Midlife Crisis: Support for Left Behind Spouses
Archives => Archived Topics => Topic started by: superdog on March 20, 2014, 07:53:08 AM
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Been reading a bit today, stayed thread and the victim triangle etc and it got me to thinking a lot about the enabling side of things.
I so recognise the triangle in my previous marriage to h I was the rescuer for sure, then I would feel very put upon and become the persecutor, whilst h remained predominantly in the victim mode, only peeking out to persecutor in the passive aggressive fashion.
I also believe he fully resented me spending very little time in the victim and always looking down. I get it.
As far as the enabling goes boy did I do it huge, massive time.
I enabled my h to take no responsibility for anything including himself. I enabled his passive aggressiveness and took many blames that we're not mine to take. I took all responsibility for finances, the house the children. I allowed all of that, that is entirely my fault.
We have only bought two houses and I arranged everything from finance to insurances to solicitors, to utilities to tv packages you name it I arranged it and took care of it. I did it all, he did nothing. When h said he wanted to do up a house he said it once and never mentioned it again until after BD when he blamed me for not helping him get his dream. He wanted me to do it for him and I never, I did not enable and he was angry.
So enabler, control freak, just a responsible person I don't know what I was. But I do know now that I would not do all that again, except for myself that is.
I take no responsibility for his not growing up, that's his problem but I definitely allowed him not to take responsibility for the big stuff in life that grown ups do. I did all the house buying stuff at age 22 and it was scary. I also think this is why he stayed home this whole time and hated the rental, he couldn't handle all the responsibility at came with it. He didn't have mamma SD doing everything for him.
Mt nAme is SD and I was an enabler. I am in 12 step :-))
SD
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Mt nAme is SD and I was an enabler. I am in 12 step :-))
Welcome SD! My name is Slow Fade and I'm an enabler too! lol!
Ditto for me on being the rescuer!
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I enabled my h to take no responsibility for anything including himself. I enabled his passive aggressiveness and took many blames that we're not mine to take. I took all responsibility for finances, the house the children. I allowed all of that, that is entirely my fault.
We have only bought two houses and I arranged everything from finance to insurances to solicitors, to utilities to tv packages you name it I arranged it and took care of it. I did it all, he did nothing. When h said he wanted to do up a house he said it once and never mentioned it again until after BD when he blamed me for not helping him get his dream. He wanted me to do it for him and I never, I did not enable and he was angry.
So enabler, control freak, just a responsible person I don't know what I was. But I do know now that I would not do all that again, except for myself that is.
I take no responsibility for his not growing up, that's his problem but I definitely allowed him not to take responsibility for the big stuff in life that grown ups do. I did all the house buying stuff at age 22 and it was scary. I also think this is why he stayed home this whole time and hated the rental, he couldn't handle all the responsibility at came with it. He didn't have mamma SD doing everything for him.
I never thought of myself as an enabler; I was just a very responsible person, always have been. I did the same things that you did; took care of the house, bills, chores, purchased the house, eveything - H just came along for the ride :-\ I made most of the decisions for 'us', I felt honored that H has enough confidence in me to make decisions for him - boy was I naive!
Hi, my name is S4A and I was an enbler.
Good thread SD ;)
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Yep!! That's me too! Now that he's in MLC he can do all those things for himself. I did all the things you mentioned. I never thought of it as being an enabler at the time, I thought I was being a good wife and partner. He would have had this MLC anyway, and now living on his own he gets to see what it's like to do everything (without having to be asked) I probably get blamed for that too, oh well!
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I guess I'm enabler
WHEN HE WORKED I did everything else..I tried to have him take care of the bills (Nope he wouldn't do that)....kids..planned vacations.. he got to where I was doing the INCOME TAX...at least I thought I'd knew I didn't have to do that.
All I had for an example was his MOTHER... ::)
And he doesn't respect her EITHER. He simply HATES women.
I never tried to control him..he did just what he wanted. I got tired of fighting.
Now he wants to be a big boy and do it all by himself with his mommy? HAVE FUN.
So she just keeps doing it ..he'll never learn.
Now I am a first class enabler..I'll enable his ass to go to JAIL
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My H used to call me the Enabler and I am a big rescuer, people, rats, dogs...I totally identify with Stayed's thing of getting mad b/c my efforts were not appreciated. I will still rescue the animals but H will be on his own!
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Glad to hear I am not on this programme alone. Hee hee.
I also enabled him to not take accountability for anything either. If he didn't do it in the first place then when it went wrong I had to listen to him drone on about what a mess I had made of something. I would take accountability if it went wrong and then, guess what, I fixed it! At no point did h ever put anything that went wrong right, he just lorded it over me.
This is where the persecutor bit would come in, when he laid into me for getting something wrong. I would learn from my mistakes and try never to make the same one again. He learnt nothing.
After BD I was reminded of about a hundred silly things that I had done or taken decisions on ( because he would never make one). I mean using a bad wallpaper job as an excuse to see another woman, I must have been a saintly wife to have to dig that deep. Lol.
I just realise now how much enabling someone does not help in the slightest.
I had someone in the other day at work who has been off with depression for 6 months and listened to how she doesn't want to leave the house with her two small girls. I heard her talk about how her friends and family were so much help to her picking them up from school etc. I almost said to her friend that was with her, STOP doing it, you are enabling her not to change. I could see it plain as day in someone else.
I believe there is a fine, yet huge line between enabling and helping.
Sd
X
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Im hobo, and I'm an enabler...
I took care of xw like a child. For 23 years, I 'took care' of all the major important stuff. I was in charge, and I liked it.
Whenever I wanted her input, she would not really give it... very non committal... I took care of houses, cars, finances, insurance everything...
then she resented me for it. She wanted to grow up and be responsible... that's fine - if you want to grow up, you can do it in the marriage....
Funny now, she is fully divorced, but is fully dependent on me for alimony. fully, and is still not working.
The way our justice system works, I have to pay her for life. That's what I get for being an enabler... You enable long enough, and you are required by law to continue to.
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Hobo1 that sucks big time. Hmmm don't think your xw will ever find any self respect in that! Your laws are enabling her sense of entitlement.
Something we all do here is Britain is along the same lines, we pay for people who don't want to work to sit an do nothing all day, then listen to how hard they have it.
We are living in a world full of enabling. As reformed enablers we should run our own countries. :-)
SD
X
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I dont. Know that i was an enabler-maybe i was to some extent because i made excuses for h's behavior. I took care of many things becUse h traveled for work...but, like birdwatcher, i thought i was being a good wife and partner. I. Did get to a point where i was able to tell h that his behavior was unacceptable, and that's when the wheels fell off the bus. He didnt like the fact that i was holding him accountable for his actions, and he often blamed me for his anger-what a crock of $h!te...that's when OW came on the scene full-force.
Also like in it-h's mother is a professional victim (was not appreciated by her parents, did all the work while her 2 brothers got all the glory, was abandoned by her h, my. H's father, and floundered around in a pity pool for years, being a victim and a martyr)---SHE'S an enabler. She is enabling h as we speak-not holding him accountable for his HORRIBLE CHOICES-doing everything she can to make his life easier...all without (i suspect) letting him know that his actions and decisions have been DEPLORABLE. And h pretty mich hates his mother, i think. And he's stuck with her now...enabling and co-dependence personified...uuugh!
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Also like in it-h's mother is a professional victim (was not appreciated by her parents, did all the work while her 2 brothers got all the glory, was abandoned by her h, my. H's father, and floundered around in a pity pool for years, being a victim and a martyr)---SHE'S an enabler. She is enabling h as we speak-not holding him accountable for his HORRIBLE CHOICES-doing everything she can to make his life easier...all without (i suspect) letting him know that his actions and decisions have been DEPLORABLE. And h pretty mich hates his mother, i think. And he's stuck with her now...enabling and co-dependence personified...uuugh!
Do we have the same MIL? :o
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Maybe we all married the same guy??? ???
And you guys that took care of your wives like this? Where do I find one like you?? :o
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Hi Guys and Ladies!
I have to admit I am joining this group as well.
Genius was NEVER responsible for a single thing. When he was in college his mother and sister would drive there (1.5 hours away) a week to do his laundry and grocery shopping.
During our relationship, he moved several times and we moved several times. Yep, it was me that did all the work. I found the places, arranged all the utilities, cleaned the old place, packed, unpacked, paying and collecting the deposit, everything. That way if he hated the place it was my fault. I would get so tired of that. I would say to him, "Honey if possible, you would just let me do it all, and you would show up on moving day to a fully arranged house wouldn't you?" He would laugh and say yes, that is exactly how I want it to happen.
He always said it went like that because I was good at "that stuff." Menial tasks, labor intensive activities. He never did laundry, dishes, cleaning, car appointments, any appointments, yardwork, care for the dogs, nothing. He would not even pick out Christmas gifts for his family. He didn't want to be responsible if they did not like it.
I would say to him, "Just please make one decision, just one!" He refused to ever. I even suggested that he did not want to be responsible for anything. He told me he had plenty of responsibilities.
I also would plead with him to get an opinion on something, anything in relation to decisions about investments, housing, anything that was not directly in his area of study/work. He refused until something would go wrong, then his opinion was that it was my fault.
I know I enabled him to do things like that but I also thought I was being a good partner. It was just easier to do it myself than to wait for him to do it also. It was my place to live so I worried about things like that.
I also enabled him in that I made excuses for him not getting and keeping jobs at certain duty posts. He would be so angry when they refused to renew his contract but would renew and extend mine regularly. I thought it was only ego, and always turned them down, thinking if they did not want us as a team, then they did not want me.
Boy, just writing this, I realize how much I DO NOT miss that. And how insecure he was in that he was not a partner/spouse to me, but a weight and child to carry around.
It's funny, but he would say he took care of me since he paid some of the bills.
I AM NOW NOT AN ENABLER AND WILL NEVER BE ONE AGAIN. Sink or swim on your own now big boys!
So when are the meetings?? Wait, J still lives with me. But I am not enabling him, or am I?
Better save me a long term seat just to be sure!!!
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I don't know..are "fixers" enablers?
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During our relationship, he moved several times and we moved several times. Yep, it was me that did all the work. I found the places, arranged all the utilities, cleaned the old place, packed, unpacked, paying and collecting the deposit, everything. That way if he hated the place it was my fault. I would get so tired of that. I would say to him, "Honey if possible, you would just let me do it all, and you would show up on moving day to a fully arranged house wouldn't you?" He would laugh and say yes, that is exactly how I want it to happen.
I see myself here..............I did exactly the same things.
He always said it went like that because I was good at "that stuff." Menial tasks, labor intensive activities. He never did laundry, dishes, cleaning, car appointments, any appointments, yardwork, care for the dogs, nothing. He would not even pick out Christmas gifts for his family. He didn't want to be responsible if they did not like it.
Same here! H is now doing his own laundry, shopping, cooking, dishes, etc; I do none of it anymore. I always thought of it like this - Things are what really matters, the relationship is what really matters - how wrong I was.
I don't know..are "fixers" enablers?
Hmmm.............I don't think they are the same. A 'fixer' would need to see it as a problem to fix. I didn't this as a problem; I have always been very responsible and just took care of things because it what I do. I also saw it as being a good partner but now I see how unbalanced everything was :o I won't go there again.
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I also saw it as being a good partner but now I see how unbalanced everything was :o I won't go there again.
And right there is the challenge isn't it? And we all do more than our share it's inherit in long term relationships. IMHO
We can't get our self worth from doing it.
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Indeed I must admit looking at this list that I am an enabler to. My H never once in 28 years helped in the garden, repaired anything around the house, painted a wall, took the dogs for a walk, went to the market, or changed a roll of toilet paper in the bathroom. :o
He did however on several occasions help with the kids when they were babies and made the bed a few times. ::)
This was one of the reasons we never bought a house, because I was very sure that I would get stuck with everything.
Very unbalanced.
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Well the reasons I did the things I did was because I didn't want to ASK..CAN'T ANYBODY see somebody might need some help???? Nope too busy worrying about themselves.
And when I did ask? Nobody helped..
It's a wonder we all aren't nuts..then they do THIS??? WTF??? :o :o :o
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It is rather interesting that we can all relate to this ???
I am a firm believer in the universe correcting things - maybe MLC is the universes way of rebalancing us!
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I too am an enabler.MIL is an evil enabler. She ruled the roost, throws her own pity party and then tells the boys what the should do to make it better...poor her and all she does. Of course she is also narc, she basically abandoned h for the bar scene and blamed h's father. Poor her again.
I too bought the homes, took care of the details , planned vacations, paid the bills and he just showed up. Now he calls me controlling, like I was given a choice.H you can take it all in, no problem, I would have given it up at anytime, but you were not inclined to take the reins.
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Now he calls me controlling, like I was given a choice.H you can take it all in, no problem, I would have given it up at anytime, but you were not inclined to take the reins.
Totally can relate to this...
When my XW gets through this MLC, I unfortunately don't think this will be different. Their core self is the same. I don't think a personality disordered individual will come out of MLC, and be cured.
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Hobo, I totally agree with what your wrote. My h is the poster boy for passive aggressive disorder and I do not believe for one second that mlc will change that one iota. That is deeply ingrained.
What I do think has changed more than a little of an iota is the fact that I will not enable this disorder one more second of my life. It's nasty.
Sd
X
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I enabled a NPD for 32 years NEVER SAW IT or the cycle it has..I kept wondering there's something wrong here..so much is missing from this relationship..I was right..another person to have one with.
That's how codependent I was/am...working on not being. :)
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I'm Song and Dance and I am a recovering enabler.
However H did do all the DIY work around the house and I used to ask him to show me what to do if ever I had to do something. That meant that I started doing the odd job or two - Duh!!
He did also look after our baby girls and son one day a week so that I could go back to full time work as his business was still in early days.
But ...... finances?- check, shopping? - check, packing boxes for house move? check, most household chores? - check..
Now he does his own washing , food buying, clothes buying, occasionally does some cleaning and yet still can't always clean up after himself.
I have learned to step back and when he is looking for something - instead of finding or even suggesting where he might find it , I just say - no idea, or not a clue - he then finds it all by himself. And if he can't and throws a teenage tantrum I say nothing...
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My name is HopeandFaith and I am an enabler.
I am also sooooooo grateful for this thread because H and I are spending a lot more time together discussing our future I don't want to fall into old habits. I have a great opportunity now to redesign this thing. I appreciate knowing how some of my behaviours impacted my previous marriage so that I don't bring them into the future - with anyone.
H and I spent the day doing house and garden stuff the other day but I had to duck out to run errands with the kids. I needed to put some washing out and put dinner on but didn't ask H to do these things because I thought I would do them when I got home. When I got home, H had done both which I thought was pretty observant. I was very appreciative and he was a little embarrassed but pleased also.
Why didn't I just ask him to do it? Do I not trust him to do it right? Am I robbing him of the feel good moments we get from doing something nice for someone else.
Gotta get used to stepping aside and trusting him to do stuff I think.
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Wow, great thread.
I am Standing Strong Germany, and I am an enabler/peace keeper/fixer
Learned while H was younger, if he got into Financial problems, MIL helped him out.
First marriage, ExW family helped when needed.
Our marriage.. never asked my family for help...perhaps that was the start of his sliding downhill. Other than imp stuff I could not do as it was in German, I did pretty much everything else. Now I am alone in a 3 story house, packing up 17 years...alone.
The wild thing???
Reading the secret FB messages....OW has taken over. She provided the money to have the affair, she provided the house in a foreign land he could flee too, she even made the comment "I raised two children, raising a third will be no problem" :o :o :o
Now, H is going to hit rock bottom soon. He has been handling his own finances for only the past 3 months!!! And failing at it.
OW cannot do it as she does not speak German. That is why I got the nasty email from OW that I was not paying bills! I should be concerned about this now, why? Guess I am not accommodating their affair like I did unknowingly last year.
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The biggest thing I enabled was doing things for everyone they should be doing for themselves.
I also never expressed myself very well as to when I might need help and expected some one to SEE that.
Usually when I did ask for help it was dismissed.
For me it came down to a lot of my own self-worth issues AND it made me feel good to do things for someone else. But in having my requests dismissed added to the feelings that I was pretty much on my own in whatever I was dealing with.
I saw where someone mentioned being out of balance? You could certainly say most of my relationships have been.
I tend to give way too much. Open honest communication was not possible. But not much of that was on my part.
New mantra?..You teach others how to treat you.
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For me it came down to a lot of my own self-worth issues AND it made me feel good to do things for someone else. But in having my requests dismissed added to the feelings that I was pretty much on my own in whatever I was dealing with.
I saw where someone mentioned being out of balance? You could certainly say most of my relationships have been.
I tend to give way too much. Open honest communication was not possible. But not much of that was on my part.
New mantra?..You teach others how to treat you.
In It...you sound like my best friend, an award winning photographer in Colorado who just turned 50. Successful, financially secure and a beauty.
She has finally learned, after all these years...her relationship failures were mostly her fault. She gave way too much too. In the past few years, she has a relationship library to rival Amazon...really good at giving advice to friends and helped me in this mess.
She finally admitted to me at Christmas, the problem has been...she has not been following her own advice.
She has finally learned to be a bit more selfish ....and know what, she is doing great now.
SSG
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Reading any psychological material or medical material is dangerous for individual, because we can find self in symptoms or disorder. Anyway does not exist 100% psychologically healthy person, so all normal people have some issues, but that does not mean we are sick. So, on any serious psychological or medical web site exists disclaimer which warn people about that issue. Anyway if we pursue to be perfect then we can fall in own pit. Means lost uniqueness, being spontaneous, become more robotic, less human. Does we want to be like that ? Our MLCer crisis is because of them and their issues not ours, after all we did not hit crisis, they did...
So, don't be so hard on self is my message to You my dear LBS's.
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I guess that's the real trick isn't it Albatross.. not to be so hard on OURSELVES due to this.
To try to enjoy the simple things in life.... although I'm not sure if I'll get the hang of being a little selfish. I try.. I'm sure he doesn't have the first friggin clue who I am anymore and that makes me feel really good.
He has no idea who the real me really is now that he's done this. Again it's all in who you ask who or what they think a "good person" is.
We all have a dark and light side and the real goal is to find the balance.