersleep and wake up when spring starts again.

Sry, mostly I can see the sun, staying positive, but for one day, today I can not....


Thanks I can ventilate

mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #93 on: September 15, 2017, 12:03:06 AM »
This week I am really cycling again.
I did not expect this to happen, as during the summer I started to be pick up my own life, and making my own decisions, and being not that dependant on what is happening to my relationship anymore.

Maybe because the definite closure of the marriage is near, although it was delayed with another month last week. I know emotionally spoken it s not good to let things endure indefinite for so long, and again and again...
But otherwise, it kept a little opening to recovery or restoration. I see it slowly minimize until there is no hope left. Maybe that s what is happening? And it makes me cycling again between all kind of high and low feelings. Hopes and desperation, being happy a bad time is about to end and being sad about the lost good things....

Am tired of this.... Really hoping for a night with sleep and no thinking, hoping for days where I just can enjoy the things that are good...

This evening son 10 will visit his father till tomorrow. I did not see h now in two weeks. I notice I do not feel anything about it, no bad feelings, no hopeful feelings.... maybe just... nothing...

I am aware this is a psychological defense in myself to keep me through some heavy times...

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #94 on: September 21, 2017, 12:15:06 PM »
I distanced myself after last contact with h.
Last week I picked up son10 at his place. He did not come out, to greet me.
We drove away then son noticed he forgot something at his fathers place so I returned (only few minutes after leaving). H was outside ready to leave on his bike and looked very frustrated towards me.
I did not leave the car but sent son to get his forgotten stuff.
When I started to leave again, h already left with his bike. I had to pass him with my car, and I could see he was very angry, so I passed him without greeting, as if he was a stranger.
My inside was really so angry.
I don t know why. Maybe I was just pretty pretty sure he was going to see an OW and felt caught. There was no real evidence, but it was my gutfeeling.
I drove home. Feeling a bit angry. Son asked me if I was angry. I told him I was not angry with him. He said he knew I was angry with dad. I said I think so but it ll pass again. Son said: Are you stopping to love him.
After this questions tears came down. I said I don t know if I love him. Coming home I put off my weddingring. For the first time in all these years, I wanted the distance to be real.
I don t know If this is ok? Am I not standing anymore? Or is this just a phase I go through?

After a few days I sent him an email to talk about the house. I iniate a new appointment but together with our lawyers. He reacted it was ok and so we are going to talk things through with the lawyers. Stupid idea we can not talk without lawyers, but I need it to be a good contract so we can exclude all the emotions.

I m very confused about things. About myself.
Maybe I need it for now to take the right decisions to protect myself and the kids and the house. If it is too close, I can not exclude my emotions.

Thanks for listening dear all here.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #95 on: September 21, 2017, 01:50:31 PM »
Hi Mara
We all go through so many phases and so many emotions.  As your H is doing things that are extremely hurtful to you, you have no choice but to put that oxygen mask on yourself and to guard your heart.
We used to say around here to put the love for your H in a box and carefully place it up on a shelf for now.

I think that may be what you are doing.
As for your wedding ring.  You don't need a wedding ring on your finger to be standing. I think it comes to a point where we often need to keep these things to ourselves.  We don't need to explain to others, as they are not walking in our shoes and won't necessarily understand.  It's exhausting to have to defend your thoughts and position to others who just want to protect you and think you might be opening yourself to further abuse.
How you feel and what you want to do is for yourself.  And that may change on a weekly or hourly basis. 
Hugs to you

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #96 on: September 21, 2017, 04:52:34 PM »
M.

This period is difficult and tense for you.

I agree with kikki - guard your heart.

I don't wear my wedding ring - I wear a silver band inscribed with Soli Deo Gloria, on the same wedding finger, I wear a ring my h. gave me after my d22 was born with three diamond chips in it.

Some time ago, my h. referred to the band as the wedding band he gave me on our silver anniversary, I quietly told him 'no, that one is safe upstairs in a box' - I think he was a little taken aback.  He told me about a year after he left that my wearing a wedding ring was disrespecting him so I took it off and went out and bought the silver band. It signals to others that I am married but it is not my wedding ring.

M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #97 on: September 22, 2017, 12:03:14 AM »
Thank you Kiki and Mitzpah

To be honest, it feels better on a distance...
And also without the weddingring. As if I am not lying to myself anymore.... H is not faithful, not keeping the promises, we are not committed anymore. In two weeks I have the papers which will tell me our marriage is official not a marriage anymore. This is reality. And although I believe in standing, believe in God, I know psychological it is a step for me to also take reality, to accept humanily spoken our marriage is over. This means our romance is over, but also the abuse is over. It is hard to choose the feelings, I miss the man I was romantically involved with for so long. I feel so absolutely free from the abusive side of this marriage, growing to the healthy person again, being independent in a healthy way.... so this is the mix-up in my feelings.

My kids will be my priority. So for them it is in important to find a good way of communication with their father. About them and about the finances/house so I can provide for them. So here is my goal for the coming weeks. Balancing on a cord between my hurted emotions and my longing to be free from all the negativity.

thx for the support
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #98 on: September 30, 2017, 02:05:11 PM »
I notice something strange.

As long as I keep my distance, h is a bit grumpy or trying, or in a way drawing (trying to draw) my attention, which I not give or just very serene. But the moment I initiate being friendly (still distant, but trying to be friendly anyway on the moments we meet, which is always when the kids are there too), he tries to find something to argue about.

Yesterday he picked up our youngest son. As I told before he ignores me, when he comes here. I decided I just say hi to him, if not for him then for my kids, who is in between of the two of us. So I said : Hi and bye. I noticed him looking to me with this face he was thinking: what s with her. (well, it is me to do so, but last four months I ve been silent). Today I came to his place to pick up son again. Tomorrow it is one year after his fathers death, so I said to him: Hang in there tomorrow, I know it is a difficult day. H again looked at me with the same look, said thank you and then came to me with two papers from my car insurance. The insurance continues to sent it on his name to him and not to me, although we both asked for it few times.
In the end it is no big deal, at least not to argue about, but he started to argue and giving me the feeling how frustrated he gets by getting mail for me on his address (wow, I get mail and phonecalls for his company all day for three years, and he refuses to move the company from my address, but only my carinsurance papers come there and he s furious). I know it is not about the insurancepaper. It is because he can not control me. He can not handle it I myself decide how I stand towards him, distant, friendly or whatever.
I see, everything he does, has to do with control or with the problems of losing control.

Next week divorce will be final. He s not showing me he s going to review it and I also not expect it to happen, at least not in this stage. We are both not ready for reconciliation. I do not exclude it in the future, but I am getting a live, and hope one day we will be in a stage we can be together again. Today I am sure I would not be able to handle him.

Three years ago BD was on its way... I could not imagine how I would feel three years after.

Although last months I really thought even my deepest love for h was gone, I know this love is still there. I felt it last few days. My head and heart are not on the same level for the moment.

hope everyone is ok.
I am not reading or writing as much as I did in the beginning. The thing is not my all day- business anymore. It is part of me getting a life....besides being an LBS :) I am happy of that.

But I will never forget you guys here, on the hardest moments in my life and marriage I found you and it was a blessing.... Until today....

Big hugs for everyone

Mara xxx
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #99 on: October 09, 2017, 08:01:44 AM »
Journaling


Divorce is finalized.

What is there to tell anymore?

The story of h and me is so complicated, I can not even tell it to someone....

Friday was D day.
After it, (I was not present), I sent him the last message: Ok, this is final now. I really hope it will bring you the luck you long for. Know my love for you always has been unconditional and real.

For the first time I wrote it in the past time.

Then I promised myself not to come back to this kind of messaging towards him anymore.

This morning he texted me back: I am happy this part is over. I think it is very important to take wise decisions. I think it is wise to stop try repare things that are broken and not working anymore. I think this and I think that.
I hope you are ok.

My mouth fell open. The whole message was about what he thinks is best.
He took all the decisions.... He first deliberately broke things and never tried one day to repair them. He never let me make my decisions, or give me any room to tell him my side. He always thought for the both of us....
And I don t not want him to know if I am ok or not...

I did not reply, because I promised myself.
But my heart cried. It is all about him. He stopped the marriage because of him, he leaves his kids to me... He did not even consider the kids in all of his decisions....

What scares me all the time is the way he says these things: As if he is the wise person, he believes he is doing the right things...and he expresses it this way to people around us. Only people really knowing him are not buying it, so he leaves them...
His family thinks he is really acting nice towards me all these years.... wow, they never saw the monster.
The things broken between us, were consequence of his monstering behavior towards me.
I could not let him hurt my kids or me... I had to set boundaries. And these boundaries made him monstering more...and now he says things like I do not understand him, I do not give him room, blablabla....

I am not really happy about everything, but also not wanting him back. Not now, but I really need very big big believe it is possible to change for him....

So I am not going to concentrate on that anymore. I will concentrate on my life, and my children.

Inside of me there is also something rebellious... I do not want to be controlled.... it s been too long and I don t want it. Part of my healing process I think.

Thanks all,


Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #100 on: October 09, 2017, 08:47:51 AM »
I think it is difficult to say anything except that I am sorry for all the pain.

The best thing is to really concentrate on your life and that of your children for now. Let him go, after all that is what he wanted. Whether he will change or not, remains to be seen and there is nothing you can do right now anyway.

I agree about ceasing all communication referring to both of you now. It is totally counterproductive and will only upset things. He needs to deal with his own issues now, solve his own problems.

Treat yourself kindly and gently - this is a period of feeling raw and numb almost simultaneously - give yourself time to settle your emotions and take practical decisions for life as it is now.
xxxxx
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #101 on: October 09, 2017, 02:59:31 PM »
I think you acknowledged his D beautifully Mara, and like you said, nothing else needs to be said at this point in time.

Sending you some (((HUGS))) because I know that it is not easy.  I can also tell you, having been D'd since April 2016 that he may think that he has made a wise decision, but things will be less than stellar for him.

His message absolutely shows that he is still in that selfish phase.

I understand your feelings about not wanting to be controlled.  I think that you're right that it is part of your healing process.  Continue to be gentle with yourself as you heal from this enormous blow that we have been dealt.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #102 on: October 16, 2017, 01:18:07 PM »
Thank you FW and Mitzpah.

I am cycling up and down.
Today I got the paperwork. Reading it, makes it so final.
I try to live my life now. It is without my h for 20 years. It is what it is already for 2,5 years (this week it s three years after BD) so whats different?
And at the same time it is different....

I also am very very tired. As if the tiredness of all emotions of last three years are coming out.

At the same time I am guiding my children through their grieving process.... The three of them are all different in it.
D (almost 18) is working hard on her study, but also not missing any social thing around her. I expect a day coming when she will collapse.... And then I need to be there for her.
S 15 does not want to see his father and is living in his own world. The only one who gets him out a bit is his girl. They have a nice pure friendship and she s really nice towards him.
Son 11 is grieving very hard. Sometimes crying, also having physical reactions, like head aches and stuff.
So having a full time job next to my full time job.
H is not doing things in this. He s seeing son 11 every other week on Friday and Saturday and doing nice things. It is nice, but it also means he s not helping him with his grieving, his homework, his sports and his music.
H is helping D with her drivinglessons. This was her way to give him a little place in her life. Every Thursday she s having lunch with him and they go drive the car together.

Me and the kids are developing a new way of being a family. Because of me working it is not always easy, but we are finding a way.

I am now telling people about the divorce. I do not like it, but also do not want to feed rumors so have to be honest.

Thanks all for reading a long

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #103 on: November 02, 2017, 03:04:39 PM »
Hi all

Not feeling very well lately.
Cycling after divorce. I am working myself again through the book 'Healing after hidden abuse' from Shannon Thomas. It was a book I read shortly after BD (last week that was three years ago). At that time I was not able to recognize things and also not able to accept the truth about what I thought was my marriage.

I can not say in which stage exactly I am now, because feeling like constantly switching between different stages. On the moments I am on my own, kids out going somewhere, no h around, all just like that, I can be feeling sad,  about things that are, but were not meant to be like that. Although me and the kids are close, we are a different kind of family. It is the way it works the best now, but I am not always happy about it, because it is the consequence of being a broken family. and the BROKEN in this is painful.
On other moments I feel anger about things that happened to me or the kids, situations with h. I get memories of things, I at the moment excused him for, but now am remembering them and thinking: Really h, you dared doing this to me. Throwing things at me or just next to me, and then saying, I did not mean to hurt you but I have no choice, there is so much anger in me. And on better times saying the anger was not even against me but against himself, but even though, the things were thrown at me.
Or the silent-treatment. Something that happened through our whole marriage. Making me work hard to make him feel good, but he not saying anything for days.... so the message towards me in a way was: you can try, but you will not succeed. Or....Me starting to think that I was the problem. And so on....memories coming up, needing to be coped with, feelings that need to heal.
Although I still am believing in restoration of marriage, I know I now need to go through this stage. A stage of grieving, being really angry, being sad, doing my own things without h, and not feeling guilty, ..... in order to heal. I do not know for sure if we will end up together again. For now I am sure he does not want that. But I am also not sure I want it, and it is probably because of the stage I am in. So I leave things open about restoration, because I think that maybe when I am passed this stage, I can take a different position towards him.
In order to give myself the chances to heal and to get rest, I am very dark towards h. I am not anymore thinking about what that must be like for him. I do this because I know this is better for me. We just hand over our youngest son every second weekend and sent messages about some financial things, but both are avoiding more contact, as well as positive as as negative.

Also feeling very tired. The stress of the last years, the hard work to get my marriage together, in order to see it ending up in divorce, took a lot of me. Although I felt tired for some time, I now can not push it back anymore.
This week had a week of holiday, and although sleeping a lot more then in a working week, I feel one week is not enough to get the rest I need.

Next week we have a meeting with two lawyers to talk things through about the house. I feel nervous. I want to avoid this meeting, but I know I have no choice.

In a few weeks our D will be getting 18. I am preparing her a nice party. She asked me not to invite her dad. She will have diner with him privately. I am ok with it. He would not have accepted it either, there will be too much people he rather wants to avoid now.

Just wanted to keep you all updated.
Hope you all are okay


Mara xxx
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #104 on: November 03, 2017, 06:40:42 PM »
Hi Mara, good to hear from you.  I'm sorry to hear you are so tired and not getting to catch up even with a little time off work.

Wishing you luck at your meeting.

Happy early birthday to your D.

I know how you feel with your feeling's of D.  The feeling of being a broken family and just you and the kids.  I also understand thinking back and remembering some of the not so great things that our H's did.  It makes me sad to hear that he would give you the silent treatment and also threw things near you/at you and then saying he had no choice.  I will say a prayer that he he will get to the root of his anger issues.

I've been listening to a lot of podcasts from Rick Warren recently and there was one that said to people dating, if your SO has anger issues, stop dating them, that it won't get better in marriage, and I think he is right.  I saw some anger issues from my H as well, but I ignored those warning signs.

I am glad that you are very dark towards him so that you can work on healing, and that you are working through the book by Shannon Thomas.  That sounds like a great book!

Sending you some (((HUGS))) Mara.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline rosecoloredglasses

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #105 on: November 04, 2017, 06:38:36 AM »
Hi Mara,

I am happy to read your update and know that you and your kids are doing okay.  I think you will be reflecting back on your life with H for along time and analyzing if there were signs of an unbalanced person or other red flags.  Every marriage has its struggles and we all learn and grow.  Throwing things around you sounds scary, though.  I am thinking of you and hoping that you and your H can keep moving forward individually and then maybe later, together if that is something you both want.

I know for sure that no matter what happens, you will eventually be a complete, healthy, and joyful person.  Having followed your story for the last 3 years, I see how strong you have been.  You have made the best of your situation in so many ways and when your H did deceitful things like taking money out of your account, you handled it with grace and love.  You got a full-time job and a boarder so you can take care of yourself and your children financially.  Even after all that your H has done, you still have empathy for him.  You are an amazing person, Mara.  Even just reading your words on this forum, I can feel your light shine. 

It's okay to need extra rest.  You have been through a lot and you are still processing everything.  Indulge yourself a little bit, especially when H has your youngest son.  It also may be a good idea to go to the doctor and have a check-up.  Sometimes stress can cause physical changes like a thyroid problem.  That can make you feel exhausted too, and is a common problem for women.   

Please keep posting your updates!  I will be cheering for you!
M-43
H-52
D-12
S-8
D-4

Offline Treasur

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #106 on: November 04, 2017, 06:58:43 AM »
I'm just a couple of steps behind you, Mara, and sending you my love. We didn't plan it, it wasn't what we would have chosen but it is also the end to a painful chapter and the chance to write a happier next one.

Look after yourself well x
T: 18  M: 12 (at BD)
No kids.
BD Oct 15. OW since Apr 16?
H filed Jan 17. Divorced April 18. XH married ow 6 weeks later.

Grateful for any appearance of the tiny karma bus  
"Option A is not available so I need to kick the s**t out of Option B" Sheryl Sandberg

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #107 on: November 06, 2017, 05:45:09 AM »
Thanks for all being so kind to me.The kindness of people, makes me want to cry....

Yes, it is a stage of reflection, finally recognizing, or accepting, ....
I realize I am living with broken dreams and still trying to keep the pieces together. But it is not working, so it makes me kind of angry and sad.

Tomorrow I have to meet h and the lawyers. I m not up to going.
Being dark or even NC feels far more comfortable for me.
I realize I have only one weapon against my h which helps me to not getting emotionally involved with him again (If that happens he gets his power over me ) and the is being angry. It s against who I am... You must have almost murdered me before I start to get angry.... last months I do feel this anger and I know it s part of healing. But still in the process I see I m prepared to give it up only for him being a bit nicer to me for a while, but in the end it ll give me nothing, and gives him the need to bully again to get his position back. So this psychological game is frustrating me....

Thanks again for the support, I ll keep you updated

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #108 on: November 20, 2017, 04:08:46 AM »
Last Thursday our D got 18 years. In our country she s an adult now.
It s supposed to be celebrated big and being a special moment.
As a preparation to this I made a movie of pictures and music from her birth till now.
It was putting myself on the emotional rollercoaster again, because of going into memory lane on purpose.

Her birthday was nice. During the day she went to visit H. He s giving her drivinglessons and they got lunch together. In the evening we had a small familyparty, without H, D did not want him there, and H himself did not ask for it.
In the weekend we celebrated big with lots of her friends. Although the cold autumnweather on her wish I prepared an outdoorparty in our garden. With a firebasket and no rain and lots of Christmas and campinglights in our garden we had this special evening where everyone was really enthousiastic.
Although missing H on this, I experienced the peace on this party. No h with tensed and unpredictable reactions which could make everybody uncomfortable gave me peace. Seeing my D's happy face because I was able to make it the party of her dreams, made me feel extra happy.


Since the meeting with the lawyers I hardly spoke with h. I know for me, my healing and my peace this is the best. I hear from friends who saw him together with other women. Because it s not always the same woman, I do not think he s really in relationship with one, but hearing it, hurts me. Sometimes I think the bad thing: what was wrong with me. But most of the time I can park the thoughts about him with OW's. I don t know what he s doing, so why making myself miserable. It s miserable enough without these thoughts.

About the house there is still insecurity. Also about my income. So today I sent some new letters to other helpcenters to sollicitate for a new job. It is again a step in the dark, not knowing if it is the right thing to do. The center were I work has my whole heart and it is only because they have financial insecurities I look around for other jobs to combine or to replace.

Looking at the last year I had to take many steps in the dark. I start to believe I am going to make it. Together with and for my kids. God is on my side, making things work together for good for me. My marriage was not good, so, despite the hurt and pain, my life is on the way to be good. With or without h. It s still a question with no answer. For now without is better.

Thanks all for reading along.
I am so busy sometimes I can not make it to read along here regular, but people I connected with during these MLC years are in my prayers, you can count on it.

Lots of love to everyone

Mara x
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #109 on: November 20, 2017, 04:52:02 AM »
M,

It is good to read your news! So glad you managed to have a good party for your D.

May God continue to guide your steps as you trust in Him.

((Hugs))
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #110 on: November 20, 2017, 02:58:20 PM »
Happy birthday to your D, Mara!  Sounds like a lovely party.   :)

I can resonate with a lot of what you write, as my path seems to be parallel to yours.

Although missing H on this, I experienced the peace on this party. No h with tensed and unpredictable reactions which could make everybody uncomfortable gave me peace.

I experience this some as the atmosphere was certainly different with pre-BD H.

So today I sent some new letters to other helpcenters to sollicitate for a new job. It is again a step in the dark, not knowing if it is the right thing to do. The center were I work has my whole heart and it is only because they have financial insecurities I look around for other jobs to combine or to replace.

I have been filling out job applications as well.

Looking at the last year I had to take many steps in the dark. I start to believe I am going to make it. Together with and for my kids. God is on my side, making things work together for good for me. My marriage was not good, so, despite the hurt and pain, my life is on the way to be good. With or without h. It s still a question with no answer. For now without is better.

(((HUGS))) Mara.  This definitely resonated with me.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #111 on: November 24, 2017, 08:21:06 AM »
Thank you Mitz and FW

Wow FW, you are on the same timeline as I am...

Last couple of days am cycling pretty hard. Even at work I had difficult times. Again crying everyday, well it helps, that is for sure.

H got to pick up s11. He came in and tried to find a subject to talk about. I notice myself I have a wall around my heart. It must not be easy for him to get in touch with me either. But I need the protection for now.

I do not know how to communicatie with a man in MLC or PD. I do not know when he is in the mood to understand just what I say or when he s going to make something else of it, feeling I am offensive or what ever. I never know if he s going to verbally attack me and so I built the walls...
Maybe it s not good. I m not sure.

Well, it s starting to get cold here. Even I, the person who is always the last one taking an extra sweater or putting the heater on, put on the heater at work. My co workers had to look twice it was really me doing so :)
One month before Christmas, time flies when having fun :)

Wishing you all a good weekend.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline kikki

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #112 on: November 28, 2017, 01:31:30 PM »
Hi Mara
Reading along and sending love and hugs your way XX

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #113 on: December 27, 2017, 07:38:33 AM »
Hi dear everyone

I am sorry I am offline for so long.
In a way it gives me rest not to lurk on my computer and social media too much. In the stage I am in, I am trying to gain some health and rest again after this very weary and hard period of three + years started with BD in October 2014 and followed by so many unpredictable things and stages, you all know about. Now I am recovering or trying to recover from an unwanted divorce. It was easy to flee to internet and tv and keep my brains working and working in order I could escape from the pain and the hurt, but in the end it is coming anyway. So it was and it necessary to limit myself in fleeing and giving myself the respect of the chance to mourn and heal, getting rest and coming clean with everything what happened, the injustice and the consequence of what is a very hard played divorce played by the man who I thought loved me.

I hope you all had peaceful Christmasday. It is the intention of Christmas anyway :)
I am grateful I had some time of off my job and we celebrated Christmas in church and with my family. Despite all nice and kind people who made me feel loved and beloved, I felt the pain of missing my h. It seems ironic though, I miss the one that rejected me so much that it even can make me feel sad while so many people are overflowing me with love.
Seeing the consequences of a broken family for my children also makes me feeling sad, and although I know I did everything I could to give them the safe haven, before and after divorce, I sometimes feel like a big failure because I couldn't prevent their home from breaking. They spent the holidays with me, and only yesterday they spent one day with their father. I am glad they had a nice day with him.

They do not see him often. Son11 sees him every other week for one day and night. D18 sees him for her drivinglessons every Thursday for only a few hours and s15 prefers not to see him during schoolweeks, so only in the schoolholidays he meets with him and even then very less, they see a movie or something or eat somewhere. It looks more like an adult son that visits his father now and then, and not like h has any role to play in his daily life anymore. Actually this is also with the other kids. H leaves all important things to me.

I went through a very cycling period. Times of frustration and anger then followed by crying days of feeling hurt and not understanding why this all had to happen. I still do not, I still can not explain to people who did not experience themselves what happened. I also can not explain to myself sometimes. It is complicated so very much.
Sometimes I notice my h also is grieving his loss, but he s dealing in a different way. He thinks he did the right thing and believing he was the victim of me, what gave him the right to break our family apart.

I wish everyone here a the best wishes for the new year already.

Keep you all updated

Mara xxx


I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #114 on: December 27, 2017, 09:24:30 PM »
Hi Mara, I haven't been on much the past few days.  I hope that you can continue with your healing and rest.  I'm glad you were able to celebrate Christmas with your family.  I understand your feeling's.  Christmas is so different for me now, as we would usually spend Christmas with MLCer's family.  It always feels like something is missing on Christmas.

I think we all did a bunch of cycling this month.  I hope and pray that 2018 is a blessed year for all of us.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline Chookie

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #115 on: January 08, 2018, 01:10:31 AM »
Hi Mara, good to read your update.

I'm sorry you are still cycling and feeling the loss of your H from your lives. I know exactly what you mean. I was very lucky and had my two brothers and their families and also my deceased B's wife and my niece to stay for a week or so over the Christmas period. It was so nice. I also got to see my S, which was fantastic! I did miss H, though notice it much more on New Years Eve. I hate being the odd one out at midnight! I often wonder if he thinks of me then too.

It sounds as though your H is still spinning, so best to leave him and keep GAL, as hard as that can be to do.

I'm glad your kids are still in contact with their dad, that's very important for them.

My very best wishes to you for a wonderful 2018!  :)
BD 29 Nov '13
Left home 8 June '14
Does not live with OW

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #116 on: January 11, 2018, 12:12:13 PM »
Hi Chookie, happy to hear from you :)

Now the holidays are over, I feel a bit better. Also notice if I amin periods were NC is possible, I feel better. Now We don t have to be in contact with each other till S11 next visit there. It s only next week friday and this nc brings some peace

Taking care of things myself makes me feeling stronger too. I can do it. 😉
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #117 on: January 12, 2018, 09:34:27 PM »
Hi Mara, I lost your thread. I am very sorry about the divorce. It's hard to believe it's real.

As nice as the holidays are, they can also be stressful. I find I'm enjoying a little peace after the holidays. Peace to you, as well.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #118 on: January 27, 2018, 01:39:27 PM »
Thx OR. Good to hear you. I will update soon.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #119 on: February 12, 2018, 02:43:40 PM »
Tomorrow is the first weddinganniversary after divorce. This sounds strange.
I was not expecting cycling down so hard this evening just because of a day coming up. I mourn everyday, getting stronger everyday too. But all of the sudden bam....

Not seeing or speaking a lot with h. Last week by picking up son at his place he asked me to wait for few minutes because they needed to finish something and then he left me on the doorstep in the cold.

I started wondering again where the man was that oncepromised to cherish and love me untill death do us part.

Start to believe that man is gone

Sorry, bit down today
Hugs mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #120 on: February 12, 2018, 05:03:56 PM »
Sending you some ((((HUGS))) Mara!  I have now celebrated 2 anniversaries after D.  I don't think it really gets any easier.  I celebrate that day because I meant my vows, and it's still the anniversary of me saying those vows and making a covenant with him.  You are allowed to your feelings and emotions on that day.  You are allowed to mourn that day as long as you need to. 
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #121 on: February 12, 2018, 08:36:43 PM »
Im sorry, Mara. That was so rude of your H to leave you standing in the cold. It's really hard when they are just plain mean, and nothing like the person you married. The person  you married is gone. Even if your H comes out of this, he won't be the same person.

Lots and lots of hugs for you. You will be ok. We'll all be ok.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #122 on: February 13, 2018, 01:34:46 PM »
Thanks FW, I hope I can start to celebrate it again in the future. Today I could not. The hurting feelings were too big. I know and feel what you mean though.

Thx so much OR for being here all these time I m no HS for me. Yes, he s not reminding me of the man I married any more. I miss that person. This one is rude and mean. What stage are we in.... I lost it somewhere.... might be not important.

I survived this day. A friend, also LBS but divorced for 10 yeaes+, called me.... letting me speak and cry, not judging, and....understanding. She recognizes a lot, but also.let me ve unique. It is such a gift having also someone like you huys here in real life.

Hope to cath up.with some threads during my off days the coming days.
Love you all
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #123 on: February 13, 2018, 01:56:09 PM »
M,

Just wanted you to know that I am thinking of you. It is not easy to remember what was and see what is.

I pray that he see soon the devastation he has caused you - to leave you on the doorstep in the cold shows how `switched off`he is :(

You are doing so well in bringing up your children! May God bless you!!!
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline Chookie

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #124 on: February 14, 2018, 02:41:30 AM »
You're so strong, Mara. It must be so hard when those dates come around.

Hugs and strength to you. Xxxx
BD 29 Nov '13
Left home 8 June '14
Does not live with OW

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #125 on: February 14, 2018, 03:30:51 AM »
Thank you so much Mitzpah. Knowing people like you thinking of me and praying means a lot to me.

The day after my 'weddinganniversary' it is Valentines day. It is less hurting then yesterday.
After the phonecall with the friend I could get my senses together again.
I realize I m not my pain, I am not my divorce, I am not the person H wants me to think I am.
I am not perfect and was not in a perfect marriage, but I do not deserve to be left in the cold, or to be rejected, for whatever reason. So he is wrong. He may believe this, I can not change that, I also do not try anymore. But I may believe God made me as his beautiful daughter.
There is a twist in all of my thoughts and feelings. I know...our marriage was dying and not healthy. I know we had to do something, and I know I did whatever I could to prevent divorce and find other ways to get out of the problems.
Now divorce is a fact, I know I may let go.... It s scary and freeing at the same time.
I was hoping and praying a long time for restoration of my marriage. I was pleading to God for this, believing this is what only He could do. Also believing this was the only Christian way to think.  I still believe God and his power in this. But realizing, God can but not always do, or has another timing. He is keeping me strong in this brokenness and using my brokenness as a testimony ( I did not choose for that) Because something else is also going on.
My brokenness,my experience with MLC and narcissism made me a kind of an expert in the field I am working in. I work with victims of human trafficking, sometimes being in slavery of abusive men and women, used in forced prostitution or otherwise. Lot of the patterns of them breaking free are similar with the process of healing I needed after being in a what was ought to be a loving marriage, but seemed to be a toxic relationship with someone having a disturbed personality and on top of that caught by MLC. Now I know people with this PD has more chances to get in MLC then healthy men.
So in my sessions with ladies who are so used and broken, sometimes already when they were only children, I can relate and help in a different way. And the other side, without knowing what I was going through, they helped me...
Wrestling together with them in their pains, was and is healing for me.
I now have a parttime payed contract in this ministry were I started to work as a professional volunteer. And big part of my life is in the center, over and over again meeting with this vulnerable ladies.
I know for sure I could never have done this with my h controlling, commanding or being negative about every thing I do on my side. It was way of handling jealousy, if I did something good or special, he would criticize or being negative, or whatever.

So yes, the twist I was talking about is what Mitzpah says: rembering what was and seeing what is... Sometimes I only remember the bad things, and knowing the present is far more better. Other times it is the other way around. In the present I miss the good things of my relationship with H.


Well, so far my story....before I am starting to be too philosofopical, this in another language :)

Wishing you all a good Valentinesday. May some loved one, a child, a neighbor, a friend show their appreciation to you today in a special way.

Blessings

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #126 on: February 16, 2018, 11:38:04 AM »
Beautiful post Mara.  My heart has been sensitive to those women for a long time and it cheers me to know that there are people like you out there fighting to give them what they need!  I follow the A21 campaign, not sure if you've heard of it, but they do a lot of rescue work for women who have been trafficked.  It sounds like your ministry is very similar. 
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #127 on: February 17, 2018, 02:34:10 PM »
FW , Yes I know A21. The walk for freedom :) I walked it in my city last fall.
Thanks for your reply.

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #128 on: March 19, 2018, 10:38:35 AM »
Hi guys

there was a time, almost 4 years ago now, I could not survive a day without coming on this forum few times a day. It is different now, not that I do not want to but my life is no longer constantly about my MLCer and all questions, pains, consequences, anxieties, and so on.
It has been a lifeline at the time.
For now I notice, I m not in need of going on to read something that possibly can give me a direction of a thought to understand or redefine my h actions or sayings towards me.
I am very thankful HS was here together with RMM.

Looking at how I am today things are still difficult and sometimes unreal. I can wake up in the morning and then realizing...Oh I am still in the nightmare, it s not even a dream, it is for real.... But more and more there are other days. Days I can see beauty in it, I can enjoy things, the company of people, laughter of my kids, and although spring does not want to start in Europe this year, I am enjoying my garden, seeing the sun, the snow.

The moments I experience as the hardest are when I am tired, of doing everything by myself, and not having time doing something for myself. Or these moments where my upgrowing kids all last minute announce they are not home for dinner, when I cooked and I m too late to even find a friend last minute to spent time with. As if my life will continue to be about others, and when is it me time. Knowing me h is taking his time for over 100% and when there is time left he meet sometimes the needs of his kids, I feel sometimes things like: wow this ain t fair, or when is it my turn?
But seeing my kids, I know why .... I want to double all my effort to compensate their loss and give them the good start for their adult lives.

Well this is a short update on me.

Love to you all
Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #129 on: March 19, 2018, 04:01:31 PM »
Hey Mara!  I'm glad that you are finding time away to not think about MLC 24/7.

I understand about things being difficult as the one mainly in charge of the kids.  I hope that you are able to take time for you when you get it.  (((HUGS)))
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #130 on: March 19, 2018, 04:02:41 PM »
Hi, Mara,

Just saying hi, it's nice to hear from you.

Yes, we keep going, it's not always easy but the point is we do. We do shoulder our responsibilities, we do get on with life, we do find joy, we do it. 

Your children will always know who was always there, that I can promise.

I'm glad there are good days, and I, too wish that spring would come to Europe!

x

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #131 on: March 19, 2018, 04:12:15 PM »
Mara,

I understand the exhaustion of being the only one to be responsible... then, the kids don't turn up for the meal or they are not very thankful. Every day, it is same all over again - care for the house and kids, work, home, cook, clean and it is always on repeat! Whereas their father is able to choose when to see the kids and only has himself to take care of.

I think we often demand too much of ourselves, we are always pushing ourselves to be the perfect mother, housewife, worker... I have learned cut myself some slack sometimes, of course, when your kids are older it is a bit easier to say -'dinner is whatever you find in the fridge!' :P or, you close the door on a particularly untidy bedroom 8) - I am little 'lighter' nowadays ;D

It is true, the kids know who is there for them.

I hope spring comes soon!! We are going into autumn here but it is still very hot!
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline Chookie

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #132 on: March 20, 2018, 02:28:52 AM »
Hi Mara, thanks for the update!

I'm very much the same as you. Life takes priority now, although I'm very lonely. My kids are grown so I go one day to the next with little contact with anyone outside of work.

I think I'm cycling a bit at the moment and H is on my mind quite a lot more than usual. It's frustrating! I'm waking and wondering how this all happened and why? Ridiculous!

It was a miracle to find this site when we needed it the most and it's a blessing to know it's always here, with its wonderful members ready to listen and support, whether we need it five times a day or every few months.

Hugs to you.. Xxx
BD 29 Nov '13
Left home 8 June '14
Does not live with OW

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #133 on: March 20, 2018, 02:18:57 PM »
Thanks for the replies and support.

You all are rolmodels to me.
FW you always understand....

T&L, Chookie and Mitzpah, thanks for your insights and support. It means a lot to me.
Chookie, if you were not on the complete opposite of the world compared to where I am, we could go for a coffee and forget all about our mlcers....

today struggles with my almost 16 teenage son. H is not involved in his life and not raising him at all. My 18 year old Dfound a balance to give her dad some limited space in her life. S11 sees him every other week because of courtdecision. S16 really does not want to have anything to do with his dad. This makes me the person that is in charge or in need to raise him, to get all puberty related issues on me and so on. On the other hand I also get his lovely moments




I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #134 on: March 20, 2018, 05:10:40 PM »
I had some struggles with my S17 when he was 16 too.  Fortunately, we were able to work through things and things got better when he became S17.  For anything that I couldn't figure out myself, I asked my B to help out with.  We were living with him at the time, and he was the first male figure that my S had around when he was little, so there was some mutual respect there.  I am grateful for their relationship.
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #135 on: March 22, 2018, 02:27:29 AM »
Hi, Mara,

I think that in many cases we do end up being the ones raising the children, and I know that in my own case I've found it easier to just accept that and get on with it.

You are right, it also means that we get all the good bits, and it will also mean that for us as a family, which at this point is me and my children, we will have got through all the hard things as well as the good parts together.  That means a lot to all of us.

I've been (mostly) through the teenage struggles; my children are now university age, and there is a difference -- I've found that keeping on talking and yes, having decent male role models (my brother, a cousin, some excellent male teachers, etc.) has been the thing.  Now that they are older we do frequently talk about the growing-up period, it's interesting and really does bring us close. 

I'm sad that my H chose not to participate; he has had every opportunity and used to do bits and pieces -- such as drive them somewhere -- but that isn't really being there.  I've learned that trying to explain he difference to him doesn't really work, and that as with so many things in MLC until he really is listening it is counterproductive to try, it just comes across as nagging. 

I know it's hard, Mara, and I also know that you will keep on putting one foot in front of the other, and will get there.  I remember that there were several years when absolutely each and every conversation was a "teaching moment" -- there literally wasn't one time when we just talked, it was always something.  It was exhausting, but that also passed, and it was an essential part of their growing up for all of us. 

I am grateful for the good relationship I have with my children; like your S one of mine doesn't want anything at all to do with H, the other two very occasionally respond to a text; they have seen him twice in the past 9 or 10 months.  I don't know how long this "phase" will last, but as H is further and further into whatever land he is in, we don't count any more.

It's a day that looks like it might be spring here, I do hope you can take joy in the days the sky is blue!

x

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #136 on: March 30, 2018, 09:03:45 AM »
Thanks for your posts T&L andFW. It helps a lot.
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Chookie

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #137 on: March 30, 2018, 03:00:07 PM »
Mara, I'm just stopping in to say hi. I hope things are going ok for you and that things have settled a bit with H and also your S almost 16. The kids really suffer through this, no wonder he's feeling like he wants nothing to do with the man who abandoned him.

Take care, my friend.
Chookie xx  :)
BD 29 Nov '13
Left home 8 June '14
Does not live with OW

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #138 on: April 21, 2018, 01:07:15 PM »
My s16  asked me if he could go camping with some friends all of them 16 after the exams in june.
I asked him questions like are there any adult people, how are you going to organise things, how are you keeping things under control, .... the meaning of my questions was to try to get an open conversation.
Son was in defense immediately saying me and his dad would say no as always...(which is not how I react most of the times but ok....puberty).
I talked to h about it who indeed immediately said no.
I told s16 we think it s to early to do so.
Son 16 accepted and did not talk about it anymore.

But then.... behind my back h talked to s16 and got the conversation I tried to have.
H came to.me and started a conversation of how I should be more trusting my son and what I need to know, which conditions to let him go on this camping.
Because I said no to son 16 without talking.
But it was not like that. I was prepared to talk and discuss but s16 did not want, I asked H his opinion who said no immediately, which I then told son 16 and now it seems all the other way around. Especially in s16 eyes h now seems on his side.
I am so confused. H talked reasonable to me but my feeling was he was up to something....getting a better  relation to his son, which is needed, but despite my position to our son.

I feel a bit betrayed....

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #139 on: April 21, 2018, 03:18:19 PM »
Sadly, you cannot trust your H at all. He will do anything to make himself look good.

My suggestions for your S16: Always find out the facts by prefacing with "Wow, that sounds like it would be a lot of fun. I have some concerns. It's not that I don't trust you, but I don't know how these other people will handle...." and then list your concerns. It takes the pressure off of your S and puts it on his friends. Then you wrap it up with Thank you for that. I know it's important to you, so let me think on it so I can give you a fair decision."

This shows your S you are not dismissing his desires as if they are not important. It also short circuits any attempts on your H's part to make you the bad guy.  Then you really think about what your S says, and if you still have concerns,  let him know.

The truth is, when they are 16, you can't stop them if they decide to go. You have to make him want to respect your decision for him not to go, if that is your decision.

Be honest with your son. Explain to him that you are confused, because his dad told you that S could not go, yet now it seems like his dad wants him to go. Ask S what he thinks about the situation. When done use "Thank you for that. I know it's important to you, so let me think on it."

Sometimes, the teenagers don't really even want to go. They actually want the parents to be the bad guy and say no. Then they don't look wimpy. ;)

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #140 on: April 21, 2018, 03:26:41 PM »
Hi, Mara,

I agree with what off-road said; I would add that it may well be time to say to our S that playing you off against your H isn't right. 

As you are the parent with the responsibility, I think it would be you that gets to make the decisions....   at least that has been my own experience. 

Parenting teenagers is difficult in the best of times, these added challenges don't help at all...  I know that for quite a few years during that time I had to take a deep breath very often, before carefully saying my piece, whatever the situation may have been.  And there were many.... 

Sorry that's not more detailed, it is so hard when inside we want to trust our spouses, but find out again and again that we just can't.

x

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #141 on: April 23, 2018, 08:12:08 AM »
Thanks OR and Trust....

I agree OR and I think it was the way I did want to talk to S were he was not open to it at the time but trying to force me to say yes.
H ran off with it behind me back and did the nice guy thing toward S.
I m mostly regretting that I for once involved H in it.
I am indeed the one taking all responsibility and when it comes to it preparing and solving every issues related to the kids.
He perfectly used the opportunity he saw to make himself, read: the absent father thinking first of himself, look nicer in the eyes of the son who till now criticed him the most according to his leaving and lifestyle.

H told the kids also that if they are out late which happens on their age, and I say something like : let me now where you are and what time you come home, so I do not have to worry, it s my problem of not letting them go.... ?? I just should go to sleep and if I can t sleep because D18 or S16 are not home on the given time that s my problem and not theirs> I try to make appointments with the kids so we respect each other in the house, and they know I just want to know they are safe nothing more.  According to other parents I let them free more than their friends, as a consequence of being the only responsable parent. I try to communicate and indeed try to see what they think is important and what I think is needed ....

For now s16 did not talk about the camping anymore. H told me he is going to call me this wednesday so I have time to collect my concerns and conditions till then, and then he wants to talk to son. I said I will talk to son myself. If he after that want to be there too is okay. He was bit upset about that, but I am not investing in my R with h but in my R with son.

OR, I definetely will use the words you said.

I learn not to trust h for now. I am wondering if I ever can....

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline Mitzpah

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #142 on: April 23, 2018, 09:35:21 AM »
Mara,

This is all so difficult. Things do not go the way we think they should or the way we imagined they should because of the upbringing we gave our kids.

This situation with your son is almost exactly the same I have had with all my children. It was then that I had to learn to have fewer and more simple boundaries with my children and to take myself out of coparenting with their father on these issues. I found that I tried to enforce certain boundaries with the children and then their father would step in to be the good, friendly dad and I was the strict disciplinarian with hang ups that would harm the kids :-\ I was also told on many a occasion that I should be closer to the kids and take time to listen to them, to understand them as well as he did...

It takes time but things shake down again - unfortunately this is a time where the fallout from the broken marriage damages our kids. I found that I had to spend more time praying for my kids, trusting that God will take care of them. And He does :)

My boundaries with the kids are very simple and one of them is while they live with me, they are to tell me if they are going to spend the night out or not. They need to tell me if they intend to eat at home for meal planning. No swearing, smoking or heavy drinking in the house. They will answer when spoken to! No revolving doors on different partners, I have a right to my privacy in the home so I do not want to get up in the middle of the night to meet somebody I don't know in the corridor. I keep my own room tidy and I expect them to do the same but I do not rush around picking up after them or making their beds anymore.

On my part, I make sure I connect with each of them every day, even if I don't see them. I make it my business to have an idea of their schedules so that I can support them in making sure their laundry is at least washed and dry and there is food available.

They are older now and we have settled into a relatively smooth life, they respect me and can be helpful more often than not. I think they recognize the effort I put into running the house and will sometimes express their thanks verbally and affectionately. :)

It takes time and I feel for you with yours still so young. It is not easy. Hang in there!
M 56
H 56
S 26
S 24
D 23
BD 13 Dec 2010
Divorced 27 Feb 2015 (30 years marriage)

"For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future" Jeremiah 29:11

Offline Trustandlove

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #143 on: April 23, 2018, 10:43:35 PM »
Hi, Mara,

I thought of a few more things that I did, maybe something might be useful.

My H also accused me of "not cutting the apron strings"; my response was that as he wanted me to raise the children, he had to trust my "raising".  I also, in some situations, told them that I was raising them with the values that he and I had always had. 

My H has at times compared our children to "others", finding ours somehow less "something", when he did that I pressed to find out exactly who he was comparing them to, there was of course no answer.

I think all that is because they KNOW that they aren't there, aren't doing their bit, so they try to muscle in at times and feel "in charge".  The best response by far has been to remain calm and remind him that I am the one doing the raising, that we (kids and I) are a family and we sort these things out together. 

He once even said "why do you have the right to tell them anything?" -- that actually made me laugh; the answer was of course because I am their mother and I am the one caring for them. 

I learned not to hesitate to say that if he had different thoughts he was very welcome to discuss them with me, but that going around me or behind my back wasn't on in any circumstances. 

In my case my H once did say explicitly that he wanted me to raise the children, so that did give me a hook for all this, but I do think it applies in so many of our situations. 

It got easier once I fully got it that I was the one in charge, and that didn't mean being a dictator, but that I did get to impart my values.

Kids need  boundaries, it makes them feel safe.  And that isn't being a dictator, it's being someone they can rely upon..

x

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #144 on: April 24, 2018, 12:49:48 PM »
Thanks so much Mitzpah and Trust.
Your posts are so practical and giving me tools.

A friend of me also in the situation has kids bit older and saying same as you Mitzpah.

I am the one in charge, raising them and ....
It makes me indeed also the one always setting boundaries and limitations.

H did not look after them for three years and now is stepping in on times where he can be the good nice dad. When he is in a bad mood or tired he s not here. When I am I still need to do everything for our family.
So wow.... it s so not fair... but I know the kids know too.

This time I really am sad about the damage done to our kids. They do not deserve this.
Amen Mitzpah.... I pray too....

Thx again.

Hugs Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #145 on: June 09, 2018, 02:46:21 PM »
Cycling 😢. Really not feeling well....
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline hopeandfaith

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #146 on: June 09, 2018, 04:06:40 PM »
Hugs Mara :-\. Hang in there.  You sound absolutely worn out.  I hope you get a break soon from being so grown up while everybody else seemingly gets to grow up on their own fractured time.  Your time will come.
BD's in May 09, Sept 12 - suspected OW
Left home Jan 12 2013
OW confirmed Feb 2013
Moved home April 11 2014
BD again in April 2017 - clinging. 
Moved out July 2017
D18, D16 and S14

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #147 on: June 09, 2018, 10:10:24 PM »
Thx. Just so tired of holding on. Life goes on, work goes on, responsability for my kids goes on....everything goes on...
And h just can say :You do everything on your own... no patience, no love, no nothing...
I guess I m worn out a bit.

Will find my strength back but thankful I can put it here when not feeling strong at all

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline OffRoad

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #148 on: June 09, 2018, 11:06:10 PM »
Virtual Hugs and support, Mara. It's ridiculous when the MLCER says things that are none of their concern since they are not the ones there day in day out. It's very hard being a single parent. I only had to manage one for 2 years, and I still remember:get up at 5:30, get him up and ready for carpool, go to work, no lubch, leave at 3, travel half hour to pick him up, 45+ minutes to get home with dropping carpool, help with homework,  make dinner, do dishes, clean something or do laundry, make his lunch for the next day, pass out, rinse and repeat. I was exhausted every day. I can't imagine how tired you are!

I hope you cycle up soon. More hugs.

When life gives you lemons, make SALSA!

Offline Chookie

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #149 on: June 10, 2018, 02:11:04 AM »
I'm sending lots of hugs and support too, Mara. I'm sorry you're feeling so low..I'm kinda there with you just now.

Just remember you're doing the hard yards, you are an amazing mum and you should give yourself a break. Schedule some Mara time, even just a short walk.

Thinking of you, my friend. Xx
BD 29 Nov '13
Left home 8 June '14
Does not live with OW

Offline MaraTopic starter

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #150 on: June 10, 2018, 07:08:50 AM »
Thanks for being here with me. You understanding it is so helpfull

I m worried h is cycling down too. He was playing his acts of superman in his new context. His new work and friends saw him as an interesting person with potential. I was wondering how long he was going to keep up that appearance.

S11 and D18 were noticing he could not keep up. Now he s sending s11 back home to me during the period he should be with him, or he ssleeping all the time not giving any attention to his son.
The very few times in my busy schedule I ask to change something on my behalf it is a big drama and I get monsteringbehaviour how I m not taking enough responsability. But he s always changing things where I should keep the kids with me during his time.

I am worried but do not want to ve involved in his cycling anymore. I learned how free it is without living in his drama after being in there for20 years. But it feels like it will continue to come after me.

Thx all for your hugs. I got them💚

Mara
I want to believe there's meaning here

Offline FaithWalker

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #151 on: June 11, 2018, 04:31:32 PM »
Thinking of you Mara.  I hope that you can remain free from his roller-coaster cycling and that you get some rest to handle all of your responsibilities.  Give yourself some grace!  (((HUGS)))
M-39
H-42
S-17
D-15
S-12
Friends for 7 years before dating
Married for 14 years
BD 12/14/15 - 2 weeks after 14th anniversary
Divorce final 4/13/16
EA - 9/15-4/16
New GF 12/16
Engaged to her 6/17 (I found out 8/10/17)
Moved to her State 4 States away - 7/13/17
Engagement off 8/20/17
Moved back to our State 8/24/17
Joined POF within the first month back


Link to my journey: 
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=10203.msg671589#msg671589

"Life isn't about waiting for the storm to pass... it's about learning to dance in the rain."

"Never become a container for bitterness.  Bitterness is a toxin that destroys what it's carried in."

"Sometimes -- some things have to break all apart so better things can be built."

Offline UrsaMajor

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Re: Standing on a path I didn't plan...
« Reply #152 on: June 12, 2018, 04:20:03 AM »
Give yourself some grace!  (((HUGS)))

And a new Thread!
Me - 54
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Together 20 years - Married for 17 at separation
S - 11
D - 7
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BD#1 - August 2015
Atomic BD - 13 Dec 2015
House sold and separated - March 2016
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A "friend" will not "stand by you" no matter what you do. That is NOT a friend. That is an enabler. That is an accomplice.
A REAL friend will sit you down and tell you to your face to stop being a firetrucking idiot before you ruin your life and the lives of those around you.

 

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