[hopeful2]

Howmanytimes,

What you are living through is absolute bull$hit.    Your husband has problems from his past that are eating him alive.

His problem?    Is that he is been coddled too much.    He has been allowed to believe that his "feelings" and his "insecurities" are powerful enough to destroy his obligation to be a man........

In his defense.    It is a complicated life for men these days.   He is genuinely  confused.

Bottom line...............  If he is ever going to be a man?

It's up to him to figure it out.

Howmanytimes
I agree with quote.Your h probably is in a MLC. He is definitely confused and afraid of making the wrong choice.It seems like to me he is keeping you on rope so if things don't work out with the ow he can pull you back in.Even after he divorces you.You need to decide what is best for you.So sorry you have been going through this for so long. I think his reasons for not wanting to be with you is ridiculous you don't end a marriage for those reasons.That's my two cents.
Hugs
Hopeful2

[Howmanytimes]

Hi hopeful2

You hit the nail on the head.  I think he is also keeping me on a rope to wheel me back in if it doesn't work out with OW.  I'm his plan B. 

He is very very confused.  He has told me more than once that he wishes he had never met her because then he could be happy.  It's like he wants both of us in his life and if he lives with me I will not allow that.  She has told him that he can carry on seeing me.  I think that was part of the deal for him moving in with her.  He has said he cannot bear the idea of never seeing me again. The thing is when he left me in 2013 for a month she gave him grief if he ever visited to do things like mow the lawn or to see his cats.  By all accounts she told him she was more important than his favourite cat that he wanted to visit as she was only a cat and her feelings were not as important as hers.  He did not like that one bit and said when she said that he thought she is selfish.  Now she has got him believing that he can visit me and the cats for evermore.  The day will come when she will start putting pressure on him to stop and he will not like that.  I asked him what would happen if she did that and he said he would still visit.

All I can hope is she shows her true ways eventually.

Take care

HMT

[MsT]

He is very very confused.  He has told me more than once that he wishes he had never met her because then he could be happy. 

HMT

I know on my part that I've said plenty of "no, I'm in a relationship" and "no, you're in a relationship" in my life. I  know what commitment means to me, though, and loyalty. You make a choice and you make peace with it, that's how I look at it. All of this is so absurdly crazy. I guess it's still to early for me to tell what kind of MLC mine is, but he showed up a few times last week, slept, ate, left laundry in the washer for me, and walked around the house being restless and unproductive. He also brought cupcakes he had made, and I happen to know the day before was the trollops b-day, so I fed them all to the dog. Every last one.

[Howmanytimes]

Hi MsT

I'm glad you fed the cupcakes to the dog.  Do you think they were left over from OW birthday?  If so what makes him think you would want them.  They are all crackers!

He is very very confused.  He has told me more than once that he wishes he had never met her because then he could be happy. 

HMT

I know on my part that I've said plenty of "no, I'm in a relationship" and "no, you're in a relationship" in my life. I  know what commitment means to me, though, and loyalty. You make a choice and you make peace with it, that's how I look at it. All of this is so absurdly crazy.

I sometimes think my H has a great sense of entitlement and doesn't have the same values as me.  I too would know that what you do is tell someone that I was in a relationship. 

He has admitted to me that if I had never discovered his affair he would never have left me but would have carried on seeing OW.  Of course she engineered me finding out.

[MsT]

Hi MsT

I'm glad you fed the cupcakes to the dog.  Do you think they were left over from OW birthday?  If so what makes him think you would want them.  They are all crackers!

I'm sure they were, I just know. The funny thing is that there's an episode of Gilmore Girls (a favorite show of his) where one of the male characters is upset because he comes back from his girlfriend's house and realizes he's wearing another man's socks. We've joked about that over the years "not my socks." And that's all I could think about when I was feeding my dog way too many cupcakes, is "not my socks, you SOB"

 

I sometimes think my H has a great sense of entitlement and doesn't have the same values as me.  I too would know that what you do is tell someone that I was in a relationship. 

He has admitted to me that if I had never discovered his affair he would never have left me but would have carried on seeing OW.  Of course she engineered me finding out.

The thing about mine is that he does used to have the same values, especially re adultery. His grandma had a love child and his Aunt is a cheater and he's always spoken out against them with disgust and contempt.
How did the OW engineer you finding out? I keep wondering how much of a sociopath you have to be to go after a taken man.

[Howmanytimes]

Hi MsT

Hi MsT

I sometimes think my H has a great sense of entitlement and doesn't have the same values as me.  I too would know that what you do is tell someone that I was in a relationship. 

He has admitted to me that if I had never discovered his affair he would never have left me but would have carried on seeing OW.  Of course she engineered me finding out.

The thing about mine is that he does used to have the same values, especially re adultery. His grandma had a love child and his Aunt is a cheater and he's always spoken out against them with disgust and contempt.
How did the OW engineer you finding out? I keep wondering how much of a sociopath you have to be to go after a taken man.

That's why I wonder if it is MLC with mine because he has been a serial cheat.  With a lot of the cases on here their spouse has totally changed their values.

His OW was away on holiday with him and I thought he was on holiday with his dive club. She used his Smartphone and his email account to send a nonsense email to friends saying she was having a nice holiday in the place he was so I knew the fact that she gave her email address as a combination of both their names gave it away. 

I know what you mean about them being sociopaths. I think they are narcissists.  They have no empathy for others and only care about themselves.  Surely eventually that part of their nature will come out and our spouses will cotton on that they are with nasty and selfish individuals.

Take care

HMT

[MsT]

[/quote]

That's why I wonder if it is MLC with mine because he has been a serial cheat.  With a lot of the cases on here their spouse has totally changed their values.

[/quote]
I keep going through mood swings where I have doubts about MLC, too. Like what if I actually did drive him to this by being (I don't, wrong for him, or something). He works out of town and has for several years, while I've stayed home and tried to keep our home and family life together. It's taken a huge toll on both of us. He was supposed to quit after 3 years, but the money was too good, then he was supposed to quit after 5 years, which is coming up this Spring, but the money is even better now. One of the biggest differences in the ways we were raised is how much emphasis was placed on money and possessions and financial success. I can and have lived much more happily off of much less, but he has it drilled in his brain that financial success is top priority, and right now he seems to think that as long as he keeps paying the bills and throwing money at the kids, he's fulfilling his obligations as a father.
They are just kids, they're not going to remember who payed for their guitar lessons or birthday parties, they're going to remember who listened to them practice the same 8 measures of a song 3 hours a day for a week straight or who made the cake and lit the candles and was actually there.
Sorry that turned into venting. I'm working through some anger and disappointment.

[in it]

I think the ex's may have begun about 14 years ago after his father died. The family attutude about dying was pretty much "Oh well they died continue on" No time to grieve the loss. Take it stride and move on.

After that they were part of a class action lawsuit which provided a whole lot of money. In which the ex decided he was entitled to buy about anything he wanted.

At that time he had a really good job position two beautiful daughters and me. But that wasn't enough for him. He was in no way at all content.

He had always been pretty selfish materially. Something I learned early in life is far from what's important.

The relationship in hindsight has always been all about him.

After the divorce:

The exow taught him the lesson that everyone isn't as honest as I am. All she was after was money.

When I returned and his attempt to be a rock star failed and faded..it didn't leave much for him to focus on...so again I must be the problem.

It took me quite a while to realize he had no intention of working on the relationship. I was always the one with the problem. I was supposed to treat the divorce and his involvemant with exow as a "bump in the road" live in his fantasy land and deny the pain it caused me. Another year and 8 months wasted of my life.

After the domestic violence incident ...there is no going back for me this time.

[MsT]

In it- I've always been the kind of person that takes what she has and rearranges it so it's comfortable, and I don't care about brands or labels or being the second owner. Same as you, I learned it early in life.
I'm sorry you had to deal with a domestic violence incident. I always thought I would draw the line at infidelity but I guess my new line would be domestic violence 

[in it]

Thanks MsT

His anger pretty much always got the better of him- lost his job due to it and there were other times I should have just left..I had been physically abused on and on throughout the relationship.

My biggest denial the day it happened was I had no idea I could not trust him to allow me to leave without him getting violent. I should have taken someone with me that day...I thought I was givng him what he wanted. He should have had no problem with it.

If I had been him? I would have had all of his things out on the lawn doing a happy dance. As it stands he still has all of my things.