[gman242]

Mods, I hope this is ok for a second thread..

I've been in a few threads where this has come up and I wanted to post my own experiences. I've been through an MLT and could have been an MLC at one point in my life, if it had gone down a different road.

I know we all grapple what it is our spouses are going through and how we doubt and fail to understand what is really going on. I am new to this with my W, but I'm not as I've had many crises myself. I believe at the root of it, as we so often read, is that it comes from not being adequately quipped to understand relationships, develop self esteem, problem solve and navigate life.

All of my crises were rooted in the same thing: becoming stuck and not knowing how to get beyond it.

Before I met my wife I dated a girl for about 3 and years. I liked her, I really did. She was fun, she had a way of making everything in life special and like everyone else, she had her own issues. But I also didn't love her, I just settled for her because I knew she wouldn't leave me and I wanted to break the pattern of women who just seem to "abandon" me all the time.

Sure we had fun, but as time went on, I became absolutely miserable. Had we gotten married, she'd be on here posting right now about my MLC. I did everything you read about... I snuck off to bars, did all kinds of things behind her back, cheated on her and also was very very angry at her, like she was holding me back.

It all happened because I was emotionally abused growing up, my self worth and self esteem were so poor, I could only dream of having what seemed so easy for other people. It's very difficult to explain what happens to you after all of that, but you learn to settle, to cope and to think your way around things rather than dealing with them head on. The people that do are the ones we are envious of and I wasn't mad at my girl friend, I was at myself because I was dependent on her for emotional stability and yet I was unhappy with her.

I'm not saying that's the case with your spouse at all, but it's one scenario. Like I said, it's the pressure of "being stuck" and being unable to make changes in your life is what does it. It could be work, where we spend most of our time or our marriage, the other half of our lives. But it builds and builds and being stuck and unable to move upwards in our personal development and growth, we start dreaming about and finding ways out.

It was in another thread I commented on that it seems common that many men, who would previously not do so, have begun being interested in hunting, survival and other things. It's a popular, hipster fantasy that's now being sold to younger folks trying to enter a difficult job market.  You just need to find a sucker with a large piece of land, convince them to let you live there cheaply or rent free in a shack you build, because of your progressive, hippy idealism and then start your own blog where you can earn your living and become a minor internet celebrity.

As most things goes, it's a false fantasy. A quick youtube search will reveal many, many videos of people who traded down for the "tiny house" life style and regretted it. Aside from the debt (yea those things cost 60k and you need an 50k tow vehicle!!), many relationships have been ruined by the experiment.

When I had my MLT, I was stuck in my previous job. I tried as hard as I could and I felt like that was as far as I was going to get and I just accepted defeat. My marriage was just ok at that point, she was knee deep in avoiding her personal issues and I was content to let her. I had two college degrees and none of the respect I had in my former job and I often joked, all I did was change light bulbs for a living. I was ignored by a lame duck college president, two librarians who wanted to argue politics and kiss the a$$es of the faculty and I was under a microscope constantly.

At the time, there was no where for me to go and boy did I fantasize about quitting. I couldn't move up (partly not my fault and also because I didn't have the self esteem to go out for job interviews) so I wanted out. All I dreamed about was building an RV out of an old truck.. taking an extended leave of absence and driving around the country with my son.

There's always an element of validation to every MLC or MLT. We don't have the emotional stability we need to navigate life and it needs to come from within, it's something we were never given by our parents when we were children. So we join bands, start blogs, join groups, go to bars and find other men and women to give it to us. Our minds go back to when it was easy.. high school or college. You just do what other people do and fit in. These "groups" you can get into are very, very addictive. The attention, validation and support you can get is intoxicating and it's instant.

Maybe I'm unique. I have a strong conscience and the willingness to bear burdens and I did the right thing and broke up with my girlfriend. We weren't living together or married, so the damage wasn't as bad, but it was the right thing to do. I hated my job so I kept putting myself out there until I found one I liked. I really had to suck it up to sit in the hot seat during an interview, multiple times and the experience was good for me.

I don't know what your spouse is going through. But we're all here for the same reasons: we're scared, we want answers and hope.. The only thing that has gotten me this far is realizing that there's nothing I can do about my W's MLC. You just have to live like they aren't coming back, continue on your path of personal growth, protect yourself and your children if necessary and watch their actions for clues. You also have to learn to forgive yourself and accept that it's not your fault that this happened to you. I found that the hardest thing to accept myself.

You can only control yourself and you know your spouse best. It's up to you if you want to stand or not, to listen to advice from your family or not.. etc etc. This is the LBS script and we should have it memorized by now 

[Anjae]

Mods, I hope this is ok for a second thread..

What do you mean if it is ok for a second thread? I don't find a previous thread on the matter or with a discussion icon from you. I can only find Wife's MLC 2 and Wife's MLC. Is this your thread story thread? Is this a newa nd first discussion thread where you want to share and discuss something, other than what you have on your personal story thread?

[gman242]

It's a different discussion from my personal thread.

 I've asked questions in the past and had them moved to my own thread, so I just wanted to ask if it was ok.

[heroIam]

I don't know what you're spouse is going through. But we're all here for the same reasons: we're scared, we want answers and hope.. The only thing that has gotten me this far is realizing that there's nothing I can do about my W's MLC. You just have to live like they aren't coming back, continue on your path of personal growth, protect yourself and your children if necessary and watch their actions for clues. You also have to learn to forgive yourself and accept that it's not your fault that this happened to you. I found that the hardest thing to accept myself.

You can only control yourself and you know your spouse best. It's up to you if you want to stand or not, to listen to advice from your family or not.. etc etc. This is the LBS script and we should have it memorized by now 

Still trying to work out the insert quote feature!  Sorry if it's screwed up.  lol
I agree with the above for sure.  If it's MLC or not this holds true for all of us.
I've always had a doubt on whether it's MLC with my H.  Not sure where or why the doubt comes from......still working on that one.  Regardless, there is nothing we can do.....Pave the way may be something we can do, but no one knows what will work and what doesn't work to bring our spouses home.  It's all so different yet the same for most of us.  Thanks for starting this thread.

[whatthe????]

thank you for this gman.
I too, have wondered whether my h was having an mlc or if he just wanted to check out for a while (19 months now).  Granted he is in and out and there are things that should have grounded him by now but if you think in terms of MLC, then losing your job may very well push you deeper.  They have to develop the strength to do this, whatever it is, on their own.  My h being a former Marine with no combat experience, shocks me that he is sinking to levels that I didn't think he would ever know about. 
I definitely think his started by dissatisfaction in the job for so long but it stemmed from having everything done for him as a child.  He was never given the opportunity to experience adversity and to learn from it.  So now, in his mid 40's, he's trying to figure out how to unef himself from this situation he has created!

[gman242]

Regardless, there is nothing we can do.....Pave the way may be something we can do, but no one knows what will work and what doesn't work to bring our spouses home.  It's all so different yet the same for most of us.  Thanks for starting this thread.

So many things are similar, yet so different! I agree, it's maddening when you take into account all of the advice you get, online, from family and friends, unsolicited or not..

You can leave the door open... 

My h being a former Marine with no combat experience, shocks me that he is sinking to levels that I didn't think he would ever know about. 
I definitely think his started by dissatisfaction in the job for so long but it stemmed from having everything done for him as a child.  He was never given the opportunity to experience adversity and to learn from it.  So now, in his mid 40's, he's trying to figure out how to unef himself from this situation he has created!

We have to learn to be our own parents at some point and we have to go through the journey to find out our own reasons to do it and how to grow.

I don't know what your husband did, but believe it or not, the military is an attractive option for many who didn't get the parenting they needed at home. It's not the discipline they like (or so as one would assume) but the fact that they are told what to do and they just do it and turn their brains off; it's a way of escaping. Enlisted housing is often like dorm rooms at college campuses.. just full of people BBqing, playing video games and being rowdy. They typically go to work, get told what to do and then come home and play. They just tend to avoid the growing up process and extend their high school years.

I'm not sure what your husband did, but having everything done for him as a child was a recipe for failure. My mom was the same way, but she also had a way of setting me up to fail, which is what I consider the emotional abuse. I actually stood up to her the other day, which is something I never would have done before. We were discussing S and his behavior at school and rather than encourage me to practice consistent boundaries and rules, she simply told me "I don't want it enough and I either can't or won't do it". I told her I wasn't disagreeing with her, but she's turning a simple matter of proper parenting into a character defect, which was totally unnecessary. That was the way she talked to me when I was a kid, everything was some character, moral, intellectual or something other deficiency.

 

[Anjae]

I've asked questions in the past and had them moved to my own thread, so I just wanted to ask if it was ok.

It is.

[whatthe????]

gman,
H was actually born with a silver spoon in his mouth.  Could do no wrong; poster child for most everything; make sure you always look a certain way, act a certain way.  His mom was a teacher so in a very loving and teacherly way she wanted to make sure nothing reflected poorly on her as a parent.  so as a high school senior, instead of her son getting an f on a paper, she wrote it for him....WTH?  So now, he has no idea how to get himself out of this mess that he has made.

One of the big things H complained about after BD and during monster was that I told him what to do or didn't give him choices.  That is one of the things that he loved about the Marines, following orders and that someone else had to make the big decisions. 

[Roma]

Thank you gman,

I told my H about what you said about the tiny house, quitting your job etc. and your solutions for those thoughts

Who knows if it's helped him yet at least I can say I got it from someone else who went through what he did/is.

Thank you again for sharing your experience and your wisdom. You are apprecited.

~Elegance

[hawk]

Mlc or not , l've wondered the same thing 4yrs now.
We'd had avery rough few yrs and it effected us both differently but the marriage and our time together basically went to sh@t through all the changes and stresses . Her ways in coping were on my nerves and mine hers .
Lot's of stuff going down for us and her health had gone to total crap too , she even went into early menopause , 39.
She hid depression and l wouldn't talk about my stuff , all so different from our usual selves. Even l wondered if l wanted to be married anymore 100 times.
All the perfect storm for us, perfect.
Bad marriage and getting out , or mlc ?

Still , many have said she's script for mlc , even to affair downing, but that's still going actually so even that maybe not an affair down , maybe it was real , 4yrs, seems weird bc most of them don't seem to last but there are other things too ,
She's together , kept work and responsibilities going , did everything she had too.
To this day l'm really still not sure which one it was tbh.
lt's about closure for me , l'm not standing, but figuring it out. And learning still , how to cope with om's around your kids and things like that.
Every time l think l have it though something new pops up..

l often wonder about the tiny house fad over there, it hasn't caught on here yet .
60k eh , wondered what they were paying for them. l only paid 95 for my new place , yeah it's a renovator but it's huge inside , still quite tidy and has beautiful views and a great block.
But l can see especially guys thinking to hell with this , go for the simple life.
A lot of guys aren't allt hat fussy about what they live in and after 20 or 30yrs of trying in a marriage and all the trappings and bs, only to have it all blow to sh@t and wind up having to fork out money to their ex;s forever in a day - really , who the hell wouldn't think to hell with the lot of it.
Even the place l've picked up is my version of that only trying to do a bit better than that but l sure didn't want anymore of that bs, look where it got me.
So l can get it , damn shame though that some might end up in debt and maybe worse off .
l tried to cover my bases in that and my place will be worth 3x what l paid for it when it's finished and it's also in a very rare and hard to get spot with it's views on the edge of town and what have you so hopefully what ever l do with my future from here , with a bit of luck l've at least got that part covered.
But l can see where the guys are at , for sure.