[Ready2Transform]

Hoss was one who was probably wallowing until SSRI and anti-psychotics were prescribed.  I follow some sites about that as well.  For anyone else wanting the "view from the other side" - here are some people who came out of the drug fog.  It will ring familiar:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1V_y9LX-6WGaD4SfA4IZghBMEM3nqHdUluN2sAidGfzg/edit

[Anjae]

Minus the last, the list is what our MLCers, even without SSRI say

- I love you as a brother / friend / roommate but I'm not in love with you
- I don't know why I married you / I felt out of love many years ago
- possible affairs, gambling, street drug use, divorce
- most users don't  have any insight that their behavior changes are made by drugs.
- most users after several months of withdrawal come back to old self and have serious issues with things they did while on SSRI

SSRI, like most antidepressants, suppress libido. They probably suppress several other things. May cousin was more or less the same with or without normal SSRI. He only start to react well to bupropion (eleontril) a non SSRI med and lamotrigine a med for bipolar. Both comes originally come from neurology.

I've also taken bupropion for my situational depression and had very good results. Bupropion is an atypical antidepressant, it does not fit into any other antidepressants category and, among other things, it does not suppress libido. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bupropion

[onlyjo]

FTT, anjae, R2T, kikki
WOW!
my ex was on paxil and zoloft for about 6 months and BAM, affair/spending money like water/fired from job of 10+ years...
how in the world does one separate MLC from the drug-induced madness? 

are they inextricably linked? 
ex h quit SSRIs cold turkey (R2, you and i have communicated about this)--wonder if he's just decided to stay "in the fog" SSRI's or no? 

[Ready2Transform]

I think that cold turkey thing really has far more of an impact than what anyone wants discussed.  They talk in weeks and months for withdrawal to pass, but I remember reading about a lawyer who took 4.5 years to fully emerge from her SSRI fog - after losing her practice and her marriage. 

It's chicken/egg/chicken-egg biscuit to me.  Maybe they were entering into MLC or some other sort of imbalance and sought help for the symptoms, and after the SSRIs it is worse.  Maybe the SSRIs triggered the crisis.  Or maybe it's all just one big messy glob of neurotransmitter and hormone hell, falling at midlife when they'd be evaluating their lives anyway and experiencing bad thing by coincidence, and especially affecting those with bad childhoods or maturity problems.  Just another piece of the perfect storm we can be the meteorologists for but not the storm chasers.

[Anjae]

how in the world does one separate MLC from the drug-induced madness? 
are they inextricably linked? 

Not to my knowledge. Mr J was not on antidepressants. He had been, briefly, many years before MLC but did not show any of the behaviour MLCer show.

And many MLCers are not on antidepressants. Also, some quit them, yours, Ready2's and others. They do not come out of the fog after they have quit the antidepressants.

Maybe antidepressants can raise the crisis to a high level. But without antidepressants many MLCers have high replay long lasting crisis. And some MLCers seem to respond ok to antidepressants.

I really have no anwser. Except that each person is afffected differently by antidepressants (and the ones mentioned in the article are SSRIs, there are other types of antidepressants) and the crisis itself, antidepressants or no antidepressants.

[Anjae]

It's chicken/egg/chicken-egg biscuit to me.  Maybe they were entering into MLC or some other sort of imbalance and sought help for the symptoms, and after the SSRIs it is worse.  Maybe the SSRIs triggered the crisis.

But this would only apply to those who took SSRI. It does not apply to the ones who did not. And all MLCers had MLC, SSRI or not.

Cold turkey is not a good idea. Often a different, milder med (not a SSRI), is needed when the SSRI is being stop. And one has to lower the dosage slowly, for a lengthy period of time. Otherwise the effects will not be nice.

[Ready2Transform]

But this would only apply to those who took SSRI. It does not apply to the ones who did not. And all MLCers had MLC, SSRI or not.

Not saying that SSRIs are the only cause of crisis, but for those here who took them, I believe in some way it is absolutely a factor.  Just like we can't say childhood abuse is the underlying cause of MLC - many here have MLCers who experienced it, maybe even a disproportionate amount, but not all. And certainly not all who have suffered abuse are destined to enter into crisis. 

Cold turkey is not a good idea. Often a different, milder med (not a SSRI), is needed when the SSRI is being stop. And one has to lower the dosage slowly, for a lengthy period of time. Otherwise the effects will not be nice.

You're tellin' me.

I had a trauma-specializing psychologist tell me as well that when these strong meds are not coupled with a mood stabilizer, they can also trigger mania-like states that can't be controlled until a patient goes back on a drug (like Lithium).  Absolutely none of it is anything to play with.

[kikki]

I've never thought of this before, but because MLCers change so much, and lie about everything - I have to wonder if any of them were taking meds without telling us?

My H raced around like a crazed loon stating that there was nothing wrong with him, and that he wouldn't be taking medication as it would affect his creativity.  A bold statement for someone who apparently had nothing wrong with him, and has supposedly never taken meds.

Thinking about his two psychotic breaks, just before BD - I guess there's a small chance he may have taken antidepressants (and felt the affects), and went cold turkey off them.

OR - he had his emotional/mental implosion without this added factor.

Once again, can someone, somewhere do some research into all of this please 

[Anjae]

They could had been lying but unless antidepressants can be bought without medical prescription, not sure how they would have got them. Mr J had no prescription by the GP or his company doctor. He refused to be given meds. He has also not seen a psychiatrist. SIL insisted he would, he refused.

If Mr J had been buying antidepressants on mine and the doctors back (and no idea how he would do it) he would had told OW1. He wrote her about everything he did or did not. There is nothing about taking antidepressants, just about sleepless nights spends crying. A thing he never told me. He mask the lack of sleep as always had been that way (not true) and the crying as an effect of being so in love with her.

Right, and adult man spends sleepsless nights crying because he is in love. 

My cousin also did not took any meds until he was way into deep depressive mood. Most men are not going to go and buy antidepressants. For me the crisis comes from elsewhere.

Once again, can someone, somewhere do some research into all of this please 

Think that will end up being a LBS.

[Ready2Transform]

Add into the mix the OP who could be slipping them THEIR meds - I know the OW in my case was very involved in discussing it all with Hoss, even though supposedly the affair didn't start until a year and a half later.    Her son was on Adderall, so I'm sure that's the same as a doctorate in psychiatry. /sarcasm