[bipolared]

he is more aware yet he is also more stubborn about making it all work that he is driving himself crazier.

Blackice, do you mean he's more stubborn about making his life of escape work?

If so, I am seeing exactly the same thing with my MLCer

That's interesting.  My H says he is not happy about anything and that he is "reeling in the consequences of his decision" but he will not go back on it. 

[Pixiegirl]

In this way we can end up prolonging the crisis.

DETACH, LET GO and have BOUNDARIES are the steps we need to take.

Exactly what I did OP! I assisted in prolonging it because I had NO BOUNDARIES. As I learn more and realize , my H has been at this MLC since late 2007.

[Anjae]

You need to tell me how did I prolong Mr J crisis, OP, but for lack of contact. Have left in May 2007 back home, have not seen him since May 2008. Never talk unless may lawyer wants me to. More distance and silence would be difficult. Mr J crisis is still in full Replay mode.

[Pixiegirl]

And I still have no doubt that his tipping point, besides the chemical effects of the depression all of those life events put him in, was probably treatable low T given his age.

My H just told me that his doc put him on the T gel. This should be an interesting new road to see what happens. I just found out today since this is the first time he has talked to me in 4 months.

[xyzcf]

OP, detach, let go and boundaries are not going to bring them out of crisis. Let alone vanishers. Vanishers have no contact with the LBS and their crisis only ends when it ends.

Putting more pressure upon the already pressured and stressed LBS, give them one more thing to worry: enabling the MLCer depression, is not fair. And does not make sense. If MLC is an individual crisis and a MLCer is going to do what they will do no matter what, no point in adding to the LBS burdens by making a LBS feel like we are responsible for their depression. We are not. Nor for how long it lasts.

I agree with Anjae on this. I really don't know what are the boundaries that OP is talking about?

I know, from talking with OP and others, there is this "suggestion" that the MLCer has to be made to feel that they have lost or are losing their LBSer but I don't agree with that. There really is not any proof that this is what turns them around.

In being a "lighthouse" we show them that their anchor is still here. We are their safe place but they will not come home until they have accomplished the tasks that they must do to end their crisis.

Can we extend their crisis? Perhaps if we are begging and pleading with them. Or causing them problems by attacking them in some way. Maybe, but we don't really know that either.

MLC will take as long as it will take. We do seem to have knowledge about what some of the triggers might be that starts them down the tunnel, but why and when it ends, I don't think there is any known reasons that it ends. They seem to wake up one day.

I know when I was a teenager, the things that I engaged in, the rebelliousness, at some point I changed and went into more adult behavior. Saw that with my daughter as well.

Each of us have their own boundaries that we consider vital. For me, if he were seeing an OW, I would NOT be having contact with him but many LBSers continue to be intimate with their spouse throughout the crisis.

OP, just for curiosity sake, could you define and give some specific examples of boundaries that you think need to happen to hurry up this crisis?

[Anjae]

Since some MLCers, like mine, have lost their LBS, and remain in crisis, one could argue that for some MLCers loosing the LBS prolongs the crisis. Isn't there also something about it they no longer have someone to return to they may get stuck?

So, pretty, the LBS is damned if we do, and damned if we don't.

But OP cannot give examples that would worry up the crisis. From what RCR writes, the crisis cannot be worry up, only prolonged. Which, of course, in a countersense. If it can be prolonged it can be shortened. Or none it possible.

When I was a teenager, at a point I become very rebellious. Even left home and lived with someone. Did something made me return? Yes, my grandmother. She was able to reach to me. I had enough of looking for my many siblings and just left. My mother was not listening, so, no more talking, action.

But it was different, I knew exactly why I had left and did not wanted to return. My grandmother guarantee me that things would not be the same and made sure they were not. She become even closer to me, supervising for me. 

[Pixiegirl]

Ok so here's my 2 cents on what I think on boundaries and how I may have prolonged the true crisis.....but this is just for me and what I think. It doesn't mean that I think this for everyone or every case here.

I went along with H's horrible behavior. I also fought with him, begged, pleaded, turned a blind eye a lot of the time. I think if I would have been stronger with a boundary by saying leave and don't come back until you have it together, H would not have continued his nonsense and destroyed so much of our lives. Now do I think it would have changed the crisis? No. Do I think it would shorten it? In some way, yes. Because he would have been out of here much sooner and gone straight in to his youth seeking crazy behavior and might be burned out by now. Now, I am not trying to sway anyone's opinion or make anyone believe my beliefs. Will I ever know the answer? No. But I also take responsibility for my part in all of this as I was no angel. We fed off of each other. Maybe if I would have removed myself sooner he would have had to face himself sooner ALONE. I wouldn't have been as hurt or blamed for much of what he was feeling for such a long time.

Basically, the boundaries should have been set for myself and I would be much further ahead right now in the journey. With less emotional wounds and less heartache.

Just my take. My story. And how I feel.

Hugs

[Anjae]

Mr J left before OW1 was made public. There was a little beg and plead, but that was some 8 years ago. Early 2008, when OW1 was no more, Mr J wanted to date me. I told him no. He was still in Replay (in the exact same place he was when he left and where he is today).

Could his crisis been shorter if I had let him be closer to me, date him back then and so on? Probably not. He would just had been cake eating for years. And I would have had no peace.

[trusting]

I too don't see what boundaries have to do with the length of the crisis.  Boundaries are to protect us and to not let MLCers just run rampant over our lives.  I can't see how it has any bearing on how long it takes to make it through. 

[SSG]

I went along with H's horrible behavior. I also fought with him, begged, pleaded, turned a blind eye a lot of the time. I think if I would have been stronger with a boundary by saying leave and don't come back until you have it together, H would not have continued his nonsense and destroyed so much of our lives. Now do I think it would have changed the crisis? No. Do I think it would shorten it? In some way, yes. Because he would have been out of here much sooner and gone straight in to his youth seeking crazy behavior and might be burned out by now. 

I told my H a few days after BD "I cannot stop you, so go and get it out of your system, knock yourself out.  But she does not get you in the end" 
He stayed a little over 2 months before he finally left.  During those two months, I gave him a lot of space.  I had found the HS website and one day, when he was thinking clearly, even told him what I learned about a MLC (he told me he thinks he is having one).  Told him it will take a min. of 2 years to which he quickly replied, "Oh god, I hope it does not last that long" and said it could even go as long as 7 years.  H nearly fainted. 

SSG