[xyzcf]

In thinking more about this I was thinking about an alcoholic or a drug addict. I know that AA has 12 steps and I think one of them is making it right with those they have hurt.

I think perhaps the thinking is that for them to heal, they need to be able to do that....so is it for their healing or ours?

I don't know the answer.

He's never said he was sorry, for a long time I wanted that but it really makes no difference now. It wouldn't change anything for me.

He is and has done what he is...and he will live with that.

[rosetintedglasses]

I get what Treasur/Milky etc were saying that ShocksSis’ XH would probably heal a bit more if he heard what shocksis wants to say, and that in turn could help him with his new family as he would be a less broken man. We are taught not to bring up relationship talks so if he was an LBS from here he would probably never ask and wait on his MLCer Shocksis who, very interestingly, is waiting on him asking.

Personally I too respect your decision Shocksis, I think the reason it came back up is because us LBSers would almost give our right arm to hear what you have to say from our MLCers. It’s closure.

(The clarity you have at remembering and explaining your time in MLC is really precious, thank you from the bottom of our hearts 🥰)
Rose 🌹

[OffRoad]

A genuine apology from my MLCER for the hurt that he caused everyone, for the lies he told about me and for mean spirited things he said would make me feel like he was going to be ok. No amount of his being "nice" or "happy" or conversational would convince me he wasn't still screwed up, because non screwed up people apologize when they have done something that hurts another once they realize they have hurt them.

I'd like to know he understood that life is not all about him and that wherever he ended up going forward, he would be ok because he was now in a place he could feel again. Because I can't help but be concerned for his mental well being.

I'm not capable of being married to someone for so long, watching them blow themselves up, and not caring how they really are just because they are now being "nice" to me.  To each, their own.

[Granite]

Hi SS and thanks for your reply.

I think I worded my question poorly as what I am curious about is if today you feel or know of any long term benefits your crisis gave you?  Did it lead to any personal growth, resolve any traumas or issues, help you become stronger in some way?  For example let’s say pre-crisis a person has a hard time being alone, but after emerging from the crisis they are more comfortable with their own company.

[WAWP]

Hi Shocks Sis

It's been a long while since I've posted here, but I wanted to thank you from the bottom of my heart for your contribution to this forum, and your contribution the world actually!! Insights like yours are few and far between and is so needed for the LBS and affected families to attempt to understand their MLCers behaviour. Your input is sorely needed!!
I'm finding your explanations downright fascinating. It's just bizarre how a combination of adverse events earlier in life can cause such massive shift in personality later on.

I have done much research since my xW dropped the bomb, and there are many similarities you describe in your behaviour that I see in her behaviour, and you both line up with the currently accepted "understanding" of MLC.

BTW, I think your decision to leave your xH alone is wise and right. If he needs closure that much, he will contact you.

I really look forward to your future posts, and thank you once again.

WAWP

[Treasur]

I get what Treasur/Milky etc were saying that ShocksSis’ XH would probably heal a bit more if he heard what shocksis wants to say, and that in turn could help him with his new family as he would be a less broken man. We are taught not to bring up relationship talks so if he was an LBS from here he would probably never ask and wait on his MLCer Shocksis who, very interestingly, is waiting on him asking.

Personally I too respect your decision Shocksis, I think the reason it came back up is because us LBSers would almost give our right arm to hear what you have to say from our MLCers. It’s closure.

(The clarity you have at remembering and explaining your time in MLC is really precious, thank you from the bottom of our hearts 🥰)
Rose 🌹

I have thought about this overnight and Rose has said exactly what I meant.
In validating ShockSis and her own choices, i do not want to invalidate my own POV just bc it is different.

Acknowledgement is the key missing bit for me as an LBS. Not an apology or a confirmation of my memories or my self-worth, simply an acknowledgment that my xh did bad things and takes some emotional accountability for the damage and pain he caused. Hearing that would be healing for me. It would be healing for many of his old friends too tbh. I will never believe he is healthy until he does bc that is what normal healthy people whose actions create big damage to others do.
And tbh I am not sure it is the job of the victim to ask for remorse or validation after years of emotional abuse and indifference. I think a fully healthy post crisis person would have the humility to see that...and until they heal sufficiently to want to make some kind of amends even in a small way it is a waste of time to even ask. Understanding and accepting the reality of someone else's crisis is not the same as excusing the behaviour or diminishing the damage.

There is a danger of confusing apples and pears.

I believe that true healing needs the acknowledgment of damage caused and compassion for those damaged by ones actions and compassion for the person who did the damage. Everyone involved gets to make their own choice about that. Apples.

I believe that as LBS we get to own the responsibility of how we heal independently, and the kind of negative thinking that hinders us as well as the thoughts and actions that help us move forward. Which sometimes means being very careful to not gaslight ourselves into denying how we feel or what is normal. Pears.

I respect ShockSis's judgment about her own situation.
I also respect that as a victim of abuse, I see it differently.
Both are valid imho.

[rosetintedglasses]

Oops! Milky was typed as Milly and changed without me noticing! Apologies thought I better point out that I did in fact use your correct name Milly or so I thought! Ha ha what am I like.

Milly Milly Milly - hope that undoes it! Xx

[Keep believing]

I was thinking , wondering ,  if the difference of opinion here is that 1trouble has heard the words from her mlc that he apologizes, ow is no good and so on that it makes it easier to stand in the position she is in . Compared to the ones who have heard nothing like 1t has heard from her mlcer. Some of us have heard nothing , nothing to help us heal from the mlcers pov. I think if many of us heard what 1t has heard , well it might just help us all. even though we all know this is not our fault, that the mlcer makes it up to be , it would still be nice to hear from the mlcer himself. When someone tears you down so much , it takes time to heal , a long time. But if the one who tore you down were to tell you , it was all my fault and your are really a good person , the healing would not take half as long.
My h said almost 2 years ago that he hated what he had done to me and the kids. Sure it made me feel good. He said you know that is not me.   Some sort of admittance that he was wrong.   Sad to say he is still a mess.

[Treasur]

That seems a very fair point, kb.
The experiences that we have individually influence what we need to heal I suppose. And how we go about doing that. It is probably also one of the reasons why the window that ShockSis provides into the mysterious world of MLC is so much appreciated by so many of us here even if we know that her POV now is not necessarily a direct window into our own MLCers head?

[Jackolar12]

I spoke to a recovered MLC man after a decade long crisis. He tried to apologise to his former wife but she wouldn’t even see him so you never know how an LBS will react, He’s with a different woman now but has many regrets. I suppose once the innocence of love has been broken it’s never quite the same for either party.