Midlife Crisis: Support for Left Behind Spouses
Archives => Archived Topics => Topic started by: bluerose on December 12, 2017, 07:32:17 PM
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Can someone link these threads please. I still dont know how.
Previous Thread: http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9582 (http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9582)
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Thanks for getting us started on the next thread, BR.
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Good to have a little special support space here...
engagewithlove posted "this is exactly my issue. As soon as he walked out on me after 22 yrs I instinctively knew that there was something wrong with him.. but as time goes by the voices in my head start to doubt and question whether this is really MLC or if he really is just happier in his new life. I have to keep reminding of myself of how this has all gone down, that he really has followed the MLC script, and that he is not acting like a normal adult. "
I am often very grateful that I have been saved from some of the in your face crazy stuff I've read about here. I am sometimes a bit envious of the glimmers of connection that I read about too.
I do think that with a vanisher/distant contacter, it is much easier to doubt it is MLC and easier for other people to see it as a 'normal' situation where someone has just run off to make a happier life in a new relationship. It isn't normal healthy adult behaviour, that's true, but there are lots of reasons why people behave badly. So, do I know it's MLC? To be honest, I can't...I think so because of the scale of change from the person I knew, how long the crazy has run on and some of his self-destructive behaviour in his own life that has no link to me. But do I know for sure? No. I guess the only way to know will be looking back in a few year's time and/or if he reappears to talk about it in a way which fits the pattern. But right now, I can't know for sure.
What can I know? I know this isn't normal - not for who my H was or for normal healthy people. I know that it isn't about me because nothing I did made any difference. I know it wasn't about our marriage because there was nothing big or bad enough to warrant this kind of crazy. I know he's left me, my marriage is dead and I'm pretty sure he's never coming back so I can only move forward on my own with no answers. I know he doesn't want to talk to me, explain or show any interest or concern about me, even if I don't know why. I know that, right or wrong, healthy or not, he thinks is best for him and his life...and he's ok enough with the collateral damage to me and anyone else to keep doing it. And he does have the right to shape his own life, even if I don't like it, agree with how he's done it or feel frustrated by how much it has affected me. I have no idea if he is happy or not, feels guilty or not, loves me or not, has regrets or not. But his actions look like someone who does not want to be with me and does not care about my wellbeing at all, and with silence, I can only go by his actions.
So where does that leave me? With a husband who ran away from me and his life for unknown reasons. A mystery story. A dead marriage. A lost husband. On my own dealing with the rubble. Protecting myself from someone who does not care about my needs and is a risk to my wellbeing while I have any link to him. Moving forward from here regardless. Free to make my own choices about what I think happened, why, how I feel about it/him/the past and how I let that shape my future. Feeling a bit hurt, lonely, humiliated, resentful and bewildered still. Accepting what I can't know. Expecting to never see him again. Open-minded that time will tell and I may someday know things I can't know now. Sad. Missing my beloved H sometimes but not sure if that H still exists or how to reconcile old H and this H. Divorced. Still here. Battered but not broken. And it took me two sloooow years to get here!
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Attaching.
And agreeing with treasur. X
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Hugs Treasur.
Your words of wisdom have helped me enormously over the past 10 months. I'm about a year behind you but am already thinking that my H is lost forever... or at least by the time he wakes up it will Be too late.
I do think that if your gut instinct is it's MLC then you're probably right.
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Engagedwithlove
Our timelines are similar
Aug 2016 ilybinilwy ... i kicked him out due to finding out about ea
April 2017 legally separated
Dec 2017 house sold
Seems like an awfully fast pace to end 22 years, huh?
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Exactly Tyks. The speed at which he can seem to completely wipe me from his thoughts is one thing I'm still getting my head around.
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I guess - if we wear our special Christmas Hats of Loving Logic - we know it isn't possible for them to wipe us out actually. They might act as if it is, but too many years and too many shared memories to erase. So, it's hidden somewhere...or hurts too much to look at. But, unless our spouses genuinely are playing a role in the Invasion of The Bodysnatchers ::)...no, it isn't possible. We're in there somewhere.
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Thank you Treasur for saying exactly what I’m thinking and feeling... again!!!!! One of my healing struggles has been the inability to put my thoughts and feelings in words. I’m more a numbers person than a wordsmith. And what I know to be true this was not normal there has been a major change in my xH. All the uninhibited and self destructive behaviors. The two most flagrant are spending so much money so secretively and smoking cigarettes.I am also part of the was married 22 years club. And the world thought the seven year itch was going to be the problem!! Being here with my fellow LBS of vanishers is my safest spot on earth. Your understanding and knowing there is a place to get feedback based on this situation is invaluable!!!🤗
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Hello from East Europe! Thank you all, it is absolutely fantastc and helpful for me to know, that I am not alone with this madness. I am the member of 22 year club too! It is crazy, how every simpelest thing is same: all words, acting like a teenager, avoiding.. i do not even exist anymore, he cannot say my name, says only mother, if he says something about about money to my son.
Today he broyught my son back from basketball practice, two sons cassmates were too in car. Then somebody suddenly drived to wrong way, my h shouted loud and used this kind words he never did before. My son sayed, that he was so shamed, friends were just looking and were very scared! They asked later, what is wrong with your father, why he is so angry!
It is like neverending nightmare. I want it to stop, i want to talk to my h, but it is impossible, I do not exist for his mind anymore. Is there any possibility, that they wake up and see, that this kind of behavior is totally wrong?
I am sorry, my english is bad, I hope that You can understand something. Thank You!
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Kasss... your English is fine.
Do they ever see their behavior is wrong?
I think so but they still stay in their decisions because they are cowards.
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My husband has run as fast as he could away from me but will do anything for his children, he's has removed me from everything but the problem is , his ow has the same first name as me so he will always remember me ,, probably all bad but I'm always there
And kass your English is very good xx
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Your english is fine, kasss, and we have people here from lots of different countries!
You might get better advice and support if you start your own thread to share your story and challenges?
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Thank you, I will try!
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My husband has run as fast as he could away from me but will do anything for his children,
I notice that this varies, some MLCers turn their backs on the entire family, some just the LBS, some choose a child and favor one over the other.
One of The Leaver's first letters to me was blah, blah, blah, about me and our marriage but he was extremely concerned about how our kids were going to be and how they would treat him.
At one of the hearings he was almost crying about the kids (both adults btw), "they only call me when they need something". At the time I saw this as an opportunity to pave the way so instead of berating him about his actions I responded with, "WE need to work together to be better parents", he shook his head "yes" and then kept continuing on his path of destruction.
From early on and even before BD, The Leaver went overboard with giving our daughter every single thing she wanted so he could be the good guy. He has over and beyond favored our daughter over our son. Luckily, our son is easy going and forgives his father and keeps their relationship amicable, he doesn't necessarily respect him but talks to him.
I guess this is another aspect of some vanishers. They really can't be true vanishers if there are children involved and the children have a relationship with both parents. Some true vanishers also vanish from the family. Then there are some who take a child with them (such as The Leaver did with my daughter, she is 27).
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Attaching...
Nah - you really deserve a Ph.D for this... Girl, you hit it out of the park every time... :)
Kasss, your English is fine.. And welcome.. To the best place on earth to land when your world falls apart!!
I think mine might be a vanishing seagull... He hibernates for a season or two only to come out and s$&t all over everything. Only made contact once, several months ago after almost 3 years of silence, because of my son. I initiated, I ended. Not a word since. He was so concerned about s to take the time to speak to me and put the pieces together and see s was lying his cute little behind off!!! Something I'd asked for in the beginning, please still be a dad.... Nope, he vanished, only to reappear, create a poop storm, and vanish again...
Puffy's dad does the exact same thing to him and has for the past 30 plus years.... It's literally the same. Right down to the not making contact contact, though the kid.. No... His argument for leaving s too was he's an adult, we don't need you to have a relationship. Sad but true and I stay out of it.. However, I find the vanish reappear act so oddly and strangely familiar... Yep, I was married to the 3rd generation monster of genetic MLC.... Now I just watch and wait to see how this plays out with my son... S is still so angry with his dad but yet I know he loves every second he gets to be with him. I do get it, I watched my exh jump through the hoops of trying to please dad and make him want to stay only to be destroyed by some off the wall, truly sociopathic reason to bail again. I will do what the 3 generations of ex wives before me have done, be there to pick of the pieces and love my son.
Ttreasur - your soooooooo right!!!! As much as it hurts, it is what it is. And that's ok too... The silence was what I thought would kill me. Nope, it ended up being the most precious gift, I could never deal with the back and forth. I guess for me the silence became the conversation I felt so desperately entitled to in the beginning, that I now feel I no longer need. The silence became the very words that made me realize how his actions spoke volumes and none of it included me or my son any longer. It's hard to finally face that reality but at the same time, it became the place where I began to build the new me and my new life.
Nobody puts me in a corner... And if I have to, I will dance by myself!!!! 😜😜😜😜😜😜😜😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I have these reality check songs, Better man by little big town, and burning house... Can't remember who sings it but dang....
Now.. Let's see what kind of three ring circus puffy and his father have planned... His dad is coming for the holidays, they haven't seen each other in more than 7 years. Hope s has an escape route planned and a car waiting out back... Granted old grandpaw will now be seeing his grandson for the first time in more than 5 years. Look into those sad eyes of my sweet son on Christmas and see all the fruits of his joyous destruction. I blame my former fil almost as much, if not more, than my ex. I see the products and consequences of parents choices every single day and it breaks my heart what people do to thier children. And now my own son has to suffer the long standing traditions of his fathers family, FACE PUNCH TO MYSELF!!!!!!
If puffy plays like he has in the past, by his daddy's rule book, he's about due for what my mil calls the drive by. Fil would start driving by thier house, just checking to see what she was up to, calling for no reason. First time, 3 years in, she was dating. Next time, 5 years in he found her remarried and living with her new h. And still, tried to "come home".... Felt entitled to.. And of course, he became the victim of her crazy behavior and he tried but she wouldn't let him..
If you really evaluate it all, it's escape and avoid anything, everything, only some things. It's so unique and yet we are all so similar in so many ways..
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I think mine might be a vanishing seagull... He hibernates for a season or two only to come out and s$&t all over everything.
I think we need to add this term to the MLC categories....
Wallower----Clinger----boomerang----seagull----vanisher. ;D ;D
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Yup, my STBXH seems to be doing seagull right now...or trying to but I'm ignoring him...maybe seagull is a low-energy version of monster ;D
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Treasur,
My H was hit with his crisis almost 10 years ago. Last time I saw/talked with him was at our divorce hearing in '09. You have written exactly what it feels like and the thought process when someone leaves and vanishes. In my opinion it is the cruelest form of rejection. One cannot possibly understand the emotions one feels/goes thru if they have not experienced being completely abandoned and treated as though you never existed (especially when you've spent decades together!).
I have no idea if he's happier or not. My guess is that his life is different not better, but whatever it is he has chosen to keep me out of it.
Thanks again for your post Treasur
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Ro... I always love to hear from you.
You are a true veteran with a true vanisher. On this thread, especially if we haven't heard from our MLCer for years it's always good to hear what's going on in OUR lives.
Hey, even after many years I think it's normal to still feel the pain. No one would question a widow no matter how many years it has been.
My mother's first husband died 57, yes 57 years ago and she still keeps a picture of him next to her bed.
So why can't we still have feelings just because they vanished by choice?
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Good point, nah
Sometimes I've thought that - well, how would I feel/what would I be doing now if he'd been run over by a bus and killed in Oct 15? Actually, not much different.
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Actually in many ways it would have been easier.
For one, his entire family wouldn't have followed along and betrayed me.... and my daughter.
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And life insurance ;D
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And life insurance ;D
Omg.... I would be rolling in it!!
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I agree nah. It would have been easier if they would have died. When they die they dont have a choice. When they do what these guys have done and just vanish, you have the betrayal, lies and rejection that come with it.
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Thank you Nah. I usually don't post because I have nothing to add that hasn't already been said. I just wanted to add my perspective to Treasur's eloquent post.
I'd also like to add that it would have been easier had he passed. With passing there's closure. There is no closure with a vanisher. None. You know he is out there somewhere living his life. You wonder if he's happy. Will he ever regret his actions, apologize, contact. Heaven forbid you run into him (especially with her).
With death you don't feel like a failure, a freak, or judged because there are those in the world that believe you must have been a shrew of a woman for your H to have left you. They have no understanding of what a MLC is. They just believe you couldn't "keep your man".
With death you would feel free to engage in another relationship without thinking you are flawed or that this could possibly happen again (the cheating, lying, betrayal).
With death your free to recall and talk about the memories instead of wondering if your life together was all a lie.
With death you still keep those rose colored glasses on because now your view on life and relationships are a little more jaded.
This whole experience changes you as a person (and not all for good). So, yeah, death would have been MUCH easier.
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RO, I could have written that whole poat myself. You pretty well summed up everything I think ::)
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Hello RO, thank you for posting. I think it’s good for us not as far along to know what to expect with our feelings. It helps us brace a bit better. That is why I am here to help prepare for what will probably happen because so much of what others have said were true. The death would stop people for thinking we should be over it. I am better but I am not over the trauma of the BD and the vanishing with an OW. It still has me shocked and hurt.
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And life insurance ;D
Omg.... I would be rolling in it!!
With much certainty I would be retiring next year. I'd own my home with no mortgage. I'd have six figures in cash to play with.
Not even close to the real life adventure I've been thrust into! ::)
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Having said what I said...I wouldn't wish my H dead...there was a time initially when he was suicidal and I think if he'd done that, I'm not sure I could have survived it actually. Some people here have experienced the death of a spouse in MLC and I can't imagine the pain of that on top of everything else. There is hope for him, if not for us, while he is alive. Sure, if he'd died pre-BD, I'd be left being able to mourn the H I knew...but once MLC bit...no, it wouldn't have been better.
I know that I would have been left with the same pain and unanswered questions, but no hope at all which maybe I needed to survive the first year even if my hope was not met, just maybe better off financially and other people would have been more understanding of my grief probably.
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I’m just wondering if I’m the crazy one for feeling like my mlcer is trying to incite a reaction from me right now.
I stepped away from him and left him to his shiny new life because I needed to heal and mend and believe me it’s taken a long time to get to where I am now .. still hurt and sad but trying to live my life and find peace with what’s happened
He has sent my d a card for her girls ( mine and his granddaughters) with “ to our beautiful granddaughters “
And signed grandad and ow ..
he’s never done that before and I think it’s inappropriate and my gut feeling is that he’s done it to hurt me and try to get a reaction out of me ..but not giving him the satisfaction of actually knowing how much it hurts
in my eyes she is not and never will be grandparent to those little girls .. She hasn’t earned that right. It’s all for shoe I’m sure but seeing it is horrible.
But then he gets son a card “to my brilliant son” and signed him and ow !!!
Why ! What’s with the our and my ??? I don’t get it at all.
I just need to get my frustration and hurt out because I sure as hell would never give him the satisfaction of knowing that he’s hurt me again.
I think to myself that he can’t hurt me anymore .. get myself on an even keel and find I’m doing good then he manages to upskittle me!
I literally thought my heart would explode when I saw the card ..
am I wrong to feel like I do???
I get he’s moved on but wouldn’t a normal person try to be a bit more sensitive !!
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Treasur, that is just terrible. Remeber, he is not a normal person right now.
in my eyes she is not and never will be grandparent to those little girls ..
Oddly enough my d18 said something similar recently. Mom, whoever you or dad are with doesnt't matter as long as you are happy. The new person, ie ow cow, will never be our step parent. It is not like we ( her and d15) are young kids. We know who our parents are and we pretty much have our own lives.
It hurts, Treasur. It hurts me to think that ow cow is spending Christmas with them. But for your h to rub it in your face is extremely hurtful. So what if he has moved on? He doesn't need to rub it in your face.
I am sorry he has done this. How do your kids feel about it ... or you haven't told them yet ?
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Im so sorry treasure. That is a cruel thing to do to you. Me and the cowards first grandchild was born 2 months ago and. I fear that the ow will start referring to herself as his grandma. She is not nor will ever be his grandma even if they get married. As far as i know she has not even seen him yet. I would like to keep it that way but who knows. Did your daughter see the card and if so what did she say about it?
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Yeah d got card off her dad for the granddaughters. I’ve just mentioned it today that I’m not very impressed with the card and that I think it’s inappropriate. My d said I know I didn’t know what to say so never said anything. She knows but is too nice to actually say anything .. she wants a relationship with her dad .. it’s so difficult for them. I know that. And I was in
two minds whether to say anything to her at all. But I felt I needed to say how I thought he couldn’t hurt me anymore then he does and can !!
Why I’ll never know. It’s just not necessary to do that. Does he really think it’s right after what they did ? X
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Yes treasure they do think that its right to do. Your divorced now and in their minds its ok. Even though it started while you were married in their minds they did nothing wrong. To them the marriage was over before the divorce so it makes it ok. To them. Not us.
I understand your daughter wanting to have a relationship with her father, im going through the same thing with mine right now. I feel a little betrayed by my kids for that but i still love them and understand. It is very hard to deal with.
Maybe your daughter could sit down with her father, in anice way, and set some boundaries of her own. I found out today from my sister that when my grandson was born the coward called and asked if he could bring tbe ow with him to the hospital to see the baby. My s22 said no. I am very grateful to him for that. He doesnt know that i know and there really isnt any reason for him to know. I will however keep it in my heart and hopefully he did that for me deep down.
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At least your h called when my d had her second baby he came to hospital with ow and ow put pictures on fb about grandad being smitten!
I don’t have fb but people who know me told me. As they were disgusted. Seems it’s only them who thinks it’s ok to do this. Others just shake their heads and seem shocked that he just doesn’t think that I have feelings and an still hurt by all this.
Seems we are the ones who have to take the high road each and every time they do something that’s hurtful.
I don’t understand and I don’t think I ever will how they must think we don’t have feelings or are hurt by their actions even if the marriage is over .. he knew it wasn’t what I wanted ..
normal people would try to be more sensitive and take into account someone else’s feelings
I think this is the final line that’s been crossed for me ..
and as for ow I’m not sure what to think .. If had any compassion or empathy she would think about how she would feel if it happened to her !! X
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I sorry Treasur that’s is a great big ouch!!! I think they think since they are in a happy new world no one else matters. I think they do stuff like that to earn brownie points with the ow. They are still working on looking good to them. Sending you a hug!!!🤗
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To all my fellow LBSs of vanishers I want to wish you a Merry Christmas!! It is not the holiday of our dreams but I have come to care for each of you dearly!!! I want you to have a good day filled knowing you are cared about and are very important to me. You have been there all year pushing me through the craziness. It’s been an amazing gift!!! Thank you!!❤️🎄🎁🎅😘🤗
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Hey Shocked,
Merry Christmas to you as well.
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Christmas is for families so it is very normal to get a few more tears than normal today.
Don't think our vanishers aren't shedding a few today also. Just b/c we don't see them, doesn't mean they are not falling.
I woke up with a few myself today. That's right, fun positive Nah, still sheds a few tears.
My daughter is hosting Christmas today. My son will be there, my former in-laws will be there, The Leaver and his young bride will be there. I was not invited. My side of the family was not invited, including my mother who was at my daughter's side from the day she was born until she walked out the door like her father.
So yes that hurts.
I will be spending the morning with my mother and my son w/ his gf. Then the afternoon with E's family. Even that hurts as his nephew is in the hospital and will be for a long time. As usual E is expected to carry all the responsibilities of the family, and I will try to help him with all that BUT.... my mind will be on my own family.
Still today is just one day...after New Year's I'm outta here WITH my son to California. So I'm doing my best to focus on what is good, not what I cannot change.
Anybody contacting their vanisher today?
I'm still deciding but probably not as I'm a bit angry with him today.
Heads up and Merry Christmas... We are the strong ones even when we cry. :D
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Hey Nah,
I am sorry you didn't get the invite for Christmas. Make sure you enjoy the time with your son. Maybe it wasn't a slight maybe your daughter didn't want to rub your face in your ex husbands new bride? Maybe next year you get the invite and he doesn't. As for contacting you or ex I was pondering that very question. I have no clue which way to go. I have to pick my kids up from her at 2 pm today. If it's like tomorrow we wont say a word to each other or even look at each other for that matter. NAH have a merry Christmas.
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LR, no in my circumstance my daughter has anger issues against me. I know it doesn't make sense to most people but it's not too much different than loving our spouses and having them turn on us for reasons we can't explain to others.
Anyways,
Merry Christmas Lastresort.
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Merry Christmas, nah. I think this time of year is very hard for a lot of people and I'm sure you're not the only one shedding a few tears.
I know the relationship with your d has been strained but I just pray some day she opens her eyes and accepts her loving mother back into her heart.
You just enjoy your time with your S and E's family. The heck with the rest of them. :)
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LR, no in my circumstance my daughter has anger issues against me. I know it doesn't make sense to most people but it's not too much different than loving our spouses and having them turn on us for reasons we can't explain to others.
Anyways,
Merry Christmas Lastresort.
Well I am sorry. That is how it is. I'm here if you need someone to lean on.
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The heck with the rest of them. :)
You know that is my attitude the rest of the year.
;D ;D
...and Thanks LR :D
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Today is no different than any other day of the last 16 months. No contact. He wants to be with someone else. Why should I contact him?
An extra hug Nah!!!🤗 I do sometimes have to remind my myself of that old life isn’t real anymore. That loss is very very sad!!!!
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I have been worse this Christmas than any in the last 3 years ,, I've been angrier taking it out on the kids , it's a good job I've got kids that are my rock especially my daughter,, my poor kids have been through so much with me ,, I wish we didn't have to see Christmas again it will never be the same I now hate seeing it come , I try so hard but I mess up all the time ,
But yesterday if I couldn't feel any worse a fella that has known the ex for a number of years , I bumped into and he told me he had spoke to ex , asked him about the wh*r^ , what she did how he met her blah blah ,, so ex opened up to him by the looks of it , said we were unhappy not right, he's now a valley boy , never would of said that before hates the valleys, wen asked she was a lot younger than him calling him a cradle snatcher he said a wide grin came on his face ,,
The fella asked about the kids , the ex said my son was ok about it , which if he was ok with it he would have met the wh*r^ and have some sort of contact with the both of them not just his father, so that's bull!!
And he said his daughter doesn't want to know so the fella said well isn't that understandable you dumped her Mam ,, he said nothing, he said this relationship is gonna work ,,, they are insane,
I told the fella the only reason it is working is the fact the man has two lives , he's living a single mans life with her , he goes out with my son wen ever he wants , he has no responsibility,, the wh*r^ as far as I'm still aware has not been met by inlaws , if he was so chuffed with his wh*r^ surely he would be telling everyone suck it up this is my girlfriend and we are serious so deal with it ,, but so far he is keeping everyone separate,, am I delusional,, is this normal?
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Monty....
You let the smoke and mirrors get you down.
Understandable we all do it, especially around the holidays.
Ok, so your ex ran into a mutual friend and fed him a bunch of bulls!t. Does that change anything in your life? Does that change what plans you can be doing with your kids? Your ex has been living a life of lies for how long? Do you think for a second that anything he says to anybody is true?
File that conversation away with the rest of his lies and get on with making 2018 the best year you can make it.
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Thanku nah
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In reading this thread it appears the success of reconciliation of a vanisher is remote at best. I would speculate that my W will have a hard time admitting she was wrong so will force her new life to work at all cost limiting the odds of her coming back. Some questions I have for the veterans. 1) Do vanisher's ever come back. 2) What about MLC that change over time? My W was a Boomerang for the first 2 months before OM. After OM she was on-off then went 100% vanisher once she started to out the OM? So what is she or does it even matter?
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In reading this threat it appears the success of reconciliation of a vanisher is remote at best. I would speculate that my W will have a hard time admitting she was wrong so will force her new life to work at all cost limiting the odds of her coming back. Some questions I have for the veterans.
1) Do vanisher's ever come back. IDK...some say less likely, others say makes no difference. Either way, we need to live 'as if' they are not coming back because there is no way to know.
2) What about MLC that change over time? My W was a Boomerang for the first 2 months before OM. After OM she was on-off then went 100% vanisher once she started to out the OM? So what is she or does it even matter? I think that's quite common...my H started as a low-energy wallower for first 6 months or so, did a touch and go, and then exploded into some 'exciting' Replay stuff and became 95% vanisher for months at a time. Does it matter? Only in the sense of what we need to deal with in our own LBS situation....does it matter in terms of their progress? IDK.
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1) Do vanisher's ever come back.
Simple question. Not so simple answer.
On this forum it seems like the vanisher's have very little chance of return...but why?
*LBSers of vanisher detach quicker so if vanisher's do return it's often too late.
*LBSers have less to write about so they often don't stay on the forum as long (well until this awesome thread ;) )
*No communication = no relationship. This is not the same as little communication but I mean zero for years and years.
In real life my father was a true vanisher for about four years (six years after BD). When he contacted my mother looking for reconciliation she said, "NO WAY!!"
So it does happen.
2) What about MLC that change over time? My W was a Boomerang for the first 2 months before OM. After OM she was on-off then went 100% vanisher once she started to out the OM? So what is she or does it even matter?
IMO, it really doesn't matter. I thought mine would be a true vanisher as from the beginning he avoided me like the plague even though we were going through a divorce and needed to contact over financial issues. His avoidance needlessly dragged the divorce on way longer than it needed to be. Common for an MLCer but very irritating.
Once it was done I thought I would never hear from him again. I was wrong.
Now, we will go months and months with nothing and then there is always something. Even though we still have little contact I have had over the years lunches and phone calls where he actually opened up to me. Sometimes he feels like he is drawing close and then he will pull away. I just go with the flow.
It is so very normal to wonder what the heck is going on in their heads, how can they be doing this, what stage are they in and the mother of all questions.... will they come back.
We can't answer any of these questions, we can only guess.
You will hear this again and again on this forum but it is really true.
All we can control is ourselves and the best thing to do is to let them go and focus on ourselves.
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Nah if he came begging to you and wanted to divorce her ,,, would you take him back?
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Oh wow I've become a junior member 🤣
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Nah if he came begging to you and wanted to divorce her ,,, would you take him back?
Short simple answer....
No.
Longer answer...
We are all different and I really don't think I would have too many problems with forgiveness or triggers of him with her. That was one of the reasons I dated so early, so I could get over pictures in my head of him with her. However, I don't think his ego can get over me having a life without him.
For me, I don't think that's a bad thing. In our relationship he was always just a little more important than me. Those days are over. If he can't handle (and I don't think he has it in him) that I am as good as he is, then I don't need him in my life. Ever.
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Even though I thought I could forget I don't think I could but I haven't fully let go , but I know deep down he could never come back into ours lives as my husband/ father , it will never be normal again as it was ,, I could never trust him or anything he says ,, I know it's over
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No I never forgot what we had.... nor would I want to forget.
I met The Leaver when I was 17 yrs old and fell instantly. We were glued together from day one. Just months after graduating high school instead of going to college we moved in with each other. Married a year later.
We BOTH worked like crazy for many years. Had two kids. Had many ups and downs, way more ups than downs.
I don't want to forget any of it. It was my life and it was a great life.
Ok, something happened, I don't know exactly what but something happened. It hurt like Hell. I didn't know heartache could hurt as much as it did. Literally brought me to my knees. I made sounds I didn't know I had in me, I cried more tears than I knew my body could make. I still get tears just thinking about that pain.
I still don't want to forget. Why? That's how I know it was real. I don't know for sure what's in his head but I know for me it was real.
Why would I want to forget that?
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So after that post I would like to share a funny little interaction I just had with The Leaver a few minutes ago....
When The Leaver lost his job I took over our son's car insurance. He didn't ask, I just did it.
So when I lost my job I asked The Leaver to take it back the car insurance payments and he agreed but said the car needed to be registered in son's name.
Last week we changed son's car registration from my name to sons and I sent The Leaver a simple text:
"son" car is registered in his name. Let me know when it's all set.
Along with this text I sent a picture of the registration.
He replied, "ok"
I waited a week. Nothing.
So I sent another one today.
Me: is the insurance all set?
BFL: a big blah blah blah about how it needs to be in son's name
Me: ummm... I already did that and sent you a message and you replied ok.
BFL: Oh,... I must have spaced out. Can you send me a copy of the registration?
Me: I already did that too. Scroll up, it was only last week.
BFL: I don't have it. Can you resend?
Me: Son now has the copy. Why don't you have the message I just sent you last week? (I already knew the answer but I wanted to see what he would say) ;D ;D ;D
BFL: I go through my texts pretty regularly so I don't have hundreds.
Me: Haha...sure.
No response.
I don't know about anybody else, but I never deleted any texts unless I felt the need to hide something... which happens to be never, so I have never deleted a text.
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We were together wen I was 16 pregnant at 17 , I'm now 43 , he's 45 , I thought I knew him ,, like you said nah you were a step behind him I was too that's a good way of putting it ,, he was my everything ashamed to say still is , he was my first boyfriend I don't think I have the ability to try this again , I don't think I want too but at the same time I don't want to be alone ,, and the sad thing is he knows me but I can't changexx
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Don't get me wrong I can survive and have kept two jobs and a business running while he has gone so I don't need a man , just want someone who will love and respect me like I think we all deserve 🙃, I will never relies on another ever again , wen my little business is built up it will be for me and my kids only ,, that barrier is way high , x
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BFL: I go through my texts pretty regularly so I don't have hundreds.
I busted right out laughing. Sitting here alone in my house just chuckling away at the absurdity of Leaver's lame excuse. Well......that probably doesn't even qualify as lame. It's downright pathetic!!
Like I really thought he was going to be honest and write that he can't let wifey poo see any texts between the two of you!! Bahaha.........
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I'm in one of those moods tonight so when I sent him a copy of the original text I followed up with...
"quick hide your phone before you get caught" with a bunch of laughy faces... ;D ;D ;D
He replied back, "you're not a comedian"
It's so much fun when you no longer care what they think. :D
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I'm in one of those moods tonight so when I sent him a copy of the original text I followed up with...
"quick hide your phone before you get caught" with a bunch of laughy faces... ;D ;D ;D
He replied back, "you're not a comedian"
It's so much fun when you no longer care what they think. :D
Oh, but you are a comedian when you write stuff like that! ;D Again, I'm guffaw guffawing over here!
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Priceless, nah. LOL!!
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1) Do vanisher's ever come back.
Simple question. Not so simple answer.
On this forum it seems like the vanisher's have very little chance of return...but why?
*LBSers of vanisher detach quicker so if vanisher's do return it's often too late.
*LBSers have less to write about so they often don't stay on the forum as long (well until this awesome thread ;) )
*No communication = no relationship. This is not the same as little communication but I mean zero for years and years.
In real life my father was a true vanisher for about four years (six years after BD). When he contacted my mother looking for reconciliation she said, "NO WAY!!"
So it does happen.
It is so very normal to wonder what the heck is going on in their heads, how can they be doing this, what stage are they in and the mother of all questions.... will they come back.
We can't answer any of these questions, we can only guess.
You will hear this again and again on this forum but it is really true.
All we can control is ourselves and the best thing to do is to let them go and focus on ourselves.
I agree - as usual - with nah. My own perspective with a vanisher? And I was a really slow learner ::) I think the brutality of being suddenly abandoned, left in practical limbo and ghosted by your own spouse (and I'm wondering if this is more common with men than women actually, IDK) is almost unbearably painful. It is bewildering and harsh to be rejected so completely and it makes you feel absolutely powerless. Eventually, your need to a) not lose your mind and b) deal with practicalities forces you to make decisions regardless of the vacuum...and then you start to feel a bit less powerless and a bit more in control of some things. For me, I had to push myself to accept an incomprehensible reality with hardly any information to go on in order to survive. Once you start doing that, and because you have nothing to hold on to, you do start to detach quite quickly. It took me a looong time to start to really detach (maybe because I knew once I started, I would be done or because I worried I'd have to rewrite my memories to do it)...so it took me about 18 months maybe. But once I started doing things like getting rid of stuff, moving house...I moved pretty quickly on feeling more and more detached, and less and less hopeful or interested in what my STBXH was doing or thinking.
In terms of being on this forum? With a vanisher, I think it forces the LBS to do all the hard work inside themselves in isolation. To unpick things, look back, ask questions and answer them, try to figure out how to survive, heal and move forward from a big empty silent explosion. I've posted quite a lot because I was late to MLC as a possible explanation, so it coincided with me trying to fight my way (out loud on this forum) from detachment to acceptance to rebuilding the next bit of my life. So, most of my posts are big on musing and light on action or informative MLC examples! (Until today ironically). I just happen to find writing as a way of processing quite helpful, but I completely understand why others might think posing 'Same old silence. No clue. It hurts. Trying to survive and figure it out' gets a bit stale after a few months ;D
No communication = no relationship is absolutely true. In 26 months, I've seen my STBXH 4 times, probably spoken to him on the phone for a total of about 12 hours max and received maybe 20 replies to emails/texts and recently about 6 'thinky' emails initiated by him - what's that, about 1 email a month since BD? an average of 20 mins conversation pcm and a sighting on an average 6-7 months? Not much to talk about here. And as time passes, you do feel that there was your H and now there is a stranger living in a place you don't know, with friends you don't know, maybe hobbies (other than sex with OW!) you don't know about, who wants to be completely different in their tastes and lifestyle than the person you know. I'm not even sure where my STBXH lives. For months I only knew he was alive because his salary was paid into our household account! And if you ever did start talking, the silence has created such a huge list of awkward undiscussables that even having a simple friendly chat would be difficult. Right now, I know more about the life of the lady in my local food shop that I chat to than I do about the life of the man I shared 18 years with! Which is pretty weird, but what he wants and made happen.
I genuinely don't know if that means vanishers are less likely to return. I guess it depends on them. I do think the silent abandonment creates such a huge wall of unfinished business that it would need a lot of courage or desire from the MLCer to turn back and breach it. And courage is not always an obvious gift of MLC, is it? I think for the LBS, a vanisher makes the choice more stark really - let go or drown - and there are just less visible reasons to hope or believe that your spouse has any feelings or interest in you at all.
Most people who knew me and my STBXH were really shocked by what happened. Almost all of them believed that he would 'get better' and come home within a few months. Almost all of them still think that when the divorce is done, reality will 'hit' him and he will show up again within 12 months after it. Very few of them now think that I should even contemplate giving him the time of day if he does. Only two of them would want me to be open to reconciliation if that happened...and one is the priest who married us! Me? I thought he'd come home in the first year too...he almost did...and then ran away again, and started the OW/divorce train running. I did think that he might pull back from the final divorce step when he was dragging his feet...and then I started to question if I could even find the energy if he did. I don't believe he will magically hit an awakening after the divorce is done...I could be wrong, but I don't think so. He might feel an itch of unfinished business but I don't think he is brave enough or will value what he threw away enough...if he did, it would really hurt him so it would be much easier to keep running and not look back.
And if I'm wrong, and he pops up in 2 years time for instance, like nah's father? Well, being open-minded, I suppose IDK...but I expect to have another intimate relationship by then (because I really need to have sex before I forget how to do it ;D) and, although I can forgive him from a distance, I don't know if I could forgive myself if I chose to have a man in my life who I knew could do what he has done to me. I think I wouldn't feel ok about myself if I did that...if I trusted someone who I knew had literally been indifferent to someone threatening to kill me or my having cancer surgery. Loving compassion is one thing; foolish masochism is another. And I find it tremendously sad, really the biggest tragedy of this, that I can't remember my H just as he was for 18 years without having to also balance it with the stark reality of who my STBXH has been for the last 2 years and may be for the rest of his life. It is a sad waste of a good person and a good loving relationship, but it is as it is.
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T, funny how your last post was about doubting your MLCer would ever pop up again.... ;D ;D
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I didn't think puffy the vanisher would but here we are.....
He's back... and trying for dad of the year award.... After almost 4 years, I had to see mr puffy yesterday... He looks sad, sick, thin, and old... He's not even remotely attractive.... Wouldn't be interested in him... even if I didn't know what kind of person he has become. Seeing him just made me grateful.. I'm glad he's gone and I'm elated that I will never go back!
So yes, sometimes, they do "come back".... He's helping our s, letting s live with him... Puffy vanished from s's life for almost 3 full years!! I'm thankful for him finally stepping up and helping... but of course, I have major reservations that I'm working through... I'm trying to forgive... It's just hard. I can't bash someone who is trying their hardest to make amends for hurting our son.
So we shall see. The circus has already begun.. The few conversations I've had with puffy have shed new light on this MLC... and I'm totally certain he's gone through one, still in it, and may never ever exit. I'll share more later.. But puffy made the statement, "all life is suffering, being an adult sucks and it's miserable and depressing"....
I told him NO.. It's not... and that's a sad way to view life.... And then just stopped... It's not worth the argument.
I'll update more later... It's really insane to listen to their thought process... They are completely nuts!!
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Golly, Ms M ::)
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Please tell us more Ms M. Do you think he went through all the stages?
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I think he's still in replay, might be moving out of it but the underlying anger is still very obvious and he can't hide it very well...
I think puffy will be a stuck MLCer, just like his dad. Puffy is following his dad's MLC handbook to a t!!!
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Ms M, I'm glad to hear he is stepping up for his S. I remember the stories of his absence with y'alls S. That's as much of a heartbreak as BD if you ask me. I just hope the MLC handbook doesn't get passed down to a 3rd generation. I know you're there to teach your son otherwise! Pleasee do. MLC seems to be genetically predisposed.
Monty - you should surprise your H and change anyway.
I guess when its all said and done we all have to change. as long as we make it for the better, we'll be OK
I've always had a gut feeling that my ghost will come around one day. When/if it happens, who knows, it's just a gut feel.
So I was chatting with my mom and BFF over the holidays (they always bring up the ghost when we get to talking.... not sure why... I think they're afraid of when the ghost comes around) Anyway, I told them I know he will come around some day, I just don't know how I'd handle it. They kept denying it would happen. I said, do you know how I KNOW it will? (they look at me like I have a 3rd eye). I said, because of who I am. Look who we're talking about (me). I'm WORTH coming back around for !! LOL LOL LOL. They didn't know what to say because they know it too ;D ;D ;D
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"all life is suffering, being an adult sucks and it's miserable and depressing"....
What?!? He's not dancing in the streets every day with his super awesome shiny new life?
Isn't that why he ran away? Wasn't it because YOU suck, and all he needed to do to be happy was run away form you?
I know how you feel MsM...
The selfless part of us wants them to be happy, we loved these men with everything we had and if we truly loved them, we should want them to be happy, right?
But.... for me anyways, I'm fire trucking human, and big part of me wants to know that it wasn't me, it was him, and he deserves to wallow in the sh!t he created because he didn't only hurt me, he hurt OUR family.
@sshats.
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I've always had a gut feeling that my ghost will come around one day. When/if it happens, who knows, it's just a gut feel.
I think you're right Calling.
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But.... for me anyways, I'm fire trucking human, and big part of me wants to know that it wasn't me, it was him, and he deserves to wallow in the sh!t he created because he didn't only hurt me, he hurt OUR family.
@sshats.
LOL….you and me both Nah!
2 other things.
Am I the only one without a sound or sight of XH in 3,5 years? Not that I miss the abuse, I just think it's strange behavior but on the other hand with that behavior I know it's not me who is the crazy one! ;)
Has anyone heard anything from Lawprofessor, Pixie etc?
Hugs
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Am I the only one without a sound or sight of XH in 3,5 years? Not that I miss the abuse, I just think it's strange behavior but on the other hand with that behavior I know it's not me who is the crazy one! ;)
There are others who have gone at least that long, and longer. Now you have sons, right? Does your xh have any contact with either one of them?
Has anyone heard anything from Lawprofessor, Pixie etc?
I don't know about Pixie but I do know we lost a few good ones awhile back (maybe about a year?) when there was a controversy on a thread. Haven't heard from LP, Airmid, or Stayed since... :'(
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There are others who have gone at least that long, and longer. Now you have sons, right? Does your xh have any contact with either one of them?
Yes, I do. Oldest has no relationship with his father, youngest a tiny link to his father but I think that link is soon nothing also. Youngest son has started to grasp the full picture of what his father has done and are doing now.
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I don't know about Pixie but I do know we lost a few good ones awhile back (maybe about a year?) when there was a controversy on a thread. Haven't heard from LP, Airmid, or Stayed since... :'(
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Oh Airmid and Stayed, I miss those 2 also!
Hugs
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Just something I have noticed over the years,... and of course with these crazy MLCers there are ALWAYS exceptions....
But if there is still some link... either kids, in-laws, mutual friends, etc., even if it’s small....
Those seem to me the most likely to appear again.
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Ah well, unless Louis the cat has super powers...I'm f**ked then ;D ....or so I would have said before Watchgate LOL
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Ah well, unless Louis the cat has super powers...I'm f**ked then ;D ....or so I would have said before Watchgate LOL
Oh see that? But what about the aunt or other in-laws... do you talk to any of them?
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Nope - aunt who was my friend pre-H has cut me dead. His R with his family was always one of trying to keep them far away from him/us as possible...his aunt pressured him/us to do big family events, I kept things like Xmas card links going..his grandmother died pre-BD which was a shared link with us as we were very involved in her care and he cut all etc with our old friends and his own. I've heard nothing from any of his family since Jan 16. It's as if I never existed at all for him or any of his family. I think he said he was talking to his F a bit more (who hated me before), that his M was 'the same' and his R with his aunt has got more distant because both of them are given to avoiding elephants in the room!
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I have no children and have not heard a thing from the vanisher walked out the day of bd Aug 15 ltbnilwy he still pAys half the morgage but not a text email nothing feel like I'm in limbo just waiting for him to pop out and say we need to sell up
His family have never tried to contact me it's like I never existed
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I'm sorry, poowoo - that makes my STBXH look positively chatty ??? - maybe less of a vanisher, more an on-off. Can't imagine how hard that is, practically and emotionally. What's your plan and how are you coping with that?
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Oh my lawd, y'all.....
First, they are crazy.... S says puffy does nothing but listen to depressing music... and is just depressing.. S moved in with puffy Saturday...
Saturday night, the vacuum made her appearance! Yep, he dumped the first ow, because she lived 30 minutes away, only to then go back the vacuum that is 18 months OLDER than our SON!!!! She's back.... S says she's gross.... I have to agree... I wish he'd find something new. Anything but the 5 "women" he cheated on me with. Puffy knows of my relationship with Duke. He doesn't ask, I only offered that we consider each other "life partners".
I'm just looking at the bright side. My son has his father, in his life, for the first time, in almost four years. My s needed this more than anything... So I will just be thankful and grateful that something made puffy realize that he needed to step up and so far, he has....
Now the rest of it.. He's hateful, negative, complains about me to s on a regular basis. I've been NOTHING but kind, sweet, etc to puffy. He has ZERO room to complain.. but yet, he is. He has to find something to bi&%h about. Puffy sees nothing good, in anything. Nothing is ever positive, no glasses half full around him.
And that's why I'm so glad I'm not tied to that any longer. No one needs that kind of nasty in their lives, in their head, constantly thrown at them... I'm getting braver, I throw truth darts, I no longer care what he says, does, etc in response to me. I just stick to my happy guns and hose him with kindness every chance I get ....
SMILE Y'ALL!!! I've figured out that our happiness, the more we move forward, the better we become, is the only way through this!! :)
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So, I had dinner with my s last night, he is currently living with the vanishing, reappearing puffy....
I get my info from s, only when he feels like sharing. I do not push and even though I've had more contact in the past 15 days with the ex, I don't ask him anything... Yet... I'm sure with time, I may get the chance. But for now, I just listen when s is willing to talk...
First off, these MLCers are miserable. Period. Regardless of what they project, what they say, no matter how great they say their lives are, they are depressed and miserable. S constantly says his dad is depressed, all the time, listens to terribly sad music all the time, can never see the good / happy in anything, ever!! S believes that it's because puffy knows what he's done, knows what he lost and is now feeling guilty and stupid for his choices...
I can't really call the ow, ow.. She's not old enough to be one.. She's three years older than our son. S is 22, the vacuum is 25... She's such a prize, NOT... At her old age, she's managed to become a recovering alcoholic, but yet, she and puffy drink to the point of blacking out. Last weekend, s said that puffy came home and looked like he'd been in a fight. They both were bruised, her eyes were blackened. With little to no memory of the night before. Only to tell s, that they think someone slipped something in their drinks. BS!! They are drunks... Period!
Vacuum is scared of me. Don't know why but my son feels that she's afraid of both me and him. S said if she ever says a word about me, he will make sure she knows she has zero right to even speak my name! Love that kid, always looking out for me.
S went on to say that his dad is just not normal any longer. He's a stranger, so weird, and the complete opposite of the person he once was. I picked s up at puffy's home. Puffy told s, your mother is allowed on the porch, she is not allowed in my home.... As if I'd want to???!!! He still has such a high opinion of himself. I guess some things never change! S says I'm better off, he's glad we are divorced. He hates that his parents can't be together but s understands that I wasn't given a choice and that I will never stand for that kind of mental, emotional, and verbal abuse again, S too, he's put his dad in check several times, all ending with puffy's apology being, I'm sorry I got angry / frustrated, s is just...... whatever you want to fill in the blank with. Again, still no attempt even try to control himself, he's just an angry, hateful shell of human, that spends all of his time.. BLAMING ME! Yep, he continues to blame me, for absolutely everything!! And, I'm still not shocked....
So... It's not us, it's them... It always was and has been. Chins up LBSers....or the crown slips! :)
Happy Happy Friday y'all! Have a great weekend!
Hugs and kisses!
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MsMedfly,
That word frustrated stood out for me. I got a summary of our parenting time assessments in the mail and the counselor said that the coward gets frustrated with d13. Is frustration part of the script?
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Yes, I think so......
But notice their frustration is EVERYONE ELSE'S FAULT......
He can't communicate his own frustrations, he just screams, throws a fit and cusses like a sailor... and it's always has to be because of something, someone else did! Not because they have issues....
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A helpful post MsM! I truly hope you find comfort found that!!!
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Funny how even the vanishers can still finger point.
Somehow I’m supposed to feel bad that The Leaver is broke even though he lost his job two years after he left, stopped paying me alimony last year and I have paid for all of our sons college expenses.
Oh well, benefit of low contact is I only hear his whining once in awhile.
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Nah,
Is that all they do is whine????? O M G....
Puffy is attempting to create and drag me onto his drama triangle, with our son. I'm not having any of it and don't play. I cannot believe how literally the MLCer makes EVERYTHING about them. It's unbelievable how selfish and self centered he is.
I get a text from puffy stating "we" need to talk, he expects me to be completely transparent, about s's affairs...
Um.... S is living with puffy. He has a front row seat to s's life, needs, etc... I don't... but I'm to be transparent. Ok... about what and HOW?? .. Then, of course, he's "allowing" s to live with him, has caused such a major disruption to his life.... Selfish a$$ clown!!!
Sweeps in to be the hero for our son... to then just complain about it... ????? In what universe will this ever make sense????!!
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MsMed, I would ignore the text.
You don't "need" to talk to him about anything.
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hmmmm.... I would be so very curious as to what he has to say.
If your son lives with puffy why would you have more information than him?
Sometimes I liked to see The Leaver face to face b/c it happens so rarely. When we do meet, except for the really early days, I always have the upper hand. If he says anything remotely ridiculous (which of course he does) I just give him the "tilt head like a confused puppy look" and he often backtracks.
The benefit of having a 30 years relationship is we can talk without always saying words. He knows what my expressions mean. I always did way better with him face-to-face as opposed to messages or even phone calls (which has happened maybe 5-6 times in almost five years).
Maybe that's just us, IDK, anybody else have these kind of interactions?
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My last face to face with MLCer was in August in the prestigious pole shed on MY property! I owned that conversation. He got schooled.
Of course there had only been two prior face to face convos during the previous 18 months where I worked hard to just keep my composure and not literally have a melt down.
I have more to look forward to because, of course, his "stuff" and his pole shed are still with me. He's probably really looking forward to it.
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My last face to face was because he had too in 2017 when my son had his car accident, hadn’t seen him before that since 2014 , no contact at all unless it’s a text through his children,he has vanished from me and me only ,, as he says it is me he left ,
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Christyaa hope your ok , I’m listening
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I noticed when I do have face-to-face interactions with The Leaver, he is not as much as a "tough-guy" as he is with messages and phone calls. IDK, maybe b/c he can't run and hide while I'm standing in front of him, maybe b/c he can't consult his controlling girl as to what he is allowed to say, who knows but I know it's not just my imagination.
Even early on, my lawyer noticed it. My lawyer noticed our interactions and used his weakness during our face-to-face meetings as a tactic. Face-to-Face meetings, I negotiated with the Leaver while my lawyer distracted his lawyer, and I ALWAYS got him to cave. Sometimes his lawyer would scurry him away into another room and they would come back with The Leaver's head down and his lawyer would try to retract our agreement..... then I would get in BOTH of their faces (shocking, I know...lol) and I would win again. The Leaver actually yelled at his OWN lawyer when I gave him that disappointed mom face. ;D ;D
My lawyer actually whispered to me once that she wanted to high-five me but would wait until they couldn't see.
Maybe that's why many of our MLCers are vanishers. They are weak and they know they are weak. They are actually afraid of us b/c they are aware that we know their true selves. They can't hold their mask on very long when we are around and that's exactly what they are trying to hide from,.... themselves.
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Nah, I think you are right... they are weak, can't hide it from us, and then chose to act like a small child and hide.
What really makes me angry... I've been nothing but kind, nice, etc to puffy... He's a d&*k all the time.. but behind my back, talks about how awful I am, what a bi%&ch I am, how terrible it is when he has to speak / make contact with me....
I'm seriously nothing but the kind, pleasant, positive person I've always been.. Mr. Negative hateful has to make it nasty.... and point the finger at me.. WHY??? I don't get it.. He is the one that lied, cheated, left, and divorced me... so why does he continue to treat me, like I "did" this to him??? I know he's miserable, I know he's depressed but continuing to blame me for it?? What a weirdo!!
I just don't get it....
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MLC 101.
They feel guilty so they project their guilt and anger onto us because they can't handle what they have done.
So pathetic.
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MsMedfly,
The coward still does the blame thing to me. I am at the 3 year mark now since bd. I have no contact with him. No text. No calls. Nothing. In court documents that i recieved recently, it is still all my fault. I strongly believe that it doesnt matter how nice or not you are to them, until they face what they have done it will be our faults.
Nah,
What you said is the truth. I dont believe that the person they were , that still might be in there somewhere, can handle what the new person they have become has done.
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Well, after he left I made some really poor decisions myself. I would rather forget it all happened but it does seep into my thoughts,... "I can't believe I did that.,... I can't believe I behaved that way,... I can't believe I hurt that person" and these were acquaintances not a spouse of three decades. I can't imagine the guilt if these men were loyal spouses and the other parent of my children.
No wonder they want to run away, try to forget, or even try to point their fingers at anybody but themselves.
These vanishers aren't unique, they all behave very similar. Sure some monster and some don't, some completely disappear and some poke their heads out now and again only to disappear again, but they are all very similar.
Many MLCers will show anger b/c as little boys anger it the only emotion they know how to express.
I was one of the lucky (??) ones that had her spouse open up for a short time. No, he is not happy, Yes he thinks of me and the life we use to have "Every fire trucking day". He is such a mess he becomes physically sick every single morning. He looks in the mirror and feels like he is living someone else's life. That last sentence, I believe, is how most of them feel. The Leaver married the girl just two months after he said those words to me. Why? He made his bed, she runs the show and he's too emotionally weak to do anything but watch the mess he created.
For those of you who might be wondering,... I 100% believed him. I lived with this man for 30 years and he often had stomach issues when he was a little stressed-out (and my daughter did too, she threw up for years every school morning), so I don't think he was exaggerating. I really believe he not only threw up but most likely spent his entire wedding day sitting on the toilet... lol
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I think it would help my healing alot to hear the coward say that to me.
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I've just had an insight into hiding / vanisher, I'll post the details on my thread but he has said he thinks about me every day, he suffers with guilt constantly, but he can't cope with how I see him now, so pretty much what Nah said
I don't know how I feel, I'm happy that he hasn't completely forgotten me, because that's how it feels when they pretend you don't exist, but it's just so frustrating, why can't they man up ??!!!!??? Oh that's right, because they don't have to ! ow doesn't see them like that and having some pathetic affair down looking at you with admiration is preferable to dealing with the hurt they've caused to someone who truly loved them - argggghhhhhhh !!!
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I love this, SHF.
Yes, I get it. When they give us crumbs it is so crazy confusing.
So now mine, yours, and Treasur's MLCers gave us a small window into their thoughts.
Yes they think of us, of course they think us, unless they have complete amnesia, they can pretend but of course they think of us.
I did the same as you. At the 2 1/2 year mark I "mistakenly" called him. No contact = no relationship and that is not what I wanted. He opened up to me and then disappeared again but, it was something.
I believe Vanishers need to be treated differently than the clingers/ boomerangs/ wallowers,... they are a different breed, that why we have our own thread.
Yes they need space, they need a crazy amount of space BUT.... most of them will not contact us so they hide. I believe it's up to us (if we want) to contact them. Not often, but once in a while can be beneficial.
What's the worse that can happen? They ignore us?
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My musings on On-Off/Vanishers FWIW...think it's a combo of a couple of things really. Shame. Agency. Forgiveness.
It's so easy to feel erased by a Vanisher and assume they don't think about us at all. Now, I think it might be the exact opposite...but they feel so ashamed that it hurts to see/talk to us. Now, post-watchgate, I know that my H thinks of me every day...sad.
I also think my H has no 'mental template' for forgiveness...I think it is almost beyond him to 'get' that others might see it differently. I am quite sure my H thinks he is unforgivable as a person, all solid FOO stuff, and finds the idea that you can love a person and hate their actions quite incomprehensible.
I think my H has always struggled with the idea of agency, of his right to choose actions even if others don't agree, and accept the consequences. For him, there's an underlying issue about being a 'man', I think.
I don't share his POV on any of these three things. Never have, but then I have always believed that I am good enough even I mess up. The sad thing with a Vanisher - ignoring the M/us issue - is that they really can't recover until they find the courage for themselves to step up and look at this stuff. No amount of us saying 'it will be ok' matters. They have to decide to try to see if it can be ok because they need/want to. And if they don't? They will stay broken. It is a bit like watching an addict really...
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Like the idea that I made this choice, regardless of how awful, dumb, stupid, or hurtful, I'm going to make it, stick to it, and then hide when I realize it was the stupidest thing ever to do??
Only while in hibernation, they realize they can't come out of hiding because of how it will "look"... It seems like they care more about the appearance of who they "should" be than the person they actually are...
Puffy's new motto is "all life is suffering and depressing".... and we should just all accept it...
Nope, sorry MLCer, that's really not the reality of life..
Puffy would say things like "my perception is reality"... His perception is seriously jacked up!!! :)
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You ladies have a wonderful knack for wording your points so wonderfully.
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Agree whole heartedly with the musing thoughts about Vanishers.
Agree the ghost must have feel / live in Shame. If he wasn’t ashamed of his actions, he would not have cut himself off even from his own FOO. Shame is an interesting concept that differs from Regret. Shame is about him. Regret would be about me somehow – about what he lost, which goes beyond the center of his universe (ie: HIM). So I think if or until Regret comes into play, my ghost will stay gone.
Agree with the ghost “feeling of being unforgiveable”. He even had once told me before we got married that he had done something (private) and God would never forgive him. I know he carries that mindset. I remember asking him 2 weeks after BD if he would forgive me, and he reluctantly said “yes” but I don’t think he can truly frame forgiveness for someone else, unless he could possibly forgive himself.
In my opinion, my ghost took the most incredibly stupid course of action. He left, he shut himself off from anyone close to him, he went into a cave, and when he surfaced 1 year later to divorce me, he just wanted the paper signed. In some small way, that’s the one thing I can respect of him, despite the fact he didn’t do that for me in any way. Well, actually 2. He left the dog behind (thank God!) and he just cut me out of his life as simply as he possibly could. I remember doing the “math” after he left and keeping track of all the finances. He left me with some pretty stout bills, but in the end, all I had to do was sign his stupid divorce paper and I was awarded community property assets. Looking at that, it’s just stupid to me, but we obviously have completely different ways of looking at fair and just. That might relate back to the Shame and all his actions come full circle.
Oh how I cried when I felt “deleted” by him. I’m so glad I’ve gotten past that pain. I did recognize recently that there will always be a sliver of sorrow in my life. It’s like a thorn embedded in my finger that I can’t get out.
Agree I have to reach out on occasion. I called - no answer. I then sent a short email wishing him a happy 2018 and hope that all his dreams come true :)
You're right. what can he possibly do to me, ignore me? Oh... he did :)
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So reading this thread - I’m wondering on if your husband is a ‘ vanisher’ And you want to try to keep the return road open - would it not be best to try to keep him engaged with regular contact even if he lives with the OW? Even if he doesn’t respond much? Do you see that as annoying to him or you pressuring him? I am asking for advice as I notice the longer I don’t contact my h, the easier it seems for him to forget me and actually his adult kids. You know sometimes I do think there is Shame involved but not regret. I just find myself wondering if I don’t contact - will that make it easier for him to just stay away and never come back? That’s how it seems to be going without a thought of our 40 years together. I would like anyone’s opinions on this as I keep struggling with detaching. It is easier to detach with a vanisher but is it too easy for them then? Hugs: If
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if only , I am so struggling with that too? advice would be so much appreciated!xxx
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Ifonly, if you can handle contact, ie, you are not a puddle on the floor after contact and if you have no expectations of him answering then you should contact him when you feel like it. Small peridoic contact.
I am a firm believer that reconnection cannot haopen unless there is some sort of contact to keep your connection going. My h was out of sight out mind but I could not handle contact, still cant. I was a mess for days after.
But you have to do what works for you :) and keep in mind what your ultimate goal is
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I gave mine space and left him alone. Partly because it hurt too much and I was such a mess the first year that I went on anti-depressants. Very limited contact. He still has stuff here and the fabulous pole building to dismantle so I will have contact with him at some point in the future.
I believe mine lives in a huge cave of guilt. I think he might always. I don't think he has the strength to work his way out.
I think each person must do what they think is right for them, their MLCer, and their situation. I didn't look at it as seeing what others did. I did what I could live with and cope with.
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I have never posted on this thread but I am in this category as my H would have been a vanisher if I hadn't been the one who contacted him so I wanted to respond to the question If only posted...
I don't know IF only's story but would give this advise
Don't expect much in the beginning they are manic and on a high but as time passes then....
Only contact them when you have a reason if possible
Keep any communication non emotive and to the point but not dismissive or uncaring, don't guilt them
and keep it light hearted if possible, don't appear too eager (in MLC its seen as pressure)
Don't let more than 2-3 months go by without any contact
If they start to respond to your contact then don't respond immediately leave it a few hours (maybe a day if it gets regular)
and then respond...
If they don't respond.......then go back to point one and leave it a couple of months before you contact them again or until you need to contact them...
But as SB said you have to do what's right for you in the end...go with your instincts and your knowledge and history
AND as TYKS said do it without expectation...which is the hardest part
And be prepared for the cycling and the disappointment which may follow a period of regular contact and then nothing at all.
This is one of the hardest things to cope with.
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I’ll have to think about this. I do worry I may not be able to handle contact. But until
I started no contact - we had contact and then I did NC because of sonething I read to get your ex back - not MLC as I didn’t understand that at the time. But the 30 day NC seemed to work opposite and he seemed to like the NC - less blame, less guilt, less Shame so now he never contacts st all. The few contacts we did in person - all I did was cry and beg and ask was he sure? I think had I known more - I wouldn’t have asked someone acting crazy if they are sure? How would he know if he is in crisis and in love with someone else? I think I need to pull off some serious acting to get anywhere here and have patience. I do know I am not dealing with my husband but some one who is his opposite. If he asks me anything about myself(which isn’t likely)should I answer honestly or pretend everything is great! Lol thanks for your help. I have to read some important threads now! Hugs. IF
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I had a clinging boomerang for 3 yrs but now a vanisher. With regard to contact I have tried to contact in regards to the children with no response other than divorce papers.
I have now given up contact as he doesn’t even contact his children either.
H has not seen his children for 6 mths. That was the most hurtful for me. That he wouldn’t even respond when I needed help with our autistic son.
You must do what is right for you but for me the no response was worse than no contacting him at all. Xx
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If only, you ask the question we all wish we knew the answer to. I can only tell you my experience with my H. He was a boomerang then vanisher then clinging boomerang then vanisher then we had a reconnection then vanisher for the last year. If it weren't for my S, we would probably have no contact at all.
During his vanishing moments, if I didn't contact him, he would not contact me ever. When I do contact him, usually to ask him for some help for practical stuff, he then sends me back tons of emails. So my impression is that he doesn't contact me because he's scared of me. I think vanishers are ashamed. They know what they did was really bad, that they themselves would have judged someone who did what they did as bad. It's still just guilt, thinking of themselves and how they appear to others, maybe some shame when facing people they feel judged by, but that's easy to fix in their heads: just stay away from these people. So I guess the more shame they feel, the more they stay away.
A very good friend of mine from childhood is a doctor and her H went through a MLC. He was a wollower with no OW. She knew about MLC because she had studied it during her medical course, you see they do know about it, so she probably made fewer mistakes than we did. She had very strong boundaries and enforced them. They were boundaries about treatment of the kids and not selling the family home. She wasn't scared to tell him what she wanted. She was never rude though and never screamed.
She always stressed to me the importance of maintaining contact. She forced her H to phone on the house phone once a week to speak to their boys (he had up and left the country to work on another continent, didn't see the boys for 6 months), and every Saturday, she would answer the phone herself and just say hello how are you doing.
She says we must keep the communication line open if we want to get back together. She told me she had no expectations of him coming back, had no idea if he would, he was nasty monster, but he did go back, and they have been very happy since he woke up. His awakening was sudden, and once he came out of the fog, that's how he described it, he said he couldn't even remember why he'd wanted to leave in the first place. So you see, some do come back.
Since you seem to want to have some contact with your H, I would suggest as others have, a little email every couple of months. No pressure, no emotions, no relationship stuff even if he drags the conversation that way. It would be best if there were a real reason to communicate like if you needed some information from him, and then keep it brief.
You really can't make it worse. Do want you want to do, just don't judge them. They have a knack for triggering us and then we can get all accusatory on them, it doesn't work, actually that is when we do make things worse. Just don't be too sweet or too cold. Think of a work email. Polite. Good luck.
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My bd was 3 years ago. He started out as a boomarang possibly clinging. He stayed that way for 8 months. Then he moved his ow up to live with him. Very minimal contact with me and the kids. 8 months after the very little contact, i got a text from him saying that we needed to talk face to face to talk about finances and kids. Up to this point he did not help financially at all. I agreed to talk and he came right away. He did not talk about money or kids. He told me that he missed me, had regrets, couldnt stop thinking about me, he missed me, couldnt get my face out of his head, wasnt happy, didnt desire the ow, wanted to work on the marriage, would have no problem shipping her back home and breaking all contact, couldnt stand her kid and that sometimes you have to go through the bad to get to the good. We slept together. For a whole month he very half heartedly "tried".
After that he abandoned us all completely. He blamed me. My son told his ow about him cheating on her. Since then i have had barely any contact. He attacked me in june,verbally, at the court house saying" Your only acting this way because you cant have me". The last text i got was in August. I never answered. We have 3 children and do not communicate at all. He chooses to go through the youngest.
I dont think it really matters if there is contact or not
If its meant to be, it will happen.
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I love this, SHF.
Yes, I get it. When they give us crumbs it is so crazy confusing.
So now mine, yours, and Treasur's MLCers gave us a small window into their thoughts.
Yes they think of us, of course they think us, unless they have complete amnesia, they can pretend but of course they think of us.
I did the same as you. At the 2 1/2 year mark I "mistakenly" called him. No contact = no relationship and that is not what I wanted. He opened up to me and then disappeared again but, it was something.
I believe Vanishers need to be treated differently than the clingers/ boomerangs/ wallowers,... they are a different breed, that why we have our own thread.
Yes they need space, they need a crazy amount of space BUT.... most of them will not contact us so they hide. I believe it's up to us (if we want) to contact them. Not often, but once in a while can be beneficial.
What's the worse that can happen? They ignore us?
I agree Nah, I have been very brave face ( mainly 😉 ) since BD and never asked him to come back. I've posted more detail on my thread about how I was pretty tough
After reading more here, your threads, Treasurs, Denj's and 1Troubles among many others, had made me see that a bit of kindness was sometimes appreciated, so I've been thinking about contacting him like this for a while. A few birthday G&ts gave me the nudge I needed 😄
I didn't expect a reply, I didn't ask any questions, it was just a 'I'm still glad I married you' vibe. So him replying so nicely is a bonus, but I don't expect it to continue
I agree that pride and being admired also plays a big part in the vanishers mindset, along with the overwhelming guilt and shame, he actually said that he's still the man I knew and not an unfeeling +*^€. I did say I couldn't understand how he could pretend I don't exist, so I think that might have hit a nerve
With regards to contacting, I think you need to do what feels right for you and what you can cope with. It's taken a long time for me to feel like I wanted to lower my guard and I really didn't expect a reply, I was prepared for no reply.
I think you have to protect yourself but you also have to be comfortable with what you do. You know your partner, your relationship and yourself better than anyone else, but getting others opinion can help you see options that you might not have previously considered, that's what has happened to me recently. I read threads where people had reached out and it gave me the confidence to do it. I had become uncomfortable with how I was dealing with things, I felt I was healed enough to lower my guard a little bit, but you have to be prepared for every outcome, I really thought he'd ignore it, I also prepared for an angry reply. This time I got a kind reply but I don't know if that would have happened if I'd sent this sooner, as others say you need to do what feels right for you
None of this is easy, but thankfully we've found this forum where there is such understanding and support, whatever you do someone here has been in the same situation and will offer support. That's why I'm so grateful to HS and everyone here 😊
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Thanks Everyone for your responses- SHF, Blue, Milly, RP, ITroubke, SB and Tyks. I see myself in all these stories. It is such a difficult balancing act! I really appreciate your opinions and options. I should know what is best to do because, like you said, I SHOULD know him better than anyone. Unfortunately, he is nothing like the person I THOUGHT I knew for over 40 years. He is quite like everyone of your H’s and I am glad I found this forum because people just don’t know what really goes on in a MLC. But you all know and it’s nothing good or quick. I am going to try contact again and try to act as if my heart is not torn up and keep making myself a better person. I will post how it goes. Thanks: IF
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Good luck if.
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I don't contact the puffer unless he contacts first.. I ask zero questions, unless it's pertaining to our s, then I only ask questions that I already know the answers to. You cannot have a healthy conversation with an unhealthy person...
That being said, I had to be in a place where his reactions, responses, or lack thereof, no longer hurt me, in anyway. Nothing he says or does will hurt me again, period. It's very easy to do, when you know everything they say is a lie and you finally let go of any and all expectations or assumptions. Puffy wouldn't tell the truth about what day of the week it is, much less, open up about anything else. I wish I could ask questions, but honestly, with his inability to tell the truth plus he has a very skewed perception of reality, I'm not sure I would ever get honest insight into his thoughts and feelings...
S joined me at school yesterday for lunch. He had a blast hanging out with me and all of my little freshman. He did tell me that the vacuum has been dumped, again. Seems they fight too much and have very different opinions on politics. Um...... Really??? How so?? She's 25, puffy is 47... I can't imagine why???!!! A$$ clown.... He did tell our son, that he and OW # 1 were madly in love, this is the one he dumped after leaving me because she lives too far... Just plain ol' stupidity!!
Find what your are comfortable with... and stick to it.. Do not let your guard or boundaries down... NEVER let them dull or steal your SPARKLE!! :)
Happy Happy Friday Y'all!!
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I usually don’t have much to say about he’s been incognito for since last July. Well he popped up to visit my younger Daughter and son in law this week in Illinois. My D is struggling right now with her eating disorder and is not in a good place. XH said he was driving thru the area and just wanted to stop by. My D had not responded to him. So he contacted my SIL. He told him it wasn’t a good time. XH then called my other D that he hasn’t seen since July that I am living with saying he knew I wouldn’t want to talk to him but thought someone should know D2 wasn’t doing well in IL. I think he was coming by to appease his mother who probably tell him to stay in contact with my girls. He was their stepdad for 22 years.
He only stayed an hour but I thought you’d all have a thought about this comment my SIL said. “Weird. Just showed up like everything was normal, looked and acted the same as always, very sarcastic. He told me it’s tough living in the same lane of life for so long and I gave him a piece of my mind stating not when you love that person. Shut him up pretty quick”. SIL thought him very deceptive as he has felt that way about him for awhile.
I have to say the line about the “same lane” stung. Curious what you all think? Do you think your MLCers have the same way of thinking? Still in replay?
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Sounds like it...I do think one of the good tests is how much of what they say/do is still all about them. Missing empathy chip really, so turning up like that after being told it wasn't a good time, making a little Sadz drama by contacting your other daughter rather than you if he was concerned...and indirectly blaming you for that...you know, like a real grown-up. Your son-in-law sounds like a good egg though :)
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Yes. I believe he is still in replay. He is still blaming me and running from responsibility at least with his former family. He still doesnt own up to his behaviour of tbe past 3 years.
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I have to say the line about the “same lane” stung. Curious what you all think? Do you think your MLCers have the same way of thinking? Still in replay?
Sounds like The Leaver, just a different phrase.
Most MLCers need a cool catch phrase to justify their behavior. The Leaver told numerous people that, "Nah and I were not on the same page." Of course he left out that my page was work, dishes and laundry and his page was fire trucking a girl half his age. He used that phrase for at least two years and would repeat that same phrase again and again Almost like he had to have something ready when asked, b/c he didn't know either.
After time, people stop asking so the phrase faded away.
IMO, and I could be wrong, I think "types" of MLCers have very similar ways of thinking. The wallowers, clingers, boomerangs, vanishers, sure might all say things like ilybinilwy BUT they do things differently in their groups so should be treated differently depending on what WE want...
For example No Contact is often discussed. With a clinger they are in your face, so of course No Contact would be a completely different animal than No Contact with a Vanisher. Now again, this is just my opinion from my experiences with The Leaver and what I have read over the years on this forum. RCR didn't have a vanisher, she had a boomerang, so her experience was different and her articles touch with her experiences and her observations of others but she never had a vanisher,.... we do. That's why it's important to learn from each other. Not just to get him "back" (not all of us are here for that anymore) but for communication (if that's what we want) from a man who wants nothing more than to disappear from us.
Replay....
We often equate replay with the affair. What if they are sliding out of replay but "stuck" due to the feeling of having to live with their choices?
I feel that's where The Leaver is right now, and honestly I think he has been there for a long time and may never get out. Again, my opinion only, but I wouldn't be surprised that is exactly what happens to the majority of the vanishers. They might realize their choices were crap but now because they dug their heals in so deep, they are too afraid to do anything to get out. That's why they stay hiding. Fear. Plain and simple, fear.
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I don’t know about all of them, but mine’s just a giant coward. He was an off and on who generally would respond to my contact (unless it was about the nonexistent divorce...that he just hid from).
Then I was diagnosed with cancer. He all but disappeared and now I found out he’s actually changed his phone number.
Disgusting coward.
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My neighbor said to me over a year ago that she thinks the coward has got himself into a situation he cant get out of. I agree with them getting stuck.
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I agree that they get stuck. My H even told my D20 last May that he felt stuck. I think that the vanisher, having very little contact with the LBS, builds up a picture of her/him that is much worse than the reality. They are so scared of rejection. So instead, many of them go on to make things even worse for themselves.
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I agree, I had a clinging boomerang for 3 yrs then vanished and changing his no so ow can control every aspect. Even his children not allowed it. H did say several times that got him self in a corner and didnt know how to get out.
Non existent divorce for 3 yrs then vanished and files. Another giant coward who got himself stuck xx
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I am so sorry Nas. I sure hope you have support to get you through your battle with cancer. That is terrible of the leaver ! Worst thing ever! I actually had thought of that yesterday and wondered if my h would be there if I got sick. In my gut I knew he wouldn’t ☹️! Reading what you wrote brought tears to my eyes and I pray for a good outcome for your health.
Hugs: IF
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That is true Milly and 1P- they cut themselves off from their LBS and family and then after so long they are no longer reachable and stay with their poor choices. That’s what I have been seeing - it actually gets easier for a vanisher to have NC!
IF
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Well, we all agree that the Vanishers are the mother of all cowards. Yep every one of them.
it actually gets easier for a vanisher to have NC!
Well, kind of, no contact is forced on us because they hide, a little different than us stopping contact with them b/c they are abusive. Being ignored is it's own special kind of abuse. Yes, the LBSers of vanishers tend to detach earlier, but in the early days, their abrupt abandonment cuts like a knife.
The vanishers being the mother of all cowards, though, is why I believe Communication with them than the other "Types" of MLCers. Who cares if you flub a interaction with a clinger? You will get another chance in 5 minutes and he won't remember what you said anyways. Them not remembering is often brought up on here when a LBS is distraught over things that were said.
Not with the Vanishers, The Leaver brought up things I said and did years ago,...why? Well, if you only talk once or twice a year, they sit and stew about every word that was said, just like we do. Not that them stewing over things is always a bad thing. If fact, it's often exactly what they need.
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I agree, I had a clinging boomerang for 3 yrs then vanished and changing his no so ow can control every aspect. Even his children not allowed it. H did say several times that got him self in a corner and didnt know how to get out.
Non existent divorce for 3 yrs then vanished and files. Another giant coward who got himself stuck xx
RP, I feel you have a special case (lucky you ;) ) where your husband was forced to change "types" because of his insecure ow (well, all ow's are insecure but she might wear the crown). I feel (and remember this is just my opinion) that your husband in his heart wants to be more of a clinger or a boomerang but she forced his hand.
Their time together must be a special place of insecurities above all others, him wondering if he should really be with his real family, and her wondering if that's what he is thinking. So he has to play the game to pacify her and pretend that he's not obsessed about what he really and truly is obsessed about... his family. Each one of them must carefully pick their words, their actions, their uncomfortable silences....
Can you hear the bomb ticking???
Just a gut feeling.
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I hope so nah. I hope it sounds just like the crocodile after Captain Hook in Peter Pan that gets louder and louder and captain hooks nervous tick gets more and more visible 😂😂
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I must say that I really appreciate this post topic. At this stage in the game it seems like it's the only one I can participate in.
I'll be approaching another Vanisher anniversary in a few days. Although my life is full it still boggles my mind how someone that you built a life with can easily discard you as though you never existed. I've come to accept that this will be the thorn in my side and that I will never have answers.
I do wonder if my X got in so deep that he feels so humiliated and ashamed that even if he wanted to return he just can't so he makes the best of his situation. My X affaired down to the extreme. He ran off to be the knight in shining armor to a woman who was riddled with issues. He believed he could change her. I wonder if he did and if he's happier or does he regret his choices.
That's the insidious part of having a true vanisher, I'll never know the truth but live with the assumption he must be happier as he has never reached out. It can be a hard pill to swallow.
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Not knowing the truth is one of most painful and hardest part.
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That's the insidious part of having a true vanisher, I'll never know the truth but live with the assumption he must be happier as he has never reached out. It can be a hard pill to swallow.
True dat!!
Firetrucking stupid !!
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Thanks for your comments. One other thought I had about the “same lane” line. If it’s so hard to stay in the same lane with your wife why can he stay in the same lane with the ow? Or is he?
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Because he thought it would be different.
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Thanks for your comments. One other thought I had about the “same lane” line. If it’s so hard to stay in the same lane with your wife why can he stay in the same lane with the ow? Or is he?
Also, because he has to save face and has too much pride to admit that he screwed up big time. The old "I made my bed, not I have to lie in it" mantra. Time will tell how long these MLCers can stay in the same lane.
Meanwhile, we'll have been living life and moving along on the journey that is before us.
How's the job going, Shocked?
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I was wondering what other vanishes have said as they leave to vanish?
H lines were
Ilybinilwy
Not my life anymore
Ow listened and you didn’t
Too much water under the bridge
It’s easy at ow and quiet ( no kids)
( my personal favourite) you decorated and doesn’t feel like my home as not my stamp on n it! ( not that he ever decorated our home but has done ow Home from top to bottom)
Xx
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The house wasn't clean enough
Do you know how many affairs I could've had over the years? I don't wanna be that guy (this was the day before I found the emails)
We are not on the same page! ( he was on ow's page)
I don't feel like I think i should feel
I feel nothing
You're letting yourself go. I'm not attracted to you anymore
Oh man so many more, but i am sure someone else will come along and list them bc I believe it is all script lol
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Do you know how many affairs I could've had over the years? I don't wanna be that guy (this was the day before I found the emails)
Oh yes, I had “ I was the most loyal husband ever”
Really then why are you having an affair?
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Here goes:
I never loved you.
I should have never married you.
I only married you because you got pregnant.( he proposed to me the first before i got pregnant.)
We have never been friends.
We have no passion.
I want a partner in crime.
We are on different roads and have nothing in common.
I want to be in love again
These woman are just friends.
I want my freedom.
You have no personality.
Sure you have lost weight but your flabby.
It would cost alot for you to have the body i want.
You are useless and i have never been proud to callyou my wife.
There is more but its upsetting me just to write this.
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Bluerose, it’s awful what they have said to us. Sometimes I think the things they have said are worse than the vanishing xx
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Mine called me "less than." And when I got diagnosed with advanced cancer, he disappeared, stopped contacting and then changed his phone number. Because I guess I'm really defective now. >:(
Initially I got "I'm unhappy and don't know why."
Then ILYBINILWY.
Then he said he'd been afraid of me for 16 years (our entire relationship).
At one point before he moved away to live with OW, he said I was a good person and he wasn't. That was the closest I ever got to any recognition that it wasn't about me and he's never said anything like that since. And now he's completely gone so who knows what he's thinking.
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Having to listen to all of their f'd up reasons has to be the single hardest part.... Going from not having a clue something is wrong, to literally everything you do, including breathing too loud, is now a bone of contention... And it's always OUR fault...
I simply stopped listening. It hurt too much to hear that my sleeping with the tv on was destroying his life. Such stupidity and absolutely some of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard..TURN IT OFF Y'ALL!! Do not listen to their garbage and projection.... They will attempt to bring you down with every single insult. And NONE of it's true. Trying to shut it off seems impossible.. But trust me, your mental health is WORTH far more than the lies they want you to believe.....
My fave from the puffer: "I love you, I care about you, I can't live with you, you don't understand my porn addiction."....
Seriously... You cannot make this stuff up. I have a list of the "reasons"... they aren't worth reviewing.. Not a single one is about me, in anyway... Still isn't... S just informed me that his dad has a problem... He is always sleeping with the tv on!!!
LMAO!!!
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Ms that made me laugh! Xx
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It made me laugh too because sadly it is true!!! ☹️
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I had a clinger and a boomerang and now I have a vanisher.
He has been gone for just over 6 years and has gone no contact for almost a year and half. I don't even remember what his voice sounds like. He is living the high life with his latest OW. She pronounced them together for 2 years on social media. Funny he was with his family when supposedly they got together and working towards repair and reconcilliaton with me. She has been told about him and she doesn't believe it. She is saving him. She tells anyone who will listen how I am in love with him and won't leave him alone. I think in that year and half, I have contacted him maybe 4 times..one to tell of a death in the family, one to tell him to divorce me (when I found out about her), two about missing funds in the account (separate times) . He only answered me about the missing funds.
Here is the question that has been haunting me for months now - why does he not divorce me? If he is so happy in his new life, his new relationship, why does he not divorce?
I know he has morphed himself into an ambitious businessman with her. They are out constantly networking and going to fancy events and travelling as this is what is important to her. This is not the man I know. Maybe it is who he wanted to be. I have no idea. I just know before he was all about the Family and spending time together and fancy events did not interest him in the least.
You would think she would want him divorced? no? She has since summer posted lots on an open social media platform that one would think she is sending messages. My kids think she is. Her ex thinks she is sending them to both me and him. In them, she always is claiming that he is her man. Her children do not like him. They ask her to not have him around so much and her answer to them is " you don't want Mommy to be all alone in life do you? You will grow up and leave me, you stay with your Dad for a week at a time, you don't want me to be alone."
My one child has never met her and told his Father he would not meet her until he repairs with his siblings. My other two have not seen their Father in a long time. One is coming up to 2 years and the other 4.
one would think a divorce would help him pave the way back to his children also? I know at Hallowee, Christmas and in the new year, the one child's interactions with him caused major drama within our home and really has strained all the relationships within our house. It is so toxic the games, the MLC play. He is oblivious to how his actions create such a ripple and have such destruction. He is too busy on OW2 and continuting his lifestyle.
I don't get it.
I stood for my marriage. I still love my husband but I love a ghost.
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Hi living,
I’m sorry I have no answer as I too had a clinging boomerang who has now vanished as ow ultimatum when caught with me his wife! He threatened divorce many times and when I finally filed he went mad and begged me to withdraw which I did.
I can only think that a clinging boomerang puts it off as they want to return at some point. A vanisher I don’t know. I believe he has now filed due to ow ultimatum and identical to your h it sounds, they then cut off everything including their children. He has no one other than ow and the few friends she has. He has even fallen out with ow parents due to previously being a clinger.
I can’t inagine how hard it must be after a yr and a half of no contact. I struggle everyday that I have nothing from him but I get on with my life for my children. I still find it unimaginable that I will never see his face, or hear his voice ever again and neither will his children.
I believe possibly a vanisher doesn’t divorce unless the ow doing it for him if she is determined to want our place as wife. Ow2 may not want that as she has been married. My h ow has never been married or had children so is desperate for my position as wife. My h ow puts lots of love quotes and signs of this and that posts but in 3 yrs only 2 pics of him and her.
In the end we have no idea as they havr shut us out completely. Xx
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I have gotten to the point that I don't want to see him.
I don't want to share any family moments with him anymore. I struggle with how will I ever be able to attend our children's wedding or any occasion that might warrent both of us being there. Right now, I don't think I could manage it.
I think it is the vanishing act, the complete silence, the utter disrespect he has shown for our 25 years together and for our family. It is so difficult to fathom. This behaviour to me is worse than when he was coming in and out.
I tried to get divorced, ( I didn't want it but didn't see how he could come back from OW2 and what he had done. So it was the only thing to do.) he stalled and stalled. I was throwing funds we didn't have at nothing. I decided to not pursue any further. I thought his OW would push him and then it would get done. It has been over a year. He stopped the first round after OW1. (Back then he was a tattoo getting, drug and party boy..oh how they change based on the OW) He filed the first time because of OW1.
I am struggling again with this all. I would love to understand. Not sure it would help me but I would love to nontheless.
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I agree living, the silence is worse than the coming and going. I think I could have coped better in the beginning as we had 3 mths no contact and I was doing great and so were the kids.
The comings and goings took their tole as well as the constant cake eating and empty promises so that the vanishing has hid harder on myself and my kids.
What I find I resent is I have no help with an autistic child and that a father who would of died for his family has discarded them to the point of even blocking them on Xbox and PS4, cancelling their Netflix and changing his no so they are unable to text. He didn’t even ring or text them on xmas day or right their names in xmas cards.
I find he does these things when I do a bit more in the divorce procedure as I no longer rise to anything so he can not punish me anymore so he punishes Kids. Plus he is in teenage mode of they don’t text me so I’m not texting them!
As others have said who knows what they are thinking or doing. We have to carry on
I am still cycling but mainly I run on anger and waiting for indifferent. Xx
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Living with hope, I dont think we will ever understand, unfortunately. They are just gone and we really have to get on with our lives. My h would never have filed for divorxe. He told me that he didnt want one as he would not be getting married anytime soon?? ::) and then he chuckled. Nice.
The real reason is that he was too lazy to do it, just as he was in our whole marriage.
I filed at the one year mark of him leaving. At first i filed bc I thought it would shake him up. Nope. I had to do the second step of the process and i did it about three weeks ago. There was no rush as I had a year to do it but I did it for me. I did it to take my power back and I did it so that i can freely move on if i choose to do so.
He started this whole mess and I finished it bc I do not want to be married to a man who did not want to be married to me.
Do I miss him? I miss the man he was. Did I want to be divorced and starting my life over at this age? Nope, but I did not have a choice. It is what he wants and I will not stand stand in his way in his pursuit of happiness
Good luck to u!!
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Mine is a do'er. He makes a list and he doesn't go to bed at night until everything is crossed off.
This is why I don't understand the need to not divorce.
Is it the money? Is it that he doesn't want to fully committ to this person. He can use me as an excuse. I know he tells everyone the reason is because we are still working on a settlement. Ha! I have seen a proposal over a year ago and no person would have accepted it. It was a flat out no. Nothing to negotiate there. We waited for a response from his lawyer and none ever came.
By her social media, she is in love and he is her soulmate and they are destined to be together forever. She posts non stop and claims him as her man. Is that to get me to do it? I never react to these postings. I normally hear about it from the kids who lurk or by friends. I will admit to peaking when it was my birthday (we share a birthday the OW and I....and it turns out my H shares one with her deceased Father........twisted)
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Wow, living, we have very similar stories. Mine is also a vanisher now after being a clinger and an off and on. Changed his phone number while I’m in chemo.
I too have spent money I don’t have trying to get a divorce that he keeps stalling on. Haven’t seen him in 21 months. Haven’t had contact since he texted me happy birthday 6 morning baths ago. Couldn’t contact him now even if I wanted to because I don’t know his new number and he hasn’t checked his email in many months.
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Same nas and living although am far behind at 6 mths of a vanisher
Perhaps that’s the norm for clingers to vanish. H has vanished at the 3 yr mark.
Ow aswell thinks twin flames, one soul come together. I too won’t stand in his way.
It’s my children that hurts me, that he can vanish from them also with out a backward glance. Xx
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Mine, too, was a boomerang, clinger, then vanisher since the 2.5 year stage, so just an average MLCer by the sounds of it. Mine too claims we're negotiating his separation. It will be 3 years this month since he first brought us in front of a judge to get separation which is the first step towards a divorce in Italy. Not yet legally separated. I have to say that this is not the usual separation situation. It will be 4 years since BD for me in May so I know the 'no expectations' and I am quite comfortable with it now. I know it means nothing as far as reconciling, but it does mean something as far as what kind of a split up we have.
If they just wanted to be done with us because they are in love and have moved on, we would all be divorced immediately. I know that if I fall in love with someone else, the first thing I'll do is cut my H off immediately, however much it costs me financially. Right?
That's not to say that if some of you have H who did divorce you immediately, that you are not still looking at a MLC. Once of the many things I've learned from HS, is that there are many varieties of MLCers. Not getting divorced immediately is just one of the clues.
Right now my H is not contacting my S13 either. That means OW is with him. It's just something I've figured out over time. I have finally worked out that it's best to leave him be while he's under her influence. I do reach out now and again, every month/2months but if he doesn't answer, I leave it.
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I have stopped reaching out as I really needed his help with son 14 in January and go no reply to my email so that’s it for me.
With regard to fb quotes I feel the saying “those that do protest to much” springs to mind, but perhaps I’m wrong and he is blissfully happy. I never felt the need during our marriage to profess our love on social media. The occasional happy b day to my husband or happy Father’s Day was about it.
I now deliberately don’t put anything on fb even regarding the children as it gives them a window into our lives.
Ow last fb quote last week was 7 signs to true happiness. No 3 was don’t have life partners that everyone expects you to have and no 4 get rid of toxic relationships, both I believe aimed at me. Also a post about anger destroys you and burn bay leaf to help with stress. Perhaps he is stressed and angry.
I believe that if all is happy and blissful you don’t need to advertise it and if you do then you are not as secure with you’re stolen man as you want people to believe, but that’s just me perhaps . Xx
New thread: http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=9851.0