[nah]

How long was it for you before you reached a point (if you have) when you honestly need nothing to be said or heard by your vanisher at all? Even if only in your own head lol.

When I'm dead?  Maybe a few weeks after I'm dead... 

This might surprise a few of you since I'm remarried, I'm the one that moved away, and I feel like my life has expanded so much since he walked out the door.  But still... I still sometimes (not all night or every night like I did in the past, but sometimes) have those conversations. 

I've been reading Shock's sister's thread with interest.  Some of you are wondering why she is hesitating to share her feelings with her ex.  I asked the same thing of her a while back. Kind of answers a few questions to those of us that have vanishers, don't you think?

I'm a good example. Even though I have had a few crumbs from The Leaver, I doubt very much he will ever come completely clean. Unlike many of you, I do have a window.. his life sucks.  Big time sucks. But his ego is way too fragile to ever in a million years to admit that he destroyed everything that was good and it was all a big fat mistake bc he was weak. Even if he comes out of the fog, I feel the most he might do is leave her and try again.

[stillbaffled]

I'm a good example. Even though I have had a few crumbs from The Leaver, I doubt very much he will ever come completely clean. Unlike many of you, I do have a window.. his life sucks.  Big time sucks. But his ego is way too fragile to ever in a million years to admit that he destroyed everything that was good and it was all a big fat mistake bc he was weak. Even if he comes out of the fog, I feel the most he might do is leave her and try again.

Yes, your window shows you that your MLCer doesn't have such a rosy life.  I don't have a window like that. 

I do agree, though, that my MLCer will most probably never admit that he made the biggest mistake of his entire life (followed closely by marrying someone that had already had four marriage licenses in just one county in one state!).

For sure I think that if he ever does come out of whatever he's in, he'll just send her packing (if she hasn't left already for number 6) and try again.   

[Ro828]

I believe mine will also never admit any wrong doing or acknowledge the hurt he caused.  He has already proven he can up and leave without regret/remorse so I, too, fall in the camp that if things don't work out with OW, he'll leave her and recreate another fantasy existence.  So sad.

[forthetrees]

I´m close to 10 years from BD and would still appreciate either an apology, acknowledgement of the pain unleashed or confirmation that his life is unicorns and roses and thus worth all the destruction. But, one of his phrases was that he is never wrong, so I suppose that owning up to this is outside of happening in this plane of reality.

For too long I actually believed that he had wiped me clean from his memory. Now I do not believe that as having spent 30 years together- more than half of our lives, there have to be triggers on a regular basis. Of course, they could be triggering him to be angry, but hey, I exist.

I am coming up on having lived in my house for as long with as without him and take pride in having managed as it is a $h!teton to take care of. My "escape" plan is in the works and I can leave with my head held high knowing I did not leave someone in the lurch.

[Lady Grey]

Hello clanishers

I've been reading along for over a year now, coming up to two years since BD1 and h is a vanisher....

As someone without a window, I definitely benefit from the glimpses others get of their vanisher's "wonderful new life"

I also think if my h does ever come out the other side of whatever this is and realise he f'ed everything up, he is unlikely to admit that to anyone, let alone me. I think he would just keep it to himself and go about making the best of the mess, maybe as others have said, get rid of ow and start again with someone else...another "wonderful new life"

 

[Treasur]

There is obviously a different school of thought about any LBS's wish for some kind of acknowledgement and validation as the recent discussion on ShockSis's thread shows. Some spectrum between 'just get over it bc you need to think positively' to 'yup, it leaves a bit unhealed you have to learn to live with'. And of course we are all entitled to our own POV and healing as we see fit.

Perhaps the vanishers' clan has a slightly different black hole? Idk.
I no longer doubt that I can live with it...what else can one do?
But I find it reassuring that even years later, even with a good life made, it is normal to feel a wish...if no longer a need...for some kind of normal healthy acknowledgement of damage done.
Not the kind of wish that interferes with your day but one that honours the reality of what happened to you bc of others actions, and that it is not ok to treat people that way or to pretend that it is.
That is nothing to do with judging how well the LBS has coped and nothing to do with reconciliation.
And the assumption that if that never happens, and it seems less likely with the vanishers maybe, it confirms that the crisis folks have never entirely returned to being healthy adults or healed from their own self-inflicted damage.

It seems quite possible to me that one can wish for it without expecting it, and without the need for a karma bus to roll over the MLCer either....but maybe we occasionally long for that rare 'window' even second hand bc it is an alternative for the acknowledgement we didn't get. Something that shows it wasn't us and that behaving badly does not produce a delightful life at our expense?

[Milly]

I agree with everything you said, Treasur. That's how I feel.

[sparklestar]

I’ve been reading along on SS thread and saw your posts there Treasur I completely agree.

I do and don’t have a window. I do in the sense that I have heard via a 3rd party some of the crazy that’s has happened in the past 3 years (since BD) and some of the small snippets that would indicate all is not completely rosy with MLCr and OW. And I have the social media view (which I have only seen very occasionally) which tells a story of a happy couple, new house Reno, baby all very rosy indeed so much so I go back to doubting any of the earlier crazy. And yes I know we shouldn’t believe what we see on social media but you’d be hard pushed to not see a very happy set up!

I totally get that it’s harder to heal when we don’t have any snippets of regret or remorse and I think it’s also true that just telling someone not to focus on that and that it shouldn’t affect your healing is pointless.

From my perspective, rightly or wrongly, it absolutely would make a difference to me and my healing were I to know there was regret, that my MLCr knows he messed up. If he left OW it would be such a huge relief - even if he carries on in MLC and went on to another it would still provide me with some validation.

My BD was just over 3 years ago, I was a hardcore stander originally and was furious at the suggestion of moving on or finding someone else yet I was completely dumbfounded when I did meet someone a year later and I am still with that person 2 years on yet that makes no difference to the hurt that’s still inside and that sadness that still lingers - it might always. It also makes no difference to how I feel about getting that insight in to my MLCr being remorseful or admitting he messed up.

Treasur said it perfectly, regardless of how much I loved the man my h was, the enormity of the situation and the trauma I went through means I wouldn’t ever feel I could trust my MLCr again and he has a child with OW so for me the door to reconciliation was closed which is why I moved on. But yet I still don’t know if I will ever stop being bothered by it or get over the hurt and to get full closure I need to hear that regret and remorse. An apology alone wouldn’t cut it esp if he continued with OW.

[Treasur]

Do you know I wonder if the core of what we yearn to hear is as simple as 'you truly mattered to me and I am so sorry that I hurt you'. Just that. Less than 15 words.

I am glad Sparkle that you have hopefully found a good man to share your current life with and that you made some good things for yourself despite what happened to you. But it does not surprise me one whit that you feel as you do. If you were a widow, who loved a new bf or h, yet also felt that you wished your first husband was still alive and with you? No one would find that much of a surprising thing to hear would they? Makes perfect sense to me that a vanisher is not very different at all.

[nah]

I think why those of us with vanishers feel a little differently with the “move forward” group is moving forward was a given, we didn’t have a choice.

When we say we want closure, it’s slightly different than those with “normal” divorce/ break-ups.

It’s very common for those who are left to contact the betrayers ad nauseam in the name of “closure”, that’s not what we are doing here. We were ghosted. Not just by someone we met on a dating site but by our spouses of many years. Wtf??  I’m not even talking about getting answers a year or two after they left. I don’t believe there is one thing they could say to satisfy us in the early days.

We already know they are liars by their actions. I’m talking years after they left. Jmo, but I feel like if he broke down, told me his actions were beyond cruel, I didn’t deserve how he treated me AND what could he do show his true remorse, well then, I would feel a little more like my entire marriage wasn’t a figment of my imagination. Who knows, maybe it will happen some day. For now, I always have my memories and he can’t take those away.