[bookwrmmom]

El Ray,

As you know I have held my peace on the threat that I rec'd (regarding another member) for months. The only reason I bring it up here is because I felt that I needed to confirm what was posted. I certainly don't want drama, because God knows we have had enough of that from our spouses.

The vast majority of interactions that I have had here at HS have been wonderful, and I would not be where I am in my healing without it. However I think it bears a short reminder that we are on the internet, and not everyone has other's best interests at heart. I was shocked and appalled when the member threatened this man, and sadly not shocked when I found that it had happened yet again to another male board member.

So just a friendly reminder, this is an AMAZING resource and tool for this tough journey we are on. However, there are some very broken people here as well. Try to use good judgement in how much you share about yourself, especially when venturing into the social media aspect of it.

That's all folks.

[bipolared]

Hawk, I think she will see that you are taking the high road and being honorable.  I have a friend who rails on me all the time b/c she thinks I am being too nice to H.  I have actually discussed it with my Ds(they are slightly older than yours) and they are very appreciative and admiring of my behavior.  I think your D will see your strong character and kindness as a good model for behavior and love her dad all the more for trying to make things better for her.

You think BP . Can't tell you what a relief that is to hear and from somebody that has girls in the same sitch.
l've worried about all this from day one.
But W and l have never liked bs or wanted to be hating in anyway.
l know yeah sure , that sorta means w gets of scot free but not really. She knows there's a line with me and it's about d now , among other things.
And she bends over backwards for it all in anyway she can and then some . So ,reading and hearing what others go through well , let sleeping dogs lie l reckon .
Besides , who wants to live hating and bitter ?

But yeah there has been the example to d thing buggen me.
So do you think l should talk to her like you did , sorta explain the sitch  , or maybe just let it ride . She s only 13 , l've never know as yet ?

I'm no expert but I would wait a bit if I talked to her at all-I saw a big jump in maturity in my D's from 13-15.  The only reason I brought it up was b/c this friend kept harping on me being treated with disrespect and I wanted to see if there was anything to it. Then too, she has her own issues that make her sensitive to this, I think.  Of course, my D's are not aware of the worst things(to my knowledge) but they knew right from the start that there was something wrong with their dad. 
I do agree with Elray in that you shouldn't take too much bad behavior and blatant disrespect but I was thinking your W hasn't been as dreadful as some? 
I just try to keep the lines of communication open, we usually have pretty much weekly talks(I guess a houseful of women makes that easy!).  They are at a really sensitive age as far as men go, and their outlook on future relationships; this worries me a great deal.  It's just a big mess all around, isn't it?  And you are right-the only thing we can do is run things by each other and hope for the best.

[terrified_in_TN]

Hawk,

I think the key for our kids is to find that space where we behave with grace, but not as a doormat.  It is a fine line to walk.

Bend over too far, and you daughter may spin into your W's narcissistic influence and believe men are there to make her happy.  But show grace in adversity, and you teach what a real man looks like.
...

  I am finding out this is SO true.  It is a VERY fine line.  I have D16 full time, and although I look at her as very mature for her age, it is sometimes hard to remember that she IS still just a kid.  In many ways I am so blessed:  straight A student, keeps her nose clean, no trouble.  Almost the perfect child.  HOWEVER, she is leaning on her boyfriend way too much for support, and I have allowed it (no, nothing BAD happening between them), but I think I need to pull the reins back on the time she spends with her bf.  She gets pissy if she doesn't get to see him when SHE wants to.  But I see history repeating...her WORDS say "oh, he is just a high school thing-its not serious", yet her ACTIONS say otherwise.  I am concerned she isn't more social.  When I approached her about it not too long ago she says "I don't want to hang around them, all they do is drink and smoke pot."  On the one hand, I am glad she has a good head on her shoulders regarding that stuff; on the other, the lack of social interaction with anyone other than her boyfriend is very concerning to me.

  Here is the thing I am finding extremely difficult:  How do I sit her down and have that HARD talk with her (or discipline her if needed), when otherwise she is a model daughter?  Also, how does one step into that "authority" figure when needed, considering all she is going through and she has also witnessed first hand the lowest point of my life?

  It is a struggle for me.  A BIG struggle.

-T

[OldPilot]

Hawk,

I think the key for our kids is to find that space where we behave with grace, but not as a doormat.  It is a fine line to walk.

Bend over too far, and you daughter may spin into your W's narcissistic influence and believe men are there to make her happy.  But show grace in adversity, and you teach what a real man looks like.
...

  I am finding out this is SO true.  It is a VERY fine line.  I have D16 full time, and although I look at her as very mature for her age, it is sometimes hard to remember that she IS still just a kid.  In many ways I am so blessed:  straight A student, keeps her nose clean, no trouble.  Almost the perfect child.  HOWEVER, she is leaning on her boyfriend way too much for support, and I have allowed it (no, nothing BAD happening between them), but I think I need to pull the reins back on the time she spends with her bf.  She gets pissy if she doesn't get to see him when SHE wants to.  But I see history repeating...her WORDS say "oh, he is just a high school thing-its not serious", yet her ACTIONS say otherwise.  I am concerned she isn't more social.  When I approached her about it not too long ago she says "I don't want to hang around them, all they do is drink and smoke pot."  On the one hand, I am glad she has a good head on her shoulders regarding that stuff; on the other, the lack of social interaction with anyone other than her boyfriend is very concerning to me.

  Here is the thing I am finding extremely difficult:  How do I sit her down and have that HARD talk with her (or discipline her if needed), when otherwise she is a model daughter?  Also, how does one step into that "authority" figure when needed, considering all she is going through and she has also witnessed first hand the lowest point of my life?

  It is a struggle for me.  A BIG struggle.

-T

Why is this so bad?
It sounds rather normal to me,
I think the fact that she is having a relationship is good.

She needs to try on different looks to see how it feels.

I would step back and watch and trust that you have brought her up well.

I am so blessed:  straight A student, keeps her nose clean, no trouble.

Look at the ACTIONS  ^^^^^^

[elray]

Hello friends, as I indicated in my last post, I've recently been doing a lot of thinking about my participation in this community. 

I've learned a tremendous amount about myself. 
I've made a surprising number of good friends from around the world.
I've blown off steam and frustration, and like to think I helped a few folks along the way. 
Hopefully I haven't over-shared, or self-indulged too much in my attempts to fix everyone else!
:-D

However, I also see in myself a bit of circling, a bit of picking at my scabs and a bit of dwelling too much on the past.  I need to look to the future; otherwise, I fear getting stuck.  As a result, I'm going to unplug for a while, perform a personal re-boot, refocus on my GAL, and re-assess my time spent here at a later date. 

I wish you all the best, until we meet again. 

[stayed]

Quite honestly, I don't think the effects of this stuff shows up until later, in the kids lives.  Yes, you will get a drop in grades quite often or bed wetting from young children, or withdrawal etc.  It sort of sneaks up on them I think.  Funny things happen.  Funny strange, not funny ha ha! 

It's a nasty business. 

Hugs Stayed

[MyBrainIsBroken]

My granddaughter's 13yo. She cycles between acting like an adult to acting like a young child to acting her age.

[Braveheart]

Quote from: OldPilot on Today at 07:00:45 AM
Quote from: terrified_in_TN on Today at 06:44:18 AM
My wife obviously wanted the "white picket fence" and "the good guy" when she was younger.  She never went through the "bad boy" phase.....until MLC.
I dont think the point is for us to change ourselves into BAD BOYS as that will only attract BAD GIRLS.
Not what I want at least.

I know there are plenty of people who will find you quite attractive(talking about women not me)

Sorry to inject yet again, but it's not really bad or good, it's confidence, a strutt, a look, unfortunately those things often come along with the "bad boys".

My point initially was that it isn't a "bad boy phase".  Don't be angry with your wife for having a natural attraction.  It's encoded in her as much as your female sexual biases.   She has desires for both bad boy and a nurturing protective pair bonding.  We all have some bad boy in us. Some more than others.  Mlc simply releases social inhibitions but long term marital success hinges on being able to tap into both sides of your male nature.

You have the same duality in your desire.. A lady in the street and a wh*re in the sheets.  So don't be so quick to judge her desire as bad or "something She needs to find elsewhere".  You may very much enjoy releasing that side of yourself.

There has been testing done on what type of man is attractive to women. As it's turned out it varies with their cycle, they are hot for the bad boys during ovulation and crave the beta nice guy post ovulation...When menopause hits, strangely enough about the same time as MLC, some women experince an increase in testosterone and crave the attention of other men, but actually begin to find even the touch of their husband distasteful..... at "margaret 70095 " find a chronlogical example of what we've witnessed, but from the woman's side who actually is aware of what's happening, but can't seem to control it anyway. http://www.patient.co.uk/forums/discuss/is-menopause-threaten-your-marriage--270288

[Braveheart]

hawk-don't beat yourself up too bad.

One thing I am very curious of, and I know we will never find out....

MLC seems to be such a male dominate dis-ease, as evident by the sheer numbers of women on this forum.  Us men are certainly a minority.  So it looks like only a very small fraction of women actually go through MLC.  Hopefully the odds are in your kids favor as long as they are taught not to "lose" themselves in another person, and not to get involved with someone who "needs fixing".

So, how did us men on this forum get so lucky as to end up with MLC wives? 

-T

I really don't think MLC is a male thing, it's just until recently guys have not communicated what they've gone through out of embarassment, there was no outlet for it.  Let's face it, bringing up the fact your wife is having it off with other men is like admitting you were not enough man to keep her...

I know when I started my journey on this I went to the book store looking for self help and found hundreds of books on relationships, but they were all geared to women....Because men were leaving women in droves? No, because the media industry knows women are the prime spenders of money. 

Anytime men have try to do get together and compare notes regarding women they are shut down or shamed as "Bitter" or "Misogynists". Off shoot forums like this often end up getting henpecked to keep the boys in line, which limits open discussion.

Personally I don't agree having women in a forum like this, I've seen other Men's forums that ended up getting shut down because some woman took offence over what men said they found attractive...

[OldPilot]

I really don't think MLC is a male thing, it's just until recently guys have not communicated what they've gone through out of embarassment, there was no outlet for it.  Let's face it, bringing up the fact your wife is having it off with other men is like admitting you were not enough man to keep her...

I know when I started my journey on this I went to the book store looking for self help and found hundreds of books on relationships, but they were all geared to women....Because men were leaving women in droves? No, because the media industry knows women are the prime spenders of money. 

Good Point!

Personally I don't agree having women in a forum like this, I've seen other Men's forums that ended up getting shut down because some woman took offence over what men said they found attractive...

Well we  will let them post here - I think that it is good to learn from each other.

And if you are ever to have a relationship with a woman again - why not practice here  to be able to get along?