[Ready2Transform]

H says that he doesn't want me to leave but if I need to leave that he fully supports my decision and will always help me however he can. Another side step??

Absolutely.    Makes him seem like a nice guy!  Do what works best for you, always - it will not hinder their crisis.

[stayed]

Stayed it seems like H wants to make me happy. Always planning something fun or somewhere to go?? He always was a planner(except when he was deep in the tunnel for a year+) but this seems different. Not sure what to make of it?? When I said what happens when we just have "real life" and he answered "this is real life. We are only 54 so why not?" I'm not complaining but I do find myself "thinking" about why way too much! ! My issue.....maybe its part of his processing. Doesn't feel like avoidance like before. He seems more content with whatever the activity is. I feel sometimes it is remorse by action.
31

Great discussion my friends.  Remorse is a very tricky thing to be sure you are "seeing", plus, it is impossible not to afraid.  Afraid of reading too much into it.  Afraid of those EXPECTATIONS that we have all been told to "ditch"!  So, whens the time right to have "EXPECTATIONS"? 

I highlighted your comments 31andcounting, because that is the sort of thing my h does.  He is a planner.  He plans wonderful surprises, with a lot of detail too.  Now, I don't want to give you FALSE EXPECTATIONS just because our spouses APPEAR to handle their remorse and regret similarly, but just wanted to comment, that my h does that as well.  It took my h a good year after returning for him to FINALLY realize and "begin" to own what he had done, to me and the kids.  I emphasize "begin" because it was a good year after that, before he actually seemed to SEE just how badly he had behaved throughout those long years. 

The year after return is when our marriage FINALLY began to look like it JUST MIGHT MAKE IT!   I believe he did have "regrets" but I truly believe, if I had just let it all go, had decided that I can't keep on and on about this, that I was "rubbing" in his bad behaviour, I truly feel we would not be where we are today.  That being said, I do realize and understand that everybody is different.  I think in our "hearts" we know what we "need" to be able to remain married and continue to rebuild. 

Some people really don't care, all they want is their MARRIAGE back... good, bad, indifferent, they just want things/their lives, to be as near to how they were as possible.  End of story.  For me, simply returning was not enough.  To each's own... they say.

Hugs Stayed

[OceanLady]

Searching...I believe that they do warn us in their own way.  My H, now xh, told me that he had to go because he could feel the anger building and I believe that he did not want me or our son around when the Monster arrived.  Neither one of us actually knew what was about to happen.  He has been gone for 39 months now and still has the same OW; they have never lived together though so this will take longer than if they did.  The anger has subsided greatly but still nowhere in sight and very little communication from him.  The divorce,  final after 32 months, only seems to have ended Monster but nothing else.  The journey continues out of guilt, I believe. 

[kikki]

Oceanlady - my H did the same thing I think.
Admitted recently that he was so angry in the early days, he had to leave because he thought he might hit me.  (I don't think he has ever hit anyone in his life, apart from one schoolground bully).

I believe he also left to protect us all from monster.  He too shows little sign of monster these days, although still shows irritability at times, and has admitted that things with the OW are tumultuous and he is often awful to her verbally.

[31andcounting]

Thanks Stayed for your comments. I understand no expectations ....I do see it as remorseful and understand I want and expect a new relationship with my H. I will not settle for just being "back"  together. It has to be better. Time will tell:)
31andcounting

[FindingJoJo]

Some people really don't care, all they want is their MARRIAGE back... good, bad, indifferent, they just want things/their lives, to be as near to how they were as possible.  End of story.  For me, simply returning was not enough.  To each's own... they say.

Oh man, the one thing this entire journey has taught me is that I do not want my old marriage back.  It wasn't a bad marriage but my H's actions have pointed out and yes even awakened me.  Now I don't want him to simply return, maybe the early days I probably did but now simply returning is not enough. 

My H recently admitted that for the last year he f'd up his life and mine too.  I think it was the first time he has ever acknowledged how badly his choices have hurt my life too.  Anyway one thing I told H was as he was trying to forgive himself which he must do to remember that we are also both more awake and it was in part due to his actions, we won't ever take our marriage and our love for granted any more.  I need time to process as does he.

[stayed]

Without a doubt FindingJoJo, this is a process.  Trust it and I think your/our lives will be just fine, with or without our spouses.  I think we have to be prepared to lose them completely and they US before we are able to REBUILD a better life together... or even apart, strangely enough. 

I guess letting go means, letting grow!  Letting ourselves GROW and not only accept the outcome but embrace it.  Grow!  Live!  Love!  Life! 

[FindingJoJo]

Without a doubt FindingJoJo, this is a process.  Trust it and I think your/our lives will be just fine, with or without our spouses.  I think we have to be prepared to lose them completely and they US before we are able to REBUILD a better life together... or even apart, strangely enough. 

I guess letting go means, letting grow!  Letting ourselves GROW and not only accept the outcome but embrace it.  Grow!  Live!  Love!  Life!

I agree and yesterday I did tell him I am quite done with him, I have had it and I don't want any part of this.  It was my choice to take this break and one that I feel is going to be huge for me.

[Trustandlove]

This is an excellent thread; on the previous one there were a number of good posts on forgiveness -- it's of course tied in to guilt and remorse, but I'm wondering if those don't merit their own thread?  I was looking, and found them from around post 141 on the old thread -- Bewildered had put a number of good things there. 

Would that be possible?

[LaughLoveLive]

Oh man, the one thing this entire journey has taught me is that I do not want my old marriage back.  It wasn't a bad marriage but my H's actions have pointed out and yes even awakened me.  Now I don't want him to simply return, maybe the early days I probably did but now simply returning is not enough. 

This is totally true for me too. I don't want my old marriage back now either but a new and better relationship between two healed and whole people with a whole new perspective. Who knows weep heather that will ever happen! My H has said once "I am sorry for all the pain I'm causing" and I know feels guilty, guilty, guilty. Getting past guilt seems to be very hard.

Just one thing is like to add to this discussion is that my H will need to show his remorse to our children too. Both girls, aged 18 & 11, have said to me quite recently things like "dad has never even apologised to me or acknowledged that this has been difficult and upsetting for me" theft are hurting too and he will hopefully eventually see that.