[WHY]

Previous Thread https://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=7391.0

To follow up on my comments.  Isn't it better for them to leave out the gates vs staying at home?  I know HS, RCR and the vets here advocate sticking it out as long as possible.  BUT, what about the damage that takes place after bomb drop with say an at home, low energy wallower hanging around?

Well, in my case I left the house six months after BD after she demanded -and her therapist supported- that it would be better for me to give her space, I took therapy for six months and some self help courses, and one year down the road I feel I'm in a much better place, I really think the distance has really helped me to recover, but at the same time she really blames me for "abandoning" her with the kids and she's using that anger to fuel and replenish her resentment, so I would think it depends on each one's situation and history.

Algo don’t think too much of it.  Honestly I’ve found with my MLCer, it’s a lose lose no matter what you do.  You cannot win.  Damned if you do.  Damned if you don’t.   I used to get upset about it.  But once you realize your actions can’t appease them in any way.  It’s a lot easier to detach. 

[Dragonfly33]

I agree with why. I used to bend backwards for my xh to convinced him that I was a good wife and that we were compatible because he told me we weren’t compatible after 11 years of marriage. Well as Why said, damn if you do, damn if you don’t. They will always find a reason to justify themselves. Best thing I ever did was to move away from him without any contact. Only then I was able to see the whole MLC for what it is. Only then I am peace again. I can be my authentic self and I don’t have to worry whoever he is entangled with (borrowing Jada Smith’s nice word for cheating). I still cry every time I remember what happened or when something reminds me of my previous marriage but I am in a much better place now.

[Treasur]

There’s a tv reporter here called Vanessa Feltz who I heard talking on a podcast about her marriage ending 20 years ago....17 years married, two teenage kids, she knew nothing about it, typical BD and her then h was having multiple affairs it turned out. She said he dropped the first bomb saying he was thinking about divorce, refused to say anything more but say he’d give her 12 weeks ‘on trial’....can you imagine??....and then left 7 weeks later still refusing to say anything truthful about what was really going on. Even all these years later, you could hear the old echo of her shock and complete bewilderment. Bc tbh it’s a deeply abusive way to behave, isn’t it? To betray a spouse, unilaterally blow up a family’s life and yet feel entitled enough to put the spouse on some non-specific trial or demand that they ‘prove’ their value to you. Ridiculous actually....but most of us fell for some version of it at least for a little while bc we were shocked, heartbroken and afraid.

Imho it’s easier - if still deeply difficult - to grieve the loss and adjust to a situation you didn’t choose without carrying this kind of nonsense burden too. It’s not a normal, reasonable or respectful thing for anyone to ask of you....and sometimes reducing contact is the only way to see that.

[WHY]

You said it.   Absolutely the right word to use.  ABUSIVE. 

That’s why I fully stand behind the MLCer moving out and moving on.  Either immediately.  Or even better.  When the LBS is ready for it.  Because if LBS us out of the picture, they can’t give the MLCer the “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” blame opportunities. 

[MadLuv]

I definitely agree that separation and distance is the best healer for the LBS. You can’t think clearly while still in the muk!! There are so many things that the veterans tried to 2x4 me with, but when your devastated and confused you have to clear your head to see and hear what you need to. Only then can you truly start your own healing .

[xyzcf]

madluv wrote:

I definitely agree that separation and distance is the best healer for the LBS. You can’t think clearly while still in the muk!! There are so many things that the veterans tried to 2x4 me with, but when your devastated and confused you have to clear your head to see and hear what you need to. Only then can you truly start your own healing .

Everyone's situation is different. For some, it is necessary for them to have no contact with the MLCer. Others have found that they can have contact.

I DO NOT think that healing is only possible if you have no contact.

My opinion, in my situation was I wanted to be able to have contact with him without it shaking me. He cannot have that power.

I also think, in my situation, that my being open to contact has allowed our daughter to have a better relationship with her father.

There are other LBSers who have continued contact with their spouses.  I do not see that they are any less healed for doing so.

Each situation is different and each LBSer needs to reflect on what is best in their situation.

[MadLuv]

Xy- I agree. I meant more that you have to separate yourself from the situation and chaos when necessary. That doesn’t always mean complete non communication, but if you feel you yourself are cycling or it’s affecting you then you pull back. I have had communication heavily with my MLCer. I have also gone no contact for periods for my own health. I believe it is necessary to listen to yourself and how you’re affected and adjust. I have always agreed it doesn’t ever have to be cut and dry. I think we are on the same page on that. I am a stander for friendship with my XH, but I also knew and know when I need to take my own time out from him to grow. Distance when needed absolutely saved me. Also, all MLCers are different and so one MLCer may be more damaging then others. It is always an individual case scenario.

[Reinventing]

xyzcf:

I DO NOT think that healing is only possible if you have no contact.

I don't think anyone is saying that healing is "only possible" with no contact.

I think that for some, a period of no contact allows them to heal and then be able to make decisions about the next steps. No contact--for a time--can help *some* LBS heal and strengthen. It's not an all or nothing thing. It's not "only possible".

No contact can be part of the journey. It doesn't have to be, it's not the "only possible" way to heal, but it can help some people heal.

[marvin4242]

I don't think anyone is saying that healing is "only possible" with no contact.

I think that for some, a period of no contact allows them to heal and then be able to make decisions about the next steps. No contact--for a time--can help *some* LBS heal and strengthen. It's not an all or nothing thing. It's not "only possible".

No contact can be part of the journey. It doesn't have to be, it's not the "only possible" way to heal, but it can help some people heal.

I would like to go a little further than that. By nature someone suffering "MLC" is suffering from a form of psychological crises, and there seem to rather recurring patterns to their behaviour. These include lying, confusion, gaslighting, directed anger and projection and put down to people closest to them, including the LBS. There is no basis in saying that it is ok to interact with someone who is behaving in such a way. Whether we love our MLCers or not, whether we hope to reconcile or not, and whether there are children involved or not doesn't alter this fundamental truth. To interact in this disordered manner is challenging and potentially very damaging and it does not seem to impact the disordered individual in any way shape and form. So what is the point of it? What does an LBS gain by suffering further harm when there has already been so much? What can children who are also harmed and probably very confused by their parents behaviour gain by continued exposure?

When and IF any of us get to the true point of detachment then we can choose what if any advantage there is to interact with our MLCers. But until then no or limited contact and firm boundaries are critical to recovery and healing. And I say this as a someone who still has contact with my MLCers six years out, but I definitely have had extended periods of no or limited contact. Initially in the early days, and now when her behaviour swings back into being highly destructive. I don't need to stick my hand in the blender in the name of caring.

[Treasur]

Perhaps ‘minimise your exposure’ is a more useful phrase than ‘no contact’?
Bc it describes the purpose more than the activity or bc it is more respectful of the differences in situations.

[Songanddance]

That’s why I fully stand behind the MLCer moving out and moving on.  Either immediately.  Or even better.  When the LBS is ready for it.

And if as in my case the MLCer refuses to leave?  In the UK if a house is owned jointly - then one cannot force the other to leave; they can't even sell the house without joint permission.
If he had chosen to leave,  I might have got my act together a little quicker - there is no guarantee and remember that lots of MLCers are clinging boomerangs so whilst they may leave - they are often back or around. 

I refused to sell my house and should we have divorced then H couldn't even assume I would sell it as we had a child who was still in full time education and my salary paid the mortgage so any court would have insisted that the house could only sold once our S was 18 or older and out of full time education.

I think I healed pretty quickly in the 9 yrs that H and I continued to share the house after BD in 2013.  It took me time to get started but 18 months down the road - I was on my way to really grasping this malarky called MLC. 

10 yrs on from BD - H and I are reconnected but I doubt we will ever reconcile - H has apologised and begun to apologise more often voluntarily but his business partner has seemed to usurp me so I leave him to it.

[Dragonfly33]

Some people can detach while being still in contact with the MLCer. As for me, it was killing me both emotionally and psychologically. My emotions rocked back and forth, and at some point it became exhausting. I felt like I was never getting out of it. I felt small, ugly, and worthless. I questioned my value myself. It was the most painful decision to kick him out from my apartment. After a year of no contact, only then I saw that it was not a healthy relationship at all. Perhaps some are good at blocking the unnecessary noise but I'm definitely not one of those.

In the other website, in the beginning of this whole MLC they insisted doing NC. At the time, I was very hurt and I couldn't understand why I should do it. Looking back, I would say I should have done it earlier. I was just scared at that time that I would lose him. But I didn't realize that I already lost him from BD.

[Thunder]

Dragonfly, that is one of the biggest misconceptions LBS's have.  Fear!
If I go NC, or I start living my life without them, it will give them the impression I don't care and they may move on.

But they have moved on, and sometimes they need to fear you have also. 
You are not just waiting around for them to come around.  You are living your life,
and sometimes THAT is what scares them more than anything.
Wait, why are they just letting go?

I'm not a fan of NC but there are instances where it is best for you to move forward.
Now having said that, if young children are involved it's almost impossible to go NC and co-parent, then low contact is best, or Dim.  Only contact, when necessary, over the children....and only if it is important.

That does NOT mean "family time."
They blew up that family and have no right to "family time" anymore.

They now gave a right to spend time with their children, but not as a family unit no longer, that was the choice they made when they walked away.

That's another thing I think LBS's get wrong.
They want to show their spouse what it felt like to be a family, maybe they will miss us all being together like this.

But it doesn't.  It only gives them no motivation to change.  They can have their freedom and still have their family whenever they need that fix.
Take that fix away from them unless, or until, they want to be a proper spouse and parent.

I've never seen any MLCer come back unless they have missed what they threw away.

[Algo]

If I go NC, or I start living my life without them, it will give them the impression I don't care and they may move on.

Indeed, that fear is awful, really keeps you from taking wise decisions, particularly when the MLCer comes from an abandonment background, we LBS fear they will revive all those feelings and complain about us doing the same, but really, it's a catch 22 situation.

[Treasur]

If I go NC, or I start living my life without them, it will give them the impression I don't care and they may move on.

With the great gift of hindsight lol…I think we FEEL it’s a Catch 22 situation more than it is in reality for most of us. Like Dragonfly said, usually the real reality is that we have already lost the marriage we had whether we like it or not. That we have to live life without them bc they left, either in one swoop, in bits or emotionally. We all deny that a bit in the first year or so, I think, which is understandable but imho can be a false premise. ‘Leaving’ them by detaching feels like a kind of abandonment but usually the truth is that we are ‘leaving’ someone who has already left us, aren’t we? I’m not sure we get much of a choice about that. The choices we tend to have are about what kind of post bD life we build, how we find our own way to accept and make peace with what happened and if we shut the door firmly or leave it ajar for a while.

Indeed, that fear is awful, really keeps you from taking wise decisions, particularly when the MLCer comes from an abandonment background, we LBS fear they will revive all those feelings and complain about us doing the same, but really, it's a catch 22 situation.

[MadLuv]

I agree the first year is the hardest. I don’t think I ever felt that no contact would be abandonment, because I felt abandoned. What I did worry was that he was disconnected and I was also disconnected then who was holding on??  I can relate my feelings in it so much to the death of our daughter as this is a death as well. You want to keep the memory alive, because then it’s like they never existed and then where do you go with all that love? It’s a hard thing to let go as you are forced to.