[Father5]

    That was a great read UM,

   I suppose most of us on this site fall into the similar category with feelings. I also was always the first to be vulnerable and always have been in lopesided relationships. I do recognize it now and maybe the only bonus that has come from this whole mess is the growing we all are forced to do. To really become who God intended us all to be. Whether with this spouse or the next we would have never been fully happy unless we are able to look into oursleves and fix what was broken.

[OffRoad]

Everyone's perspective is so fascinating and informative. UM indicates that trust and expectations are the same, yet for me expectations means someone said they could do it, so I will see if they meet that (no trust) and trust means I already BELIEVE they have the ability to do what I asked. And for me, I can't believe in anyone's ability to do something, personal, business or otherwise, until we have had some interaction. And to me, any interaction with someone I don't know well is being vulnerable because I open myself to disappointment.  Trust, for me, means I BELIEVE this person and take them at their word, and I do not do that with any random individual. And I already know I don't hire people to do a job like most people do. It's not just a business transaction to me. I can trust someone will choose to be a bozo, too.  I definitely believe trust and vulnerability are cyclical.

SS, imo, we are all mutants or we'd be clones (send in the clones?). You just have a different perspective. I still saw vulnerability first, the willingness to take a risk at trying to understand your colleague, and a trust in yourself to handle whatever happened. You see it differently and it's likely a semantics, experience or perspective thing.

I completely relate to all of you who fringed the various groups in your life. I was always what I called a fringer. I had so many interests, I never fit squarely with any one group, though I had my four core school friends and my 8 core home friends. (Those never crossed over, I'm not sure why). It is my belief that most of the people who end up here are thinkers, introspective, definitely not the surface level people. If we were, it would be easy to just trot along to the next relationship. 

There are a lot of good people out there (here we all are!). Trust and vulnerability are important, but I'm beginning to think patience  is the key.

[Mortesbride]

I personally feel that a true intimate and loving relationship is VERY much dependant on mutual trust and vulnerability. THAT, for example, is one of MY not-so-healthy behaviours that I needed to review and modify - I was always the one that opened myself more easily so that there was a disparity in the amount of trust and vulnerability shown. I have learned what that felt like when I was doing it and now am extremely cognizant of when I tend to be going down that road. When that "red flag" pops up, I either slow down until the other catches up or I will break it off all together because I am NOT interested in lop-sided relationships on ANY level.  To me, I visualize it as having to chase someone... (Pursuit and distance). I'm very aware of that situation now and in the case I feel the other person beginning to distance, I stop where I am and let them be. They can then choose to quit running and bridge the distance, in which case, we can take each others hand and proceed forward, they can continue to run which then effectively ends the relationship, or they can choose to stop where they are which results in an assignment of closeness.

Thanks for this Ursa. Needed to read it. 

[barbiedoll]

Here's a question, what about a loss of trust with yourself? Has anyone experienced that?

.

I am going to say yes, I believe I did experience an utter loss of trust in myself. However, I have been calling it a loss of trusting my "intuition". I was convinced that my intuition ( that I heavily relied on and was incredibly accurate) was shattered . Is intuition the same as self -trust ? I think it is.

I do recall conversations early on with my therapist that the "tool" that I have endlessly used with my 5 girls has been believing and trusting my sense of intuition. Even if that little voice held no proof, no verification ...I just knew I was correct in "knowing" something was up. I do remember crying heaving loss of not being able to "read" my daughters ...or not trusting and believing what I was feeling. Rather like a "mother-scanning device" that gives you information about them ..magically. It was gone . We all ask ourselves how we "missed this or missed that ", and I most certainly knew ( intuitively) that something was very very wrong and he met ALL the criteria for having an affair. I dismissed in or dissacociated from it ..it would be too much to "know". In many ways I felt I had betrayed or abandoned myself because I did not trust my own instincts . But I knew. I let other people talk me out of what I intuitively knew. I have recovered from most of those feelings . My intuition has returned and I never fail to listen ...ever. I how this makes some measure of sense.