[BonBon]

WP, I don't have hard evidence of physical cheating either.  And if you ask me if I think he did, most days I will say no, I don't think so.  Some days I will say, yes, perhaps, maybe a kiss or makeout session...and on rare days I wonder if there is even more I don't know and have been kidding myself.

In the beginning of our relationship when it became exclusive, I told him, one cheat and I'm out...no second chances.  Funny how you say these things and believe them fully at the time.  Once I discovered the EA though, I wondered if a PA would have been so much worse than I would have walked...but to my surprise, I think I still may have "stood".  I don't really know.  Betrayal is betrayal.  There are degrees but it all ends up in the same pile of poop once push comes to shove.  Some of the cruel things said to me might have even been worse than the betrayal.

TMHP, you will find that you too cycle, and that includes when they begin to reconcile with you.  There are days when its as if nothing ever went wrong with my marriage and there are other days that I wonder what the heck I'm doing here.  Its as though the minute I feel comfortable, I get a big, fat dose of his MLC in my face.  And the days when I feel that I just don't care anymore, he acts like his old self, the one I fell for.  The "hoping" part doesn't come in to play so much at this stage...it's more the "what do I want and how long am I willing to wait for it" is more of the issue I think.

Good for you for GALing...that is a big and wonderful step....

[eternity]

WP, I don't have hard evidence of physical cheating either.  And if you ask me if I think he did, most days I will say no, I don't think so.  Some days I will say, yes, perhaps, maybe a kiss or makeout session...and on rare days I wonder if there is even more I don't know and have been kidding myself.

In the beginning of our relationship when it became exclusive, I told him, one cheat and I'm out...no second chances.  Funny how you say these things and believe them fully at the time.  Once I discovered the EA though, I wondered if a PA would have been so much worse than I would have walked...but to my surprise, I think I still may have "stood".  I don't really know.  Betrayal is betrayal.  There are degrees but it all ends up in the same pile of poop once push comes to shove.  Some of the cruel things said to me might have even been worse than the betrayal.

WP, BB,
My H had an EA 3 years before BD. I call it an EA because H was totally disconnected with me and our S. All his actions showed that he wanted to get out, but when confronting him H stated in anger that he would never go. We got through that episode but I was a mess at the time. MLC never crossed my mind. Only 3 years later with the PA I started analysing from another angle and found MLC and this website
For me the EA was harder than the PA now. Not sure why, maybe because I have more knowledge of what is going on and I was in total ignorance during the EA

Maybe because during the EA H was at home and I got a lot of monster, and I was  neglected emotionally. it was as I did not exist. H hated me and the things I did for him

After I found out about the PA, H left physically but not emotionally. We are  still connected emotionally now.

Haven't we said that all "1cheat and out you go"
If only we knew....
I am +13 months past BD and this sure takes a lot more time than I ever imagined

The thing about never giving yourself for the 100% again is bothering me. This is not how I see myself in a R. i know this new R has to grow again but never having that feeling of belonging together and feeling 100% secure... This is not how I picture this new R

My colleague at work whose H had an affair is saying the same thing: He destroyed that marvellous feeling for her. The rose  coloured glasses fell off. i understand that and my god understand about the raw pain but I just wonder if she did not let him distroy that marvellous feeling and whether she wraps herself in it now?

Wishing you all a lot of patience and faith
E
For me the EA was as much betrayal as the PA now

[eternity]

Forgot to say something:
H returned once way to soon (4 months after BD), left again in panic after 10 days
So, no reconnection/reconciliation but increased touch and goes
I try to have no expectations
I hope one day
E

[stayed]

My colleague at work whose H had an affair is saying the same thing: He destroyed that marvellous feeling for her. The rose  coloured glasses fell off. i understand that and my god understand about the raw pain but I just wonder if she did not let him distroy that marvellous feeling and whether she wraps herself in it now?

I must be like your friend Eternity.  I am somewhat perplexed that you are wondering about if your friend is doing this do herself though.  I am actually questioning how YOU could ever possibly trust your h ever again, he has not betrayed just this ONCE but TWICE.   

Perhaps, I am misunderstanding you but I don't know how anybody can just carry on TRUSTING 100%, not only the person who is responsible for destroying that blind trust but now thanks to being betrayed by somebody I SO trusted, I find it IMPOSSIBLE to completely trust ANYBODY now. 

I feel a little foolish about trusting anybody as much as I had trusted my h.  Looking back, it was an unrealistic, blind, burdensome type of trust.  I still miss it though.  I can and am living without it, but it actually was one of the few "illusions or perhaps delusions" I allowed myself. hehehe.  Really, I did pride myself on being a realist, mind you, that should concern me as my h also considered himself to be a realist, hehehe... mmmmmmmmm 

hugs Stayed

[eternity]

Stayed,

It is a strange feeling I have for a while now. and kind of confirmed by my H on several occasions.
How contradictory this may seem our foundation has been rocked severely, but has not been destroyed, love and trust is still in place. I know and H knows. H said his moving out was not about love. i had to let that sink in. h clarified later that he would always love me and that nobody would ever be able to take my place. I know this is contradictory with his actions. It may sound foolish, but this is the feeling

I am picturing here a reconciled committed R, this means OW gone and no contact whatsoever. if there is still contact there is no reconciled R for me

And my colleague, well she is hurt so much that it affects her R now. So tell me what is the point of standing and wanting to keep your marriage if afterwards you can not let go of this mess. i see her still in tears when we talk about it. She can not get over it. It is more than 3 years. Maybe this just needs more time, but the way I know her she will never be able to let go. Her H destroyed it for her, so why do you stay?. it is like she wants him to be punished from now on because he did this to her.

For me it is clear that if I ever want this to work that also I will need to let go some day. Sure you will
not ever forget, but it needs to become less important as time moves forward

In my sitch it is clear that H wants to live alone. He wanted out of the Marriage but did not know how.
OW offered him that opportunity and now it is even worse because he is stuck with her. On top of that he starts to realize what I mean for him. He can not cut the rope. The only thing he does right now is avoiding. For me the broken trust is a symptom as Ow is a symptom. H his internal identity crisis is the real issue with all known consequences... I know... I know
E

[stayed]

Wow, that is some AMAZING rationalization Eternity.  Good luck with that honey!

hugs Stayed

[nesquick2]

wow. there is more couples getting back together than i thought. wishing you all the happyness and love with your marriages.
thundarr i think you and me are too new for our returns yet lol.
sl i think your hubby will be back fully with you and the girls one day.
stayed i love the advice you give people. did your hubby move out after BD and was there an ow.

[Angel61]

My H never left physically, but emotionally it was zero. Even when he said he wanted to stay married, as it was the right thing to do, he felt condemned to a life of misery because he did not love me anymore.

Well, we went to retrouvaille last weekend, and it was a trunaround.

He said he now does want to work on the M, and wants to understand love as a choice.

I don't know how we are going to be like, as he was gone the whole week after Retro, and I am picking him up today. I am nervous, but I guess, I ewill just act like nothing happened. Reading all your posts is helping me understand what to expect.

[In this for ME]

There are days when its as if nothing ever went wrong with my marriage and there are other days that I wonder what the heck I'm doing here.  Its as though the minute I feel comfortable, I get a big, fat dose of his MLC in my face.  And the days when I feel that I just don't care anymore, he acts like his old self, the one I fell for.

This is exactly how I feel right now. I for one night decidied not to be the one to roll over and hug him or pay attention to him for the first time in 3 1/2 months of me non-stop trying to develope  more intimacy and closeness. I'm tired.

Talking to him the other night about how I'm feeling gets no where except him throwing stuff in my face. Like if he'd gotten just a little more attention at home this never would have happened.
Maybe this was all too soon..maybe it was a mistake to try. I can't do this by myself and it feels the same way it always did.

I'm not intersted in being miserable or making him miserable anymore. It feels to me like everyone just wants me "to get over it" so they don't have to feel bad.

[eternity]

Wow, that is some AMAZING rationalization Eternity.  Good luck with that honey!

hugs Stayed

Stayed,
I know that another kind of journey starts once they decide to return. This journey has not started for me, so maybe I will talk differently then. i know there will be a transition period, but I also know for myself that I can not live as my colleague does right now:living with the feeling the he destroyed everything for her. Those things happened and there is nothing that you change about that anymore. In this situation you have 2 choices: quit the R or stand. For me standing means healing, growing, but also letting go of the past.
I can not imagine a R without trust. if I hear you correctly your H's actions also changed the way you trust others, not only him?
For me it did not change my trust. It changed the way I look at the world around me, a more mature view.
But as said I this journey did not start for me yet
And I am not as though as you, I am a softer
E

Ps : by letting go of the past I do not mean I will let him sweep anything under the carpet.