[wkramer]

And they will always be seeing you putting the time and energy into your new family, which is a constant reminder of what you wouldn't do for them.

I DID do it for them.

A piece in your blog that I wanted to comment on was where you say that your ex-MIL should see you now, so involved with the baby.  You could always have made the choice to be more involved with your daughters, however its seems that not loving your wife was also justification for not giving more to your family. 

I don't think this is fair.

Firstly the reference to my ex-MIL relates to the fact that I really did not like that woman and she was forever poking her nose into things she should have left alone. Our parenting skills (or in her opinion our lack of them) was one.

Secondly parenting styles changed in the 20 or so years between my children.

And finally working patterns changed in those 20 years and even if they hadn't there is a big difference to how you can manage your time to be with your children as a junior employee compared to later in life when you are more senior.

[wkramer]

If you were getting nothing in return in your marriage earlier in life why did you not break it?

I didn't want to live on a different continent to my daughters.

If it is MLC the feelings you feel during it are real in the sense that, to you, they feel real, they feel like the real thing. But if it is MLC, when the crisis is over, you will find yourself asking what happened to you. If it is MLC it not love, I’m talking of real love, that you feel for your wife. It is infatuation, excitement and trepidation, all induced by the chemical “war” that is going on inside your brain.

Do you know that feeling we all have had when we were teens and everything looked so real and we were so certain, just to discover, in our early twenties, that, after all, it was not the real thing? MLC “love” is like that.

I'm as close to certain as it's possible to be that I'm not having (or had in the past) a MLC.

Even if it is not MLC, a relationship started with adultery and deceit does not start on a very solid or good ground. All the anxieties and anguish that you wrote about in the blog, for the duration of the affair, are likely to come back again after the initial time together. You and Anna are still together, on the open, for a very short time. All the excitement of those times is still present, even if you do not realise it.

I didn't enjoy the "excitement" of it. I fact I actively disliked it.

I'm not sure that we have lived openly together for a "very short time". It's getting on for three years. Would you describe people who met in more conventional circumstances as being together for a "very short time" after three years?

May I ask what have you done if Anna, or someone else, had not turned up? Had you stayed in your first marriage?

I don't think my ex-wife had any intention of retuning to Dubai after our youngest daughter left to go to university (what I mean is that she would probably have come back with our daughters for university holidays and similar but I don't think she intended to live there full time). So even if there had never been such a person as Anna we would have lived apart.

In those circumstances then sooner or later one of us might have asked for a divorce. Or perhaps we wouldn't.

I don't know is the obvious answer. But even if we'd stayed married it wouldn't have met most people's definition of marriage.

[wkramer]

Let's just say that this guy is in MLC.

Wanting something to be true doesn't make it true.

[honour]

Let's just say that this guy is in MLC.

Wanting something to be true doesn't make it true.

Is it true you are an adulterer?

[readytofixmyselffirst]

Well first of all because I didn't begin my affair with the intention of falling in love and needing a divorce.

So it was about sex first and then love. It still makes me sick and that you sought pleasure outside of the marriage, found that pleasure and then justified your actions. Nowhere does it state that you spoke to your wife and she shared your feelings about the marriage.

You state that you don't believe in GOD yet you and your friend kept your sexual affair a secret. Adam and Eve hid themselves out of shame and so did you because you knew what you were doing was wrong. You stated you did this to protect your daughters. You did it to protect yourself from their judgement because it was about you and not them at all.

It is amazing when someone wants to justify what they did and try to put themselves in the role of the victim. When you were out having a good time with Anna, where were your school aged children? I read throughout your blog, me, me, me, me, me....blah blah blah.

Keep posting, keep trying to justify lies and dishonesty....I am not a saint either, but I have the GUTS to admit my mistakes and I never blame anyone for my actions but me.

Doc Hudson- I agree with what you write and as a man. I live a life as a man.

GOSH-I so wish and pray that HB reads this and responds.

[wkramer]

Presumably when you first met your wife, and you felt that she was "the one", there was romance and sex and communication. That can break down over time, ESPECIALLY after having children.

My H asked me to go to marriage counselling a couple of times and I refused. But he ONLY asked once he was already involved with OW and once he had denied my accusation that he was having an affair, AND he told me I needed marriage counselling because I had problems. Turned out I did. They were him. He was lying, he was spending our income on another woman, he was treating me like a skivvy and wining and dining her. We had 2 children too. He has left them with me, almost entirely, so that he can enjoy sexiversaries too. He was lying to me, he was twisting arguments to justify his betrayal to himself (and probably to her - it is always great to turn to your affair partner and say "we had ANOTHER blow out argument last night, she won't go to counselling and she doesn't understand me like you do, now get your kit off and SHOW me how you love me".

I am sorry, but there is no honest justification for having relations, emotional or physical, with another person when you have made promises to a committed relationship. You ALWAYS have the option of leaving the relationship. Having a break, shocking your wife into working on it for the sake of the children, giving her some choices. Unless you are a coward with no-self esteem, who can only make choices about your own life with someone providing some ego-stroking and validation so that you don't feel so bad - poor you. The truth is an affair is the most destructive way to leave a long-term relationship and marriage. It damages the children ( you have effectively told them that their mother (half of their DNA, remember) is not only not "good enough", but she is also deserves a high level of anguish and pain. You have given your children the message that half of their identity was worthless to you, their father. And these messages go deep into the psyche of children, just in case you think they don't. 

I get sick of people saying divorce happens all the time. Yes. And death happens even more frequently. That does not mean that we expect people to get used to it and for it to hurt less when it happens in THEIR own family.

I feel sorry for you, honestly. I would be very interested to know if you think you had any imperfections (real ones, not ones designed to sound like good traits in disguise) in your marriage?

Anyway, sooner or later the sex will slow down with Anna. It may not be for another year, or five, but it will. She will become more demanding, she will start to find things you do annoying. Your relationship will hit a point of age, where it does not involve constant gratification. You will start to wonder if she is not a bit annoying in some ways. But never mind, there are always more willing women who will take on the opportunity to win you away from her... unless she gets bored first and leaves...
In the meantime, what of history, what of friendship, what of loving the same wonderful children in a way an affair partner never can, what of finishing each other's sentences, what of acceptance of one's self and others, what of acts of service that are NOT about getting anything in return (sex, gifts...)

We all loved the new part of the relationship, the constant sex, the constant compliments, the excitement of discovering another person's interesting life. But all things end, including the initial highs of a relationship. The middles are hard (children, jobs, lack of free time) for EVERYONE in a relationship. But if you can weather those things, what about what may be found on the other side? I guess, you may never know...
 
I would be very interested to hear if you and Anna are still as happily sexing away in 10 years. Good luck with that...

I was going to try and answer this until I realised there was no point.

As far as I can see you don't actually have any questions to ask. You simply want to project all your own bad experiences and prejudices onto my relationship because it didn't begin in a way that you agree with.

Whilst this might win you plaudits from other posters it doesn't give you any insight into my life. Not everyones lives are the same.

[wkramer]

Let's just say that this guy is in MLC.

Wanting something to be true doesn't make it true.

Is it true you are an adulterer?

Yes

[wkramer]

I'm not entirely certain why you bothered with marriage, being atheistic...

So the only reasons to get married are religious reasons? Should atheists not be allowed to get married?

Was the phrase "forsaking all others" in the vows of the 1st wedding?  Was the phrase "I really mean it this time" in the second one?

This would be quite witty if it wasn't for the hostility being radiated out of the screen.

I can't remember if "forsaking all others" was in the 1st wedding. Obviously if it was that was a promise I was unable to keep.

We both wrote our own vows for the second one. Doing so meant we could remove any reference to God and make clear to everyone that we were pledging ourselves to each other and that God had nothing to do with it.

[wkramer]

So it was about sex first and then love.

Yes

You state that you don't believe in GOD yet you and your friend kept your sexual affair a secret. Adam and Eve hid themselves out of shame...

What is the point in quoting Adam and Eve to somebody who has made it clear that they don't believe in God?

...and so did you because you knew what you were doing was wrong.

Correct

You stated you did this to protect your daughters. You did it to protect yourself from their judgement because it was about you and not them at all.

It's not entirely accurate but there is probably some truth in this.

I read throughout your blog, me, me, me, me, me....blah blah blah.

By convention diaries are written from a personal point-of-view.

Keep posting, keep trying to justify lies and dishonesty....I am not a saint either, but I have the GUTS to admit my mistakes and I never blame anyone for my actions but me.

Whatever has happened in my life, good or bad, has been a result of my own actions and choices. I have nobody to blame but myself. If I have not made that sufficiently clear in my earlier posts then I'm taking the opportunity to do so now.

[readytofixmyselffirst]

Whilst this might win you plaudits from other posters it doesn't give you any insight into my life. Not everyones lives are the same.

You really would like to believe that would you. As I posted before, a narcissist only thinks from the vantage point of how things affect the narcissist. In your second marriage you wrote that you wrote your own vows to show commitment to each other. So, you did not have that same commitment when you entered into your first marriage?

I would really admire you a lot more if you simply wrote what you did was wrong, how you handled yourself was wrong, and that in this new relationship you can learn to live an honest and open life with this person.

I know you don't read the bible or believe in GOD, but if your read the story of David, you might understand my words and limited wisdom. David committed adultery and even had the husband killed in battle. When confronted with his in, David asked for forgiveness and was forgiven. However, there were consequences for his actions and he paid dearly for his actions.

I write this because you have inflicted pain on your daughters and your wife.

I didn't want to live on a different continent to my daughters.

All your words you have written speak of protecting your interests and never do you write or speak of laying down your life for others. Once again the narcissist only sees through their eyes and feelings and therefore cannot understand or even empathize with another viewpoint.

Something to ponder.

And also to add, what Stand and Deliver posted does win plaudits from me.