[BraveNewWorld]

Ready,

This is a bit of a tangent. I need to write it somewhere. My friend that I've been playing guitar with has had a significant mental breakdown. He is nearing 40, his dad died early this year. Things have been going poorly at work ( I met him in my last role ). His dad was abusive.

This friend came to me to talk about his problems at work. His views differ from mine in many ways. I think I'm more pragmatic, and can easily find things to interest me at work - I'm lucky - I'm an engineer in a great company and try to seize opportunites. I think deep down that our company hopes we'll innovate. But he sees things as very rule based. He expects opportunities to be presented to him. He is angry that they aren't.

One day he called me to his desk. The rest of his team were away celebrating completing a milestone in the project. He was working to catch up. He broke down and started crying. Then he started turning monster on me. I'd seen it before.

I just listened. He was in a pool of tears. All I could do was urge him to go home to his wife. He didn't.

He sent me an abusive email. I didn't reply. I wanted to. But I'd seen this before.

Roll on three weeks. He hasn't been into work. He sent an email at the weekend telling me that he was sorry for the words he wrote. He has been hospitalized for depression.

My mind was going through this question of 'did I say something wrong'. He tried to blame me - but I said hardly anything, and I don't even work with him. All I've done is help him play music, and talk about common interests.

I think there are two sides. First - he has significantly deep rooted issues. He was genuinely worrying to be around. Secondly - there is something in my own nature that some people can sense and abuse. I've seen it in a few people. Like some kind of challenge to any humility. That scares me too - though this time I knew not to react. That's exactly what they want. They want to fight it out. I was sad to walk away from this, but I'm not going to be his outlet - at the moment, I just don't feel safe.

So - I'm writing this for a few reasons. One is that I wanted to share it ( apologies for sharing it on this thread ). The second - I think this is a midlife crisis - though he hasn't had an affair - I think it is more than depression. Third - depression is absolutely a huge factor and I see that now in this friend, and in my wife - in her monster. Very similar. Finally for your research - I see common traits - men and women - though I am sure there are many differences.

Strange times.

bnw

[kikki]

BNW you handled that well.
I remember reading somewhere that our MLCers give us training in how to deal with difficult people.

there is something in my own nature that some people can sense and abuse. I've seen it in a few people. Like some kind of challenge to any humility. That scares me too - though this time I knew not to react.

I also remember reading research into bullies when my boys were young.
It said that at the beginning of the school year a bully will test everybody in the classroom to see who is scared and who reacts with fear. 
Those that react in this way keep getting targeted. They leave those alone that either laugh it off or ignore them and walk away with confidence.

Standing your ground and just listening, you handled his rage by not reacting.  Nice job. 

[mercury]

Ready,

I am sorry about  your wife and her being so lost within herself. I am glad that you understand that this is her problem and her's alone. What makes me so mad is that these MLCers run amoke and hurt the one that loved them. I wish we could put them in a patted room and just check on them once in a while so their craziness does effect us. Life and peace is hard enough without them continues screwing up.
Big Hug to you my friend.

[BraveNewWorld]

I wrote about my friend. Feel a bit guilty writing about it here, but I'd value advice if anyone's willing. My friend wrote to me today asking if I'd sponsor him to become a Catholic. He wants to work through the Catholic church's RCIA program. I had no idea at all that he was religious. I think his wife and her family are Catholics.

I remember DGU writing one time that during MLC, religion is in question. I also remember when my wife was going through the early stages she was advised by her counsellor that it was important not to make a big decision during such an emotional moment.

It asks questions of me. I guess I have an underlying fear of being abused, because he was monstrous to me. He also doesn't seem to understand that. I also have belief. While I struggle at times because the Catholic church has been dreadful to so many people ( I won't even let my sons out of my sight at church ) it has always been a strength for me, and I'd be content to help him share in the strength it gave me. I also believe there are no accidents and that I'm being asked/tested in my faith.

It just strikes me as unusual. I think maybe the first step is to have a coffee with my friend.

Logistically too it is hard. I have a very busy life with my Spanish classes, my work, my children and my music commitments. RCIA is 22 weeks of commitment.

bnw

[SavingGrace]

BNW,
I was the Director of Religious Education for the Catholic Church and ran the RCIA program during one of my H's assignments. If you were to come to me to seek advice and you told me you were conflicted, I would ask these questions of you as the potential sponsor and to your friend:

1) how did you honestly feel when your friend asked you to be his sponsor? Fearful? Honored? Concerned? Inadequate? Don't be dishonest with your answers because this is critical in deciding how you want to proceed.
2) if you feel compelled to say yes, is it out of a sense of duty as a Catholic? Obligation to your friend? Or is it done freely without reservation?
3) if deep in your heart you feel called to be his sponsor, are you prepared to make the commitment without reservation and without resentment to the time commitment and to embrace the teachings of the Church while you are in the classroom participating and discussing the teachings with him?
4) if you are still conflicted with sponsoring your friend, are you able to personally explain to him why you are?
5) if you truly want to be his sponsor, would you at any time seek counsel about your reservations with a priest to explain your resentments and concerns about the Church, your friend's abuse, or do you feel talking to a priest could only add to your resentment? 

I believe if you get to the root of your concerns and answer these questions honestly and other questions that may come up while asking them of yourself, you will know what is preventing you from making a decision about being your friend's sponsor. If you don't want to do it, there is no shame in saying you are honored by his request but you personally don't believe you have what it takes to give him the full support of sponsorship that he deserves. Sponsoring is a more than just sitting in a classroom. It is helping form their experience and relationship with the Lord and with the Church. It is being their companion and share in their faith journey. It will enrich your life as well. 

You will know what to do and the right thing to do. Pray for guidance. Answer these questions if you can and talk to your friend. He is making a BIG commitment. At the very least he deserves your honesty. He will respect you for it. 

~SG

[Dontgiveup]

I remember DGU writing one time that during MLC, religion is in question.

What I have written is from other sources, typically Conway or RCR.  Conway refers to God as one of the four "enemies" of the MLCer.  He wrote that their core values are turned upside down, which is what makes it a crisis.  I also like the definition of MLC being "an extreme period of doubt and anxiety".

Here are a few things RCR wrote about Christian beliefs in some threads.

Most MLCers leave their faith. Some attend church with their families on occasion, but it’s really just to be polite or do it for show

Doubt is normal and for some doubt leads them to continue in their faith, whereas most MLCers become so angry and disillusioned that church is simply another rule.

This may have been said to provoke or test you, but deeper than that, it was an expression of her turmoil and doubt. But taking it personally, you see it as evil or demonic. Doubt is not evil, it's part of crisis, part of self-questioning, part of life and part of being Christian. She is feeling as though God has given up on her or not kept up his sidde of the bargain. She resents him for putting her in this life; she's angry and lashing out. That's not evil, it is a clue to her emotional turmoil.

[BraveNewWorld]

SavingGrace,

Thanks. I feel all of those things - fearful that my friend isn't 100% in his right mind, and may end up blaming me - honoured that he would, ask me, concerned for him, inadequate because my marriage failed - as a Catholic.

My biggest problem is with the time commitment, because I have my children full time every other week, and would have to choose time with my friend or time with my children. Right now I feel that I have to spend it with them, but as a Catholic I feel called to help my friend. I'm trying to decide. If time wasn't an issue I'd stand by my friend, and stand by my faith. I just don't think it's practical or fair on my children and I to be apart for another night each week for 11 weeks.

I could talk to my friend about it, and I'm confident he would understand - he made that clear when he asked.

I don't resent the church. I sing and play music each week there - I pray, I have friends there. It is part of my culture and I suppose Self. I think like most people, I'm alarmed by the depth of abuses from the church, and wary of them. I've been fortunate to have been helped by the church and would never dissuade someone from showing an interest in joining, but I'd certainly be honest about my experiences and my doubts. I think that's what my faith teaches. It's how I was taught ( by priests ). I'd want him to understand that it's ok to question it too - and like anything else - I feel that it's up to each of us how we relate to it - it's not going to just solve problems for him.

I think that my friend is undergoing a midlife transition at least - which is why I posted on this thread about differences in men and women - because I feel that I've seen similarities in my wife and my friend - in the way they've coped with the loss of abusive parents, their monster/anger and the swing in my friend to embrace Catholicism. In all the time we've talked he has never mentioned it before. [ I do think there are differences in men and women too in MLC - but I think that there are remarkable overlaps in what I've seen here ].

DGU, I realize that RCR's writings were about Christians dropping belief - but I wonder if embracing religion is something that can happen too. I might be clutching at straws. My feelings are that mostly the change in personality/monster and depression are so very similar in both cases - and then swinging to a new religion seems huge to me.

bnw

[Dontgiveup]

DGU, I realize that RCR's writings were about Christians dropping belief - but I wonder if embracing religion is something that can happen too. I might be clutching at straws. My feelings are that mostly the change in personality/monster and depression are so very similar in both cases - and then swinging to a new religion seems huge to me.

Sorry BNW, I misunderstood and don't know.

[SavingGrace]

BNW,

I think being honest to your friend will be your freedom and bring your answer you seek. I agree we all should be able to question our faith and even our spiritual leaders. We never should blindly follow. God gives us the gift of reason and knowledge to be able to discern what is right, good and holy. Not all things are good from the seat of the Catholic Church. The abuses and some of the American Catholic Churches stands have me upset and filled with grief. But we are all sinners and the church and every denomination is made up of sinful men and women so naturally we will see the results from such sin as power, corruption, pride, sexual abuse, etc... A tragedy but a very real outcome.

I don't know if your friend is lost and is searching for meaning in his life. If he is choosing the church instead of an affair to do so, the more power to him! He will walk this path maybe with another sponsor, but you can always be a faithful supporter of his journey and intrinsically in tuned with any MLT and possibly guide him in making right choices instead of any destructive choices, which we see here on the forum. 

 

[Rollercoasterider]

I wonder if embracing religion is something that can happen too. I might be clutching at straws. My feelings are that mostly the change in personality/monster and depression are so very similar in both cases - and then swinging to a new religion seems huge to me.

Well, I think this would be common for a non-crisis level midlife transition. But there are some MLCers who explore religions as well. But is their exploration really a part of Escape & Avoid? I think it often is if they are in crisis. Often they are just Aimless Wanderers searching for something to cling to someting that will save them and they are wanting it to be like a magic cure. Yes, faith is about surrender and all that, but think of the Zen proverb:
Before enlightenment: chop wood, carry water.
After enlightenment: chop wood, carry water.
An MLCer who uses religion in their search will be expecting the wood to get chopped and the water to be carried for them after they "accept" the new faith.
I recall one example specifically from DB. One LBSs MLCer had been all over the place with weird behaviors and one days she posted that we would not believe what he was now doing--the post had a lot of laughing and rolling eye emoticons through out and she ended with the surprise...he's becoming Mormon.
I don't know that he stuck to it for even a week--I lost track because that was so far into his crisis that I think she was no longer Standing and thus not posting much and may have stopped soon after that. But what was scary about him was that he was young--34 or a bit younger at Bomb Drop--and he was a physician.