[CallingHeart]

Very little comment does (really) happen. I KNOW first hand. A 2-sentence note followed up by a 45 minute proclamation by my husband using BLAME to explain away his reasons for being "done" leaves me either agreeing with him or feeling the way I do feel in that a marriage should never end this way.  MLC or not.

As I never dealt with a "clinger", I don't buy into the not really story. People who do not experience vanishers do not truly know the details of being shunned as such. Never have walked in my shoes, so I get that.

Working together through a marital break up is a valid option for most mature adults.

 Oh well, to each their own.

[Anjae]

I have a vanihser. I didn't at BD 12 years ago, but I have had one for many years. It turned into a blessing. The clinger was insane. With a vanisher there is peace.

If there is a break up there is nothing to work out, is there? The work should be/must be done before to prevent reaching break up (again, I am not talking about MLC). Most non-MLC couples I know who divorced just agreed it was time to divorce and did it. They didn't went throught the crazy we deal with. I don't recall any explanations given by said couples, just that they had divorced.

Maybe here we just go for the divorce and don't use explanations much. I was totally surprised when a male friend that has been in therapy asked me "so, he didn't had a final talk with you?" I say, no. Friend told me he learned how to do the final talk in therapy and told me how it was. I just thought to myself "I don't have any patience for that thing, just say it at once and be done".

The boyfriend I had years ago once said "we need to talk", I was like what? No, he was not braking up with me, but "we need to talk" here is stuff from films. Or therapy. Or something men learned women want to hear. Except I don't like the "we need to talk" and have never said it to anyone I was in a relationship with.

Probably the problem is that, unlike most women, I don't care much for words or explanations, I care for actions. And all the advice of how to talk to a woman usually just bores me because men do it in a silly tone of voice used to such purpose that I find condescending.  Real Mr J never did it. But we're all different.

I've always said that if there has been a non-MLC affair I wouldn't end 20 years because of it, providing it was short lived. The wife and mistress for life thing is not for me.

[Unraveled]

Hope you guys don't mind a question here.  I don't know if I now have a vanisher or one in a pretty profound withdrawal.  More curiosity than anything.

I'm about 2 years and 8 mos from the big BD.  Kicked him out almost 2 years ago.  Beginning last September I began to notice withdrawal.  About the same time he stopped seeing the kids he started texting them almost every night (mental health stuff on FOO issues, music he knows I like, comedians I like, news items he thinks the kids might be interested in, good nights, I love yous, I miss yous, etc).  He had been doing it more intermittently before that  and often skipped weeks at a time (they don't respond).  He generally doesn't call them.  Around the same time he stopped communicating with me altogther.  Since December he will not contact me.  If I contact him about an emergency with the kids he will respond if I ask him to, usually pretty promptly.  If I tell him something that I'm just telling him to CMA, like a big expense or an injury to one of the kids, he will ignore me completely or respond only to the kids.  He initiates no communication with me at all at this point.

He demanded a separation agreement right after I kicked him out and then wouldn't sign it or tell me what he doesn't like about it.  He kept threatening divorce and I kept telling him to do it.  I think his OW2 finally pushed him to file around the time I was really trying to get him to do it (sick of limbo, he was playing with money, etc).  Since filing he has done NOTHING to move his case forward (I've tried to move it along, my attorney has tried, no dice).  He's still paying though (and now an automatic order triggered by his filing requires him to do so).  Still texting the child who hasn't blocked him pretty much every day and still paying.  He never asks to see the kids.  Has not seen or talked to one in a year and has seen the other only for an hour or two twice this year.  The other day he called the one who blocked him from a work number that wasn't blocked multiple times and he texted the one who did not block him 8 times in a row.

Can't figure out if he wants a relationship with the kids, is just trying to keep us all as a Plan B, or just can't make any decisions or move in any direction.  Apologize for not posting on my own thread, but trying to lay a little low.  While I don't think he'd search for me, I get the feeling his OW2 might.

[Anjae]

You seem to have a strange mix of vanisher with texting (and calling) clinger towards the kids. He wants to be in contact with the kids since he text and calls, or tries to.

Other than he wanting to keep in contact with the kids, even if not seeing them, is hard to say what else is going on. 2 years and 8 months is not much in MLC land, but he probably is in a part of his crisis where movement is slow. And for decisions, he may find it difficult to make them.

The  withdrawal you star to see last September may mean he was getting deeper into crisis. This become more foggy when they get deeper into MLC tunnel.

[Unraveled]

Thanks Anjae, I think it is odd from what I've seen.

I think we are actually about 9 years in at this point.  In late 2009 there was an EA which I discovered pretty quickly and gave him an ultimatum and he chose to stay (went underground of course).  We plodded along with monster episodes every 3-6 months.  In late 2013 I got the ILB speech.  I didn't know it then but he was in a PA with OW1 that began then that I didn't learn about until January 2016.  Once again he promised to end it, but you all know how that goes.  That PA (almost 4 years at that point) was over within 2 months of me kicking him out.  He circled in to home for a few months and then started the second PA with OW2 in March of last year.

He was a huge wallower and cake eater until I kicked him out twice in late 2016 at the request of my kids.

So what looks slow now is actually pretty fast compared to the first 7 years.

[Milly]

Unraveled, I agree with Anjae's explanation. I believe your H is in the deeper part of the crisis. I believe mine is, too. Mine has behaved this past year just like yours, withdrawing completely from me, and withdrawing further from the kids, although he still texts one regularly (the one on his side), one off and on with our boy, and the other one he never sees or communicates with. I think this is all part of their crisis. It's the slow phase, or the phase we can 'see' less from the outside, but I believe they are still working through their crisis as they need to do.

It could be they withdraw completely from us because we are the ones that they damaged the most, or the ones who make them feel worse. The kids they still manage to hold onto by a thread. It's as if they know they can't pretend to themselves that the kids never existed, although they're not in a mental place to be a parent.

Doesn't mean anything for us, though. I have no idea what they will be like in a year.

[Rising Phoenix]

I’m hoping it part of the process although a clinging boomerang till last yr h started to withdraw from the children almost immediately. He would only contact if ow wasn’t around. Since ultimatum from ow last yr we have had silence. Kids had Prob 4 texts in 12 mths. Saw them for a couple of weeks in May and June this yr but has cut contact with the kids again. H doesn’t reply to me even in an emergency.
Son was in Hosp and I emailed ( changed no and not allowed it, not even the kids allowed it) nothing! He eventually came to the Hosp and was monster.

Apparently he does different things now and is resigned to never seeing his kids ever again.

My mum says he will resent ow at some point for stopping him seeing his kids and he may, but it is still his choice to not see them. 

I would say he is becoming a vanisher compared to what he was previously unraveled.
I suppose time will tell if he completely cuts of all contact with kids.
My h has cut off all his family and friends. Not a sole person in his world other than ow.
I wonder if this makes him happy as he says he is. Xx

[ChrissYAH]

X has completely ignored my son, he once in awhile will msg my oldest daughter talking $h!te one time he msgd her out of nowhere and asked 'hows mums mental health' the only one he msgs now or has any type of contact is my youngest I think so that he can be kept in the loop he always has been a stick his nose in everyones business type of loon, completely written my children off, I wonder if that has anything to do with his hag or is he just having so much fun in his life he's completely forgotten about my children

[Rising Phoenix]

I wonder that too Chrissyah,

I believe he has no contact with me due to ow and that has an impact on his contact with our kids as I’m in the back ground.
Or his life is so fantastic with his doing different things that he really doesn’t give a sh**te! Xx

[ChrissYAH]

Hello rising! x ran off divorced me and remarried I haven't seen him in 4yrs, he has gotten progressively worse, my daughter tells me he's worse than a teenager clearly lost the plot, very high energy, I don't think he will ever have the balls to ever face me again, not that I ever want to see him again, the hag he's with must be on the same level worse or just a desperate cow who couldn't find anything else willing to be with her, they've both found the prize 

Wonder if he ever does recover what his reaction will be