[Medusa]

Fascinating stuff, S&D.

My first rejection was BD. No surprise. A few days later I tried to hug him and I winced. Ouch. My personal favorite of all the rejections was when I had the bad reaction to antidepressants a few weeks post BD Amd while he came and nominally took care of me, the next day when we decided I wasn't going to kill myself, he hid the ammunition for our weapons and then took OW camping...but first lined up all the camping gear in the garage where I couldn't not see it. BUT, he was "sweet" enough to hug me before he left and say he didn't want anything to happen to me. 

He rejected me when he whined that "no one" would go camping with him, anymore and I said I would love to go. He rejected me when I said I wanted to go flying with him. He constantly rejected every attempt I made to spend time with him as a couple..ultimately saying the day I asked him to leave that he couldn't picture us doing anything together (apart from having sex, I guess).

The night before I asked him to go, we had sex and he got up from the bed when he thought I was asleep
And went into the basement. That was a really tough one, too.

And of course I must mention what I still consider to be his most hilarious statement but what is rejection: telling me to sleep with other men as long as their Pen!$ is smaller than his. That really is the ultimate rejection of a spouse. 

I agree, S&D that the rejection leads to "I don't deserve this", but that's a good thing. His complete disrespect of me as a human being built until I wasn't willing to tolerate being in the same house with him, anymore. It was the culmination of a few months of "I don't deserve this". But I don't necessarily agree its about rejecting the self unless you mean rejecting the current self. I believe, for me, I had to go through what I did in order to find the strength to make him go. I believe, too, that he had to keep upping the rejection ante because he is a coward and wouldn't leave on his own.

[stayed]

Ok, can see that. Everybody has lot's of examples of rejection.   

hugs Stayed

[Songanddance]

I agree, S&D that the rejection leads to "I don't deserve this", but that's a good thing.

It is a good thing for those of us who can see that there is more to life than rejection as it motivates us to look for the good in us without the arrogance. However there are many LBsers on here who berate themselves for not doing this or that. They reject their own feelings and rights in favour of what the MLCer wants.

[stayed]

Yes, I have seen the same thing S&G.  Funny, all the ones that are following this thread are not one of those.  Interesting eh?  I wonder if some of the ones that can't let themselves see it as good thing, will check out this thread?

Hugs Stayed

[calamity]

It is a good thing for those of us who can see that there is more to life than rejection as it motivates us to look for the good in us without the arrogance. However there are many LBsers on here who berate themselves for not doing this or that. They reject their own feelings and rights in favour of what the MLCer wants.

I would say it is very rare for an lbs to 'look for the good' without doing some difficult work to get there. 

Susan Anderson:

...abandonment is a profound enough trauma to implant an invisible drain deep within the self that works insidiously to drain off self-esteem from within. The paradox for abandonment survivors is that no matter what they do to build their self-esteem, the invisible wound of abandonment is always working to drain it away.

[Anjae]

I would say it is very rare for an lbs to 'look for the good' without doing some difficult work to get there. 

Agree. The LBS suffered a great shock. It will require time (often a lot of it) and difficult work to get there. And the LBS will cycle, will also have phases when it is possible to go forward and others when things seem to stagnate or to go back. It is normal. It is we processing, going back to those things we could not deal with before. All will happen in our own time. Rushing anything will not be of help.

Songanddance asked me how do I feel now that I have reached a new stage (no idea what is the name of the stage). I feel like before (before being maybe the last 18-24 months), this is all in the past, but sadly I still need to deal with legal issues. The difference is that I'm trying to backtrack a little on the detachment front since it had went to far and had become detrimental to me.   

[calamity]

The stages of abandonment according to Anderson [from the Journey from abandonment to healing, Chapter one].  Note that the first letters spell 'swirl' in keeping with the cyclic nature of the healing.    
The 5 stages of abandonment

• Shattering
• Withdrawal
• Internalizing
• Rage
• Lifting

I think even Kubler-Ross said that the stages of grief were not followed as a linear process.  We revisit until we are finished.  I am presently rereading the abandonment book because I am coming to terms with the idea that being alone might be permanent.  I could accept as if.

[Anjae]

From HeartTattoo on grief http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=4985.0

(From Varney’s Midwifery, H. Varney, J.M. Kriebs, C.L. Gegor)
The first stage of grief is shock, which is the individual’s initial response to the loss.
The second stage of grief is suffering, the phase of reality.
The third stage of grief is resolution, the phase of establishing new significant relationships.

Shaterring and Shock are pretty much the same thing. So, stage 1?

Withdrawal... I'm with RCR on that one, withdrawal is always present. I know RCR was referring to the MLCer but I think it is also valid for the LBS until our journey is over. So, not so much a stage but something that permeates all, maybe minus the final stage, stages.

Rage/anger, is it a stage? Or does it cross several stages?

I like the 3 stages, being it shock/suffering/resolution or shattering/internalizing/lifting. 3 is simple and they pretty much say it all.

Or maybe 4 shock/internalizing/lifting and resolution? Lifting and resolution being more or less the equivalent of Rebirth and Reintegration. First something lifts, then we resolve?

Withdrawal, rage/anger and depression I think are not stages but can happen within several of the stages.

Don't remember if  Kübler-Ross said it but it makes sense and it matches our experiences. The stages/what we feel/go through is not a linear process. We revisit, we jump until one stage is completely over.

[calamity]

I think you are 'lifted' Anjae!  Except for the legal tie-down.

[Anjae]

Yes, think so.  And even the legal tie-down sounds weirdly lifted. Totally different from when I received that first divorce court case documents.

By then I would keep checking the document, was in distress. Now I send whatever is needed then keep everything, physical or digital out of my sight and do not look at again. Unless I have to for court reasons. It is just like it does not exist.

So, one more stage for me to go, resolution, or am I on the final one?