[limitless]

Then he said in a voice of wonder, “You have such strong feelings.”

With a pang, I realized what I had always known: he never felt anything as keenly as I did.

That was certainly the story of our marriage. He did not seem to experience the highs and lows that I did. Indeed, as you know, when he left he told me two things ..I talk too much and I am too intense.

Is it a crime to be too intense?

Perhaps that is why this hurts me more than it seem to hurt him. Because I have strong feelings.

No.  Not a crime at all.

I used to think that I "felt" more than my Ex.

I know see that his feelings were very intense....and very deep.  Heck, he ran away from home because of the way he felt.

No.  I don't think the MLCer has less feelings than us.  No.  I think maybe they have as much, or even more feelings than us.  They just didn't express them.  They didn't acknowledge them.  Or talk about them.  They denied them for so long.....that they just fell apart and had to run.

I think, at least for my Ex, he may have had more and deeper feelings than I.....he just didn't show them like I would show mine.

And maybe that was the problem all along.

I found the article very disturbing.  And, probably very accurate.

The husband sounded very MLC.  Yes.  He was most likely depressed.  So was she.

L

[osb]

A disturbing article, but also deja vu.

Had a little conversation with my H just last night about feelings - something we're only able to talk about now - H was never quite comfortable with his emotions, seemed afraid of feeling things too deeply (fear of pain?). Inwardly a bit of a softie, but outwardly would do anything to deflect the true emotion from a moment and dissolve it into non-threatening humour (including the silly 'cowboy voice' the H in the article uses! Oy ve). Maybe this is a risk factor for MLC?

What I noticed during his MLC, my H's emotions just disappeared. Completely flat affect. Didn't seem to feel anything, watched his life unravel around him like a depressed person cutting his wrists and disinterestedly watching the blood fall. When H's capacity for emotion returned, that was the moment I first thought he was actually returning.

[Anjae]

Lisa is right, OP, she is depressed because of the way he left. Several of us could be in her position if, for one reason or another, we had not been luckier.

Limitless, not all MLCers keep their feeling hidden. Mine was always much better than be talking about his feelings and not suppressing them. And Mr J surely always showed his feelings. In fact when he left he said that, unlike him, I have no feelings because I never cry  (true, I hardly ever cry but that does not mean no feelings). The other offense was that he could never win an argument with me. Also not true.

During MLC the MLCer feelings and emotions seem to oscillate between over the board and dead. MLCers are over emotional creatures however they do not seem capable of connecting with those that matter to them for so long.

To be frank, FTT, in the end it does not matter why they leave. At least I’ve come to the point where it does not matter. But this is being going on for nearly 8 years for me so it is different that it was 2 or 3 years ago.

[forthetrees]

I said that it mattered HOW, not why they leave.

[Anjae]

Sorry, FTT. Somehow I read why rather than how. Still, how, in the end will also not matter. Or, at least, for me it no longer matters.

Or better, the how and why matter, or may matter, in my view, if the marriage is going to be back on track.

[HeartTattoo]

“We were together a quarter of a century!” I once bawled to a therapist.  She cocked her head and asked, “So?”  A question I found I could not answer.

This therapist sounds like she has the empathy of a MLCer.  She acts like a long, deeply felt, committed R can just be tossed away without a second thought.  That the end of a 25 year long R shouldn't be grieved for.

The depth of loss & grief & pain I see on THS mirrors my own & I know that we all really lived our Rs, really felt our Rs, were deeply committed to our partners.  What is the value of a marriage, of a committed partnership if it can just be tossed aside without a thought? (other than by a MLCer, of course, that is their dysfunction).

Of course, we would all be having much less pain & anger & sadness & loneliness if we hadn't taken our spouses so deeply into our hearts, if we hadn't taken our marriages so seriously.  We probably wouldn't even be gathered here, working through our own pain & helping others to do the same.  But of what worth is that? 

I've mentioned this before, but while talking to a D'ed acquaintance/colleague awhile back about my situation, she said of her new fiance, "I love him, but if he left tomorrow, I wouldn't be devastated'.  Maybe she just doesn't know how she would feel, but I suspect she is keeping this R at a bit of a distance.  I see this similar attitude in those who urged me to "go on a date" six months after H left.  Men are inter-changeable; Rs are inter-changeable.  One wants to leave, just happily let go & find another. 

I disagree with her in the end- it matters HOW someone leaves. Adultery betrayal based on the "I´m not happy" line is not a respectful and valid way to leave. Of course someone has the right to leave. I do think that each spouse owes the other open communication and the effort to resolve issues. That requires telling your partner that there is an issue in the first place.

Not only is it disrespectful & invalid, it is emblematic of their crisis, of their dysfunction.  A healthy new R cannot be undertaken with the baggage of the previous one scattered about.  If your appraisal of your "old R" is based on delusions & blaming & justifications, isn't validated through the process of a couple communicating & working on the R together, the fate of the "new R" is in peril.  This is what we learn, this is what we work on.  This is why we take the time we do to heal.  We know that happiness is not found in discarding the uncomfortable & seeking the buzz of adulation before even bothering to mention it to the current spouse.

This article left me cold.  No one seems to understand, at least in the context of this short recounting, what the hell happened to this R.  The H & the "professionals" are all blase about the death of a marriage & the wife is devastated, but seems to have learned nothing of value. 

[forthetrees]

Yes, we recover, but the scars are there forever. I hold those scars as a survivor and not as a victim, but they remain nonetheless. I have said that if emotional scars were visible, I would look like a burn victim- (victim is in that description, but that is the term).

Medical news today just published a research article about how one cannot forgive oneself until first asking for forgiveness from those who´ve been slighted by our actions. IF the MLCers are able to feel, then human nature being what it is, they suffer until they seek to make amends. That is probably why they run- avoiding a state of even feeling would "feel" better than actually allowing themselves to feel the consequences of their actions. As we have seen, they can run for a loooooong time.

[LisaLives]

NO slight intended at all, but if you have kids, it ABSOLUTELY matters HOW you leave.  If he had left politely, after MC, and not fought to pay me CS, I would not ever have found my way here.  But the WAY he left indicates to me, clearly, that he didn't care what he did to me, or what I thought of him, and that he didn't TRULY care about his kids.  In the end, it doesn't matter TO ME, how or why he left.  I have no reason to ever want to see or hear from him again.  BUT, as far as having a "good relationship, for the sake of the kids" it matters that I have ZERO respect for him, and my kids know it, and always will.  Sure, one day, he might come out of the tunnel and show remorse and apologize, and we can clear the air, but until then, I do NOT issue "get out of jail free" cards.  But that's me, and I know you all are way more forgiving.  But be truthful, if they had left in a better way, it would still be easier to forgive...

[Anjae]

Do you have a link to those medical news, FTT?

Medical news today just published a research article about how one cannot forgive oneself until first asking for forgiveness from those who´ve been slighted by our actions. IF the MLCers are able to feel, then human nature being what it is, they suffer until they seek to make amends.

Yes, and, yet, their running only leads to more things to amend = more things to be forgave. It really is illogical. They are probably just adding layers and layers and layers of more damage, more fog, more self hate. And much more to heal once they are out of the fog.

Yes, Lisa, you are right, if one has kids it matters how they leave. It also matter if MLCer and LBS have a public life and everyone knows what happened/how it happened. After all there is a reason why I don't want a public scandal and don't make much waves: I have a public life (or had) and a project whose reputation I want to preserve.

Of course it would had been much easier to forgive if they had leave in a better way. Don't worry, you're not alone in your zero respect for your husband. I have zero respect for Mr J. And I also have zero "get out of jail free" cards. Like you, maybe one day if he comes out of the fog and so on... for now, zero.

[SwiftCovenant]

This article was on the CBS Miami site this morning and made an appearance on the Drudge Report.  This is exactly the kind of infidelity that my MLC'er committed, and I from what I read many of our marriages fell prey to this.  I think MLC'ers are particularly vulnerable to this new technological infidelity, because they are seeking a new emotional connection with someone other than their spouse  This behavior is slightly different from "sexting", because it's all about the emotional connection and is being termed in this article as "emotional sex."  Of course, in many cases lines continue to be crossed...some begin meeting in person which, of course, can lead to an PA. Posting pertinent excerpts here with a link to the entire article below

It’s a disturbing trend that is being blamed for destroying marriages and ruining families. Experts say it starts as an innocent conversation, but evolves into a deep bond.
 
“He left his Facebook up one day and there was a whole other life,” said one woman.
 
She said her man wasn’t having sex with another woman, but was sharing his deepest feelings with her.

It’s referred to as ‘chexting’ and has been called a new form of betrayal that combines cheating and texting. People have been talking about it all over the internet.
 
“If they’re like, oh, ‘[we're] just friends,’ and get really defensive about it and throw a big fit it’s probably a good sign that they’re trying to get with people other than you,” one woman said.
 
In many ways ‘chexting’ can be a more insidious form of infidelity, according to experts.

“Truly the question becomes, are you texting somebody else things, content, material that you’re not sharing with your partner,” said Dr. Greer.
 
But where does chatting end and cheating begin?
 
“If your partner is texting the minute he wakes up or the minute she wakes up, before you go to bed and you’re feeling really disconnected from them, then you might start to wonder what’s going on,” said Dr. Greer.
 
A partner who is particularly guarded around their phone or one who logs onto the computer at odd hours could also be engaged in ‘chexting’.

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2014/05/28/chexting-breaking-up-happy-homes/

Discussion? Thoughts?