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Author Topic: Interacting with Your MLCer Believe nothing of what they say and only 50% of what they do

S
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All - I must be dense. I've been trying to understand what this means. Does it mean
everything that they say is false? I know h believes and says he is telling the truth and all the time.

Are you also saying we should "believe" 50% of what they do is...what? Does that mean when he moves out and says he isn't coming back. Does that mean "never" isn't never but instead I "right now never" want or will come back?

Can someone give me a concrete example or two or more of "nothing of what they say" and "50% of what they do"? I seem not to be able to wrap my head around this thought.
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« Last Edit: January 23, 2012, 07:04:10 AM by Rollercoasterider »
2010

M
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 SIP, Hi I had trouble with this til month 4. When my H says I'll try and pick the Ds up at the pool and swim with them. 
  It means get ready for A) He doesn't and never calls
                                   B) He goes to the pool waves to them blows a kiss and leaves them there.                           
                                    C) Gets them drops them at someone's house and has D11 text me to come get her.
                                    D) H comes home with them like he still lives here when he doesn't. Proceeds to help me weed whack. Puts hand on mine
                                    E)  C and B
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r
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Standing in Patience,

What I have taken from this phrase is to protect yourself...hope for the best but prepare and expect the worst.

The MLCer will say things that you want to hear either in an attempt to fix a situation, buy time, or they even may have every intention of following through with what they say. However, at any moment the slightest trigger will start them cycling again and everything goes out the window.

Actions speak louder than words but do not expect consistency. They may show love and affection but then for not apparent reason be standoffish and cold the next moment.

They will make promises that they cant keep. They will love you one minute and attack you the next. Until you can see a CONSISTANT pattern or "cycle" of positive change, stay strong and protect your heart and mind.

rrazz

PS. I love the fact that when I spell check my posts MLCer comes up as ULCER
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"For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction". Newtons III Law

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All - I must be dense. I've been trying to understand what this means. Does it mean
everything that they say is false? I know h believes and says he is telling the truth and all the time.

It's not a matter of deciding if they are telling you the truth or not; it's about what they say their intentions and plans are versus what actually happens. People can say they are going to do things and never follow through; many of us have spouses who have threatened to move out, or file for divorce, or try for custody of the kids. My wife kept telling me that she was a hair's breadth away from literally packing and bag and running away; it took her a year to actually move out, at which time she told me that she would be filing as soon as she could afford to. It's now been another year and in many ways we get along better than before she moved out, and almost as well as before the crisis began.

MLC is an emotional crisis; to them, their feelings are real but that doesn't make them true. The idea behind the saying is to help the LBS remember that things are not as they appear on the surface. If your husband says that he never loved you, that can come from a number of places:
1) He feels guilty about how he is treating you, so he is trying to make it easier for you to move on and alleviate his guilt.
2) He is in Monster mode and is trying to hurt you to pick a fight or to drive you away
3) He is depressed and the love he did feel for you is muted and affected by that depression.

Are you also saying we should "believe" 50% of what they do is...what? Does that mean when he moves out and says he isn't coming back. Does that mean "never" isn't never but instead I "right now never" want or will come back?

That's actually a pretty good example. The "believe half of what they do" is tied pretty closely to the "believe nothing of what they say" because talk is always easier than action. However, just because they do move out or file for divorce does not mean that it can't be undone later, and it also doesn't mean that they did what they did for the reasons they say they did.
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Me: 45, Her: 40. Married 16 1/2 years, together(-ish) 20.
Status: BD 8/25/09, she moved out 8/28/10. No talk of D.

Every day is another chance to get it right.
http://www.vachss.com/mission/behavior.html

"Counting days won't buy us years" —Wings by HAERTS
"Forgiveness means giving up all hope for a better past."  —Lily Tomlin
"When we commit to our lovers, we implicitly promise to forgive them. There is no other way we can live with someone for better or worse or until death do us part." —Dr. Frederic Luskin

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Hello there,
for me I have simply treated everything my exH has said to be with complete and utter caution - knowing I could get burned.

It means that I have not been able to treat him like the loving fabulousguy that he was for the first 16 1/2 years of our relationship - because that was putting me into a dark horrible space (which I didn't deserve or need to be in).

I chose to respond to my husband's actions rather than REACT - with anger or my real feelings as I feel certain that my exH would view this as pursuing or give him an insight into where my head and heart are and until my H 'returns' I don't intend to have a 'real' relationship with him (one of mycore boundaries).

In the early days (around 3 months after BD when I found my first MLC site and it all 'clicked') I focussed on these key things and not much else until I got it right and it became second nature to me - bedded down and my new behaviour. It was hard at first but keeps me lovingly detached and moving forward 18 months on.

I have always treated my husband with kindness and respect and I continue to. I understand totally that MLC a long hard process (for the LBS and the MLCer) and I trust in the process to do it's work and all the while I GAL for me and my 2 children.

I always said I didn't want to have any regrets about how I treated my exH during his crisis and my adopting this approach it means I'm writing this with a clear conscience!!

((hugs))

P
xx
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The depression causes them to be very manipulative.
Control rules the day.
So they will say anything to get what they want, because they don't
realize that is may not help.
But it is what the feel right now.

Basically I am saying that most mentally ill people LIE.
Or embellish the truth.
Therefore you can not trust what they say.

Anyways that is my .02
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H
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  • Let GO, Let God work on your MLC spouse :)
This is my take and .02, for what it is worth. :)

Basically to me, that always meant you take EVERYTHING they do/say with a literal grain of salt; because after all, this IS MLC, where anything and everything can happen...and to keep the confusion down within yourselves, it's best if you believe NONE of of what they say, and only HALF of what they do, bearing in mind that even that HALF could "reverse" itself AND its position at ANY given time.

Once I got a good handle on it;  figured it out for certain;  I actually learned to NOT even believe ANY of what I was hearing/seeing, as it was ALL SO unbelievable....it wasn't until he navigated past the affair, finished Other Woman Withdrawal, and turned back toward me to try and start repairing at least some of the damage that I started seeing better consistency in his words and actions again; but this even was slow to come..I still found myself bearing more than my share of responsibility of making sure the household was run the way it was supposed to be in his "absence" of mind. :)

They SAY alot of and a great many EMPTY things that really mean NOTHING; the vast majority of MLC'ers are blowing nothing but "hot air" and don't intend to really follow up unless FORCED to by the LBS; that's why you can't believe ANYTHING of what they say.....for example, they may very well threaten to move out,  or even file for divorce, every time the LBS cries, begs, gets angry, is argumentative or whatever.... and keep running off at the mouth in the same type of threat, until called on it, and told that IF that is what THEY want to do, do it, but stop threatening; using this type of a boundary or the LBS actually shows them the door; which I DON'T recommend, because ANY life changing decisions like that SHOULD stay on the MLC'er.

Honestly, I STILL fail to understand where some think that YOU know what's best for them, because that makes you just as much of a controller as the MLC'er when you take a decision like that from them.   In a NORMAL situation, I really could understand; but MLC is a different animal entirely.......remove yourselves from the room, and their presence for a time, once you give them that kind of choice of leave or not leave; but don't remove yourself or them from the house, and simply leave them to their own devices, they will figure it out or they won't. 

On a side note, I've been told a number of times by others that throwing them out or not, depends on whether they are taunting the LBS in certain circumstances when a MLC'er is within an affair, public affairs, things like that, and I still don't advocate throwing them out during MLC; but making them leave just because you get tired of them threatening or otherwise, CAN backfire on YOU, especially, if your intention is to stand for your marriage; as something as small as PRIDE really can prevent some of  them from returning; and you may NOT get another chance to pave the way for their return, that's a chance you take. 

And if they do return, it's sometimes because they are the "clinging boomerangs" that RCR so often speaks of in her writings.....Me, I see a return being orchestrated by the Lord who intervened within the situation, to keep His Will from being circumvented........just so you know, I was WARNED by the Lord in my own case NOT to throw him out; to keep that decision on my HUSBAND'S shoulders, that if I threw him out, it WOULD have been a "controlling" move on my part, NOT to mention he would NOT have returned, because of this little thing called PRIDE that he had as a monkey on his back.  Not to mention the fact that I would have been charged with the responsibility for my actions in that aspect, and consequences would have been dealt and meted out to me....and I did recognize the controlling nature of me vs keeping in on him..so, I did what I was advised/instructed to do...as I did not want to bear this blame on me..once I laid the boundary mentioned above, he shut up, and didn't threaten me again, I had taken the ammunition for his justification AWAY from him.

Half of what they do is a tricky proposition, because you honestly don't know for sure IF they will follow through on what they tell you they will do..it's a 50 percent chance they won't do anything, or 50 percent they will.

On the other hand, you may see them move out, only to ask to come home, or even just show back up at home, the next week, or even the next day; or they may tell you their "feelings" has changed, and in action, they are cold as ice, the next time you see them, they are hot as fire, and very affectionate, saying they are sorry or something else, just as empty and meaningless; bipolar symptoms it seems here.

This is also were the "mixed" messages come into play; where they will actually say one thing, and end up doing another or even the opposite....and the thing is, again, you NEVER know for sure what will happen with them from one day to the next...half of what they do will seem sincerely geared toward trying to work on themselves, and at times, you think they are really making the effort, while the other half is confusing as all get out.  Or they will make an effort, but actually get it "half done" or even withdraw to process at the halfway point of being in action.....I've SEEN this happen more than once....it's been said that good intentions have many times paved the way to Hell; and most MLC'er's THINK they have good intentions, but their follow up is as slow as their "giddy up"...because the STARTING HALF of the actions is the INTENTION spoken out loud...as you can't read their minds....then as you watch for their actions, these can go either way, depending upon where they are within the crisis, or even depending on what's in their minds, and you never know.

Others may appear to want the relationship one day, discard it AGAIN, the next day or even week; they really DON'T know what they want during this time..it's like a child with so many toys he/she doesn't know what they want to play with, and the vast majority, God help us all, get SO cranky you think they need a nap 24/7...acting like babies with belly aches or even colic....or better than than, they are suffering "growing pains".

And with some, well, you have to watch them closely, or your house will burn down, no kidding...they are absent minded, not half conscious of what they are doing when they are doing it...the fog is SO deep within themselves, I could remember being very surprised when some things would actually get done all the way through, and it did happen sometimes.  :)

This is ALSO where expectations need to drop to zero and below..if they  speak an intention and follow through, even halfway, that's great; but don't become a "glorified" babysitter for them..protect yourselves where you need protecting; because in the end, YOU are the sane one, they aren't, you know what's going on, they really don't for most of the crisis.....and above all, please learn to let them go to twist in the wind; sometimes that is the ONLY way to help them come forward is by leaving them alone;  remember, you can do NOTHING for them, to them, or because of them.

One last thing to remember NOTHING is EVER as it seems; especially during MLC. :)



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Our marriage survived His MLC, with the help of the Lord.
I have learned that true strength is built through the trials we endure.
There is hope as long as you love your MLC spouse, and, are willing to learn the  life's lessons that are set before you as a result of this crisis.

e
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Well, I seemes my H is a very very mild clinging boomerang.
my experience is that they say things at certain moments and really mean it at that time, but actions do not follow all the time
Example :
H promised 2 weeks ago to visit a certain day and called (lucky me) he couldn't make it
I confronted H that this is not done as also our S was expecting him... H seemed to understand
2 weeks later H tells me he will MAYBE come and visit. I did not see nor hear H. you see H covered his a**.
I learned my lessons to take everything he says with a grain of salt and to protect my heart.
I know for sure that when he tells something it will be true at THAT time, but for some reason he can not follow through.

Another thing i really learned is that you have to let them take their own decisions.
I made the mistake once back in FEB to tell H that he needed to go and see a notary to start D proceedings. H did and when I confronted him, H told me it is because I wanted this.
You see, this is the amunition for his justification HB is talking about.
I will never ever take a decision in his place again. Also I not want to take the responsibility for a decision of something I do not want and I do not want to live with this the rest of my life.
This one is on H.
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l
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This is my take and .02, for what it is worth. :)

Basically to me, that always meant you take EVERYTHING they do/say with a literal grain of salt; because after all, this IS MLC, where anything and everything can happen...and to keep the confusion down within yourselves, it's best if you believe NONE of of what they say, and only HALF of what they do, bearing in mind that even that HALF could "reverse" itself AND its position at ANY given time.

............

On the other hand, you may see them move out, only to ask to come home, or even just show back up at home, the next week, or even the next day; or they may tell you their "feelings" has changed, and in action, they are cold as ice, the next time you see them, they are hot as fire, and very affectionate, saying they are sorry or something else, just as empty and meaningless; bipolar symptoms it seems here.

............

One last thing to remember NOTHING is EVER as it seems; especially during MLC. :)

HB-that was an awesome post! 

But I have a question.  How can there be any hope if my H has not shown me or verbalized any affection or love in months and months on end?  In the 16 months since my H first told me he wanted to leave, he has consistently told me that he doesn't love me and doesn't want to be with me.  He only wavered once by agreeing to go to MC last August but since then he has not shown me affection and has not wavered in his decision.   This is the main reason why I wonder if I am dealing with MLC or not.   My H displays all the other signs and symptoms of MLC like being unreliable etc.  But even though my S and I see my H 3 to 4 times a week, my H is consistently adamant about not wanting to be with me.   This is what confuses me and makes me feel like my sitch is different than others here and that I may not be dealing with MLC at all.
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« Last Edit: July 30, 2011, 12:59:27 PM by ladybird »
M: 50
H: 53
Met 32
T:  26
M: 20
S: 16
BD 2/12/11
H Moved Out: 4/11
OW1 Long distance relationship
OW Over 10/11
OW2 10/11 to present
D Papers served 9/11-the day before our 20th Anniversary.
D Pending Feb 22 2012
H currently living on the Alien Mothership.

D
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Ladybird

What your husband is doing is pretty common.

Here's part of the article Progress: Backward Forward Limbo

Now, in the darkness, he seems even more certain he hates you, more consistent. He is gone without Hope of returning. He doesn't want to return. In this place of Perpetual Darkness he knows he made the right decision.

The Dark period can be very long. As he approaches the end of the tunnel he will see the light.
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