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Author Topic: MLC Monster Re: Biochemistry, neurotransmitters and brain research II

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MLC Monster Re: Biochemistry, neurotransmitters and brain research II
#80: December 31, 2015, 02:16:46 PM
It truly is frightening, Velika. Thank you for posting those links. Certainly too, for any of us who consider an anti-depressant after BD in order to cope, the risks are real and should be fully understood before taking anything. There is no "magic pill."  :(
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V
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Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#81: February 13, 2016, 08:21:40 AM
(Apologies if there is already a thread on this. Feel free to merge!)

To start, I don't think my husband has frontotemporal lobe dementia. However, reading this article has me convinced that MLC is in fact some type of syndrome affecting the frontotemporal lobe. When you read about the personality changes -- especially in regards to inhibitions and impulsive behavior -- it's very interesting.

A Lesser-Known Dementia that Steals Personality (The Atlantic)
http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/01/a-lesser-known-dementia-that-steals-personality/282661/

One thing that really struck me was the part about humor and sarcasm. I noticed as well how my H has a very different sense of humor since this started. Very drawn to chidike or adolescent type humor.

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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#82: February 13, 2016, 11:12:41 AM
Awesome article. I truly believe that one day it will be possible to identify what has caused these catastrophic changes in our spouses and I will not be at all surprised to see areas of the brain affected.
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#83: February 13, 2016, 11:37:26 AM
Awesome article. I truly believe that one day it will be possible to identify what has caused these catastrophic changes in our spouses and I will not be at all surprised to see areas of the brain affected.

I absolutely agree xyz, and thank you for posting this, V! I will never not believe there is a brain-science connection to this, even in less aggressive cases. Even in my own case!
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#84: February 13, 2016, 11:47:06 AM
Interesting post, V. I also agree that there is a brain-science connect to this. In my situation, I have a lot of reason to believe that.
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k
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#85: February 13, 2016, 11:59:32 AM
Hi Velika
I am looking forward to reading the article.
I'm another that thought the changes were so extreme there had to be brain changes involved.
We have threads relating to the brain, neurotransmitters etc and somewhere in there I posted about frontotemporal lobe disorders too and how it affects the personality first, vs something like parkinsons and alzheimers, where the personality is one of the last things to be affected.

Also the fact that with depression, the blood supply to the fronto temporal lobe is reduced, which also can drastically change personality.
I just want to be able to scan all of these guys. Wish it was a legal requirement.

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k
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#86: February 13, 2016, 12:20:36 PM
Quote
"Most are expected to live only 10 years after the initial onset. In the meantime, their symptoms only worsen."

I guess we will eventually be able to cross this off as a potential if we don't see the other physical decline that goes along with this disorder.
Think what this proves though, is that something extreme has affected the fronto temporal lobes.  ? severe depression, ? inflammatory processes ?

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V
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#87: February 13, 2016, 02:54:41 PM
Quote
"Most are expected to live only 10 years after the initial onset. In the meantime, their symptoms only worsen."
I guess we will eventually be able to cross this off as a potential if we don't see the other physical decline that goes along with this disorder.
Think what this proves though, is that something extreme has affected the fronto temporal lobes.  ? severe depression, ? inflammatory processes ?

Yes, as I said I am quite sure my husband doesn't have frontotemporal lobe dementia per se. But reading the article made me think that very likely something is going on with that region of the brain.

I asked myself, what else is going on around this time of life? And it is andropause, a decline in testosterone levels and high stress. (Given that anecdotally a stressful event can trigger MLC and is more prevalent among men with high-stress jobs.)

1. Andropause and Frontotemporal Lobe

I Googled andropause and frontotemporal lobe, and found this interesting post on an acupuncturist blog:

The Testosterone-Brain Connection
http://laurelacupuncturesd.blogspot.com/2010/10/testosterone-brain-connection.html

"The frontal lobe of our brain in particular is rich with testosterone receptors, and it is this part of our brain where we process much of our sense of reason. So when we see, hear, taste, smell or touch something our brain decides how to respond to the stimulation based upon how well our frontal lobe is firing. If for example we are low in testosterone our frontal lobe will not fire well and we will begin to lose the response of what we have all known as typically male. Included in this concept could be things like low libido and/or poor motivation for other activities such as work or relationships. This could even include wanting to put positive energy towards the children, or how you interact with your wife. Significant stuff! Remember, our hormones greatly effect how we view and respond to our surroundings. We understand things only as much as what comes through the testosterone filtered actions of the frontal lobe."

Low testosterone in men is also a common cause of depression and is mostly associated with the Dopamine pathways. So these men are often on medications like Wellbutrin or Abilify. Depression from a neurological perspective can be described as a low firing rate of the frontal lobe. And without adequate exposure to testosterone the firing rate will decline rapidly. So you must ask yourself if you are taking these medications if you are treating the core problem or just the symptoms. And at what cost? It is an important concept to consider because without working on the core problem you might be required to take the symptom masking medications indefinitely."

2. Infidelity and Frontotemporal Lobe

If testosterone affects dopamine levels, then it could also explain why MLCers resort to dopamine-seeking activities:

From "Infidelity Lurks in Your Genes," New York Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/24/opinion/sunday/infidelity-lurks-in-your-genes.html?_r=0

"In a 2010 study of 181 young, healthy adults, Justin R. Garcia, then at Binghamton University, found that subjects who carried a variant of one dopamine receptor subtype, the D4 receptor, were 50 percent more likely to report sexual infidelity. This D4 genetic variant has reduced binding for dopamine, which implies that these individuals walk around at baseline feeling less stimulated and hungrier for novelty than those lacking this genetic variant."

From "The Biochemicals of Love" post:
http://www.marriageadvocates.com/2012/09/20/anatomy-of-an-affair-the-chemistry-of-love/

"Increased levels of dopamine also cause a decline in serotonin in areas of the brain related to a sense of well-being or stability of thoughts. Low levels of serotonin lead to depression, but also to other reactions as time goes on. Studies using functional magnetic imagining to measure areas of the brain that light up or react to reduced levels of the chemical found them to be the same areas involved in Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. This may be the cause of the lovers obsessing over one another and all the other symptoms of this disorder that manifest themselves during the infatuation phase of a relationship."

3. Stress and Frontotemporal Lobe

From Stressing Out, Outing Stress, Indiana University
http://www.indiana.edu/~rcapub/v30n2/stress.shtml

This article made me think that it is very important how the spouse reacts to the MLCer so as not to create additional stress. In trying to get through to them we may be actually biochemically making the situation worse.

"These branches can grow--with rest and exercise, and by stimulating the brain through such activities as reading, doing crossword puzzles, and, yes, writing. They can also retract for many reasons, including when we are exposed to stress. Wellman has learned that dendritic shrinking in the prefrontal cortex can result in significant behavioral changes. Repeated exposure to stress can result in longer term damage to the brain's frontal lobe.

"My research has shown that exposure to stress--either over the long term, such as three weeks or even one week or just one day--can produce structural changes in the neurons of the prefrontal cortex," she says. "A neuron's shape is critically important to the way it processes information. We have seen profound changes as a result of stress and changes in behavior that the prefrontal cortex is directly responsible for."

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I'm not a scientist at all, but I agree with others that something physical is going on. My number one reason for thinking is that my husband's father and grandfather both suddenly left their wives. My husband was always disgusted with his father's behavior. Therefore it does not follow that he would do the same.

I also believe that in a normal split, the behavior of the man would not change toward his children. I know from my experience and from reading others' on this board, this is not the case with what we are witnessing.

(By the way, I'm sure this territory is already covered here on the boards ... So for those of you familiar with this site, my apologies!)

With all this, it makes sense that someone under a lot of stress who may be going through andropause and starts an affair would have a hard time quitting. It also explains why we all are witnessing personality changes.

My question is, then, why for some is this change so sudden? Or is it that some are just more biologically susceptible to affair addiction and so if they do take up with someone else they might be unable to quit, whereas someone less prone to this addiction would confess to their mistake?

I would also like to find more information about the frontotemporal lobes and eye appearance, as I know I and others have witnessed a very "flat" look in our spouses' eyes.
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« Last Edit: February 13, 2016, 02:57:44 PM by Velika »

c
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#88: February 13, 2016, 04:42:55 PM
I think someone said that the 'shark eyes' are seen during depression.  Or it's caused by a ton of guilt & shame?  Who knows but most of us have seen it.


Here's the previous discussion link:  http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=6315.0


That's just for your information.  The new thread is interesting & there's always something new in brain research so carry on.
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R
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Re: Frontotemporal Lobe Disorders
#89: February 13, 2016, 07:13:40 PM
Actually I am not entirely sure my xH isn't FTD. The personality change is quite profound. He is 4 years in, I suppose that with time I will eventually be certain one way or the other.
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