[1trouble]

I have to agree with Elegance, although MLC is like a mental illness its temporary to me its more like a mental breakdown............

And it is IMO firmly routed in depression, most of our MLC'ers have been dealing with a type of depression for most of their lives, that is hidden to even those who are close to them, this type of depression is not publicised and rarely talked about....

Ask any person on the street to describe depression and most will probably mention crying, not wanting to get out of bed, feeling hopelss, listless, no hope etc.

BUT there are many faces of depression and there are many people who are depressed without realising it, who run away from their feelings by doing everything to the extreme, they exercise too much, work too much, drink too much. take drugs, become obsessive about cleanliness, etc etc.....
And all the time they are doing this, they are not facing what they are thinking and feeling........which is scared.........

They carry on like this for years, looking for distractions, anything that stops them from thinking and in midlife for very many reasons it all catches up on them.....the sudden death in the family or a close friend, the illness, the kids leaving home.....whatever it is makes them suddenly stop with a jolt and think about their lives, the fear they have quailed for so long is there suddenly facing them and everything they have been running from is there, they feel a failure, a fraud all that energy they have put in to distractions wont shut these feelings out and so they shift the energy to escape...... finding something anything different from whatever worked before, because it no longer works any more.....

My H is one of those who said 'I have to go....' none of what he said after that made any sense when I asked him where, why how etc...it was all senseless and kept coming back to 'I have to go.....' looking back on what followed (he sobbed for days, then he was euphoric, then guilty, then the crying, then the evident guilt and shame, then the distancing.......etc)

It is clear to me that statement 'I have to go...' was almost primeval and need driven from deep within........

There is a form of depression which makes the sufferer feel they have to run away, the answer is to start all over again....(to them anyway)

This is never ever talked about, whenever I have watched programs on depression, it is never ever mentioned, the need to abandon everything, if only it was covered more, if only it was talked about and publicised about the other faces of depression being the obsession to work, exercise, clean etc being a form of depression and anxiety....

these are the routes to MLC to me, this and unresolved issues and resentments that in MLC are like a volcano erupting .....................

The more I see on here, the more I move through this with my H, the more I read, the more I think what my therapist said is right, this is a chemical imbalance initially which lasts 18 months -3 years  BUT IMO........ what follows is the slow realisation of what they have done during the imbalance and the complete devastation and havoc they have caused......

Then IMO they are (as my therapist said) consumed with utter guilt and shame and a deep feeling of terror they maybe insane......................

And that is why when faced with what they have done and the fear they are mentally unstable, the vast majority find it hard to face us, some remain angry because they are just very very scared, some disappear and some appear to be 'happy' because to admit they are not is to face their fears........and some find the courage to talk, but these are in the minority.............

If we are going to stop this happening to others I think it has to be fought on many fronts...
The definition of depression has to be expanded to include the other symptoms I have highlighted, it has to be more widely known that to do things to excess can mean that people are running away from themselves.

Employers should be taught to look for signs of excessive working and have a duty of care to ensure their employees do not work undue excessive hours (my H was working and still does over 80-90 hours overtime a month).

The stereotypical view of MLC needs to change from the jokey image of someone dressing in young clothes and going off with a younger woman to the devastating life altering thing it really is

The term mental health needs to not have the stigma it has at the moment, at the moment mental health describes anything from mild depression to schizophrenia .....we don't really use the term physical health so much we talk about a sprained ankle and cancer in those terms
If it was more widely acceptable to look after your 'mental health' like we look after our 'physical health' people would seek help before they got to crisis...

There is so much more to this than a diagnosis IMO

Now I will get off my soap box and go to bed 

[Roma]

Mine H too 1T has been dealing with depression most of his life. Male Depression is what many really should look into, it's worlds different than female depression.

My H shared he tried to commit suicide at age 5.

He's learned to wear a mask all his life because he was depressed from when he was a small child.

MLC is a form of Depression.

[Thunder]

From what I've read El, it's the grandfather of all depressions.

My H never was depressed in his life, that I know of until this crisis hit....and I've known him for 30 years.

It's just something some people go through, usually in their 40's.  But yes, I do believe it is a temporary condition, not a long term condition...and medication will not help them.  Nor will therapy until they are ready for it.

[Not Applicable]

I agree it is temporary but why does that make it not a mental illness but LIKE a mental illness? What's the difference between a real one and a 'Like' one?

I thought more about how scientists could approach this. There is some knowledge of the sorts of things that different parts of the brain are responsible for. And there are obvious common changes in thinking in MLCers. I will use the example of time perception being skewed, as I have seen this myself in my husband. The ability to estimate time has been suggested to be controlled by the supplementary motor area and the right prefrontal cortex. So would there be other aspects of MLC changes controlled by these areas? Or certain chemicals that are found in these areas and other areas that are clearly affected? This is meant as an example only. I'm not putting forth a theory, just a possible method for approaching this. I'm sure neuroscientists have methods like this that they use to approach figuring out a puzzle like this.

[Not Applicable]

There's another question I want to pose here? We all know that facing reality is part of the whole process of getting out of MLC That's natural as in anything that we do in life, it never turns out how we expect it. But I've also seen discussions that basically centered on the question, what can we do to get them out of the fog, with the answer being nothing. But even if we aren't able to do anything, is there something chemical happening besides just facing reality that leads to the fog lifting? If brain chemistry puts them in it, then is brain chemistry allowing them to come out of it? Obviously they have issues with the damage they have done they have to face, that makes coming out harder from a purely psychological perspective, but what is happening physiologically?

[Roma]

C4E,

I'll tackle the first question. MLC is only temporary therefore not a mental illness which is permanent and while there are similarities, every MLCer is different pending  severity of childhood trauma which varies from person to person.

[Not Applicable]

It's just something some people go through, usually in their 40's.  But yes, I do believe it is a temporary condition, not a long term condition...and medication will not help them.  Nor will therapy until they are ready for it.

But if you know it is due to brain chemistry, I think the LBS would approach it differently in many cases. In these sorts of forums, you see the bitter angry spouses and it is so obvious they are headed to divorce that they are a lost cause. Then you see the ones who are compassionate and kind and they often reach a point where they reconcile. I would say that someone is more likely to be compassionate and kind if they realize their spouse can't help what they are doing, that the spouse is not inherently an evil person or that they are to blame for it.

So whether medication would even be possible at some point in the future is not the only goal of identifying medical causes. 1trouble's point about the image is important. If I say my husband has cancer, people would show sympathy, if I say he has a midlife crisis, they laugh. MLC is no joke, I think we all know that. If it's an illness, it's a far more difficult illness for the spouse to handle than cancer.

[Not Applicable]

C4E,

I'll tackle the first question. MLC is only temporary therefore not a mental illness which is permanent and while there are similarities, every MLCer is different pending  severity of childhood trauma which varies from person to person.

Mental illnesses are not all permanent. Read this very basic description of what mental illness is:

https://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/health/conditionsandtreatments/mental-illness

[Ready2Transform]

This is a good one to keep in the bookmarks. The serotonin section will have some insights: http://www.drjoecarver.com/clients/49355/File/Chemical%20Imbalance.html

Like with bipolar disorder, there is a shift in and out of mania that can be triggered by various things. If it could be predicted, it could be prevented? I'm sure a lot of sufferers wish that were so. I know a lot of people do believe childhood issues play a role, but clearly not all people who have troubled childhoods go through this, while others with seemingly easy childhoods are also here. What do we even define as a bad childhood? I'm just digging a deeper hole here. LOL

I think the part about us being able to do nothing is about how much control we have over anyone. I'm sure if anyone here has a child on drugs, or had an alcoholic parent growing up, etc, they know the reality of wanting to be there to help a person out of an obviously bad state, but not being able to sway the will of a person who does not want the help. Mental illness and episodes, whatever we are dealing with, are the same. We can't force these people to get help, so long as they are not a public threat, and since we are dealing with what I believe is a "blanket" term of MLC that covers a spectrum of different issues, we don't even have a very clear picture of what that help would be. Some addicts need to be checked into a facility with around the clock care, while some need to attend meetings and exercise willpower. Whoever pointed out that the uniqueness (Thunder I think?) played a role too I agree with.

I have tended over the last 5+ years (and a few before that when my xH was diagnosed bipolar) to choose compassion over anger. My anger is mainly situational. I get mad at the things he's done. Love the sinner, hate the sin kind of thing, I guess. I get mad at how it has affected my life. But never, ever do I consider what happened normal or chosen. I relive those early days in the familiar stories of the newbies and it reminds me how crazy the boy I'd known since I was a girl became. Saw a clip from "The Shining" earlier and it hit home a bit.

[Roma]

I'm now in my latter 40's and before my H told me what he was going through, I never heard of anyone really going though this other than a running joke.

So I staunchly disagree with Thunder, saying that it's something 'normal people go though in their 40's'. (although I like her a lot )

That was me R2T that touched on 'uniqueness'

Indeed MLC is like nothing I've ever heard of or experienced (as a LBS) before.

MLC has been around for years and years yet not listed in the DSM5.  Probably because not every person goes though it.