[DaRealist]

This is true...did you ever get angry when she tried to express herself? Or dismiss it? Or tell her it didn't make sense?

Oh yeah.  She tried to express herself a few times.  I mostly dismissed it because she reasoned like a 16 year old.  I just dismissed it because my wife is one of the most intelligent, expressive and passionate GROWN WOMEN i've ever known.  Every blue moon she would say something that sounded like a teenager and I...just...dismissed it.  I beat myself up for a long time not understanding that she was reaching out.  But,

WHO EVER THINKS THEIR WIFE WOULD REGRESS TO BE A CHILD??  The caps aren't for you...they're an indication of my incredible unbelief at this thing called MLC.  Sexual diseases, we know.  Other disorders, we know.  But for a smart, beautiful woman that has spent her life expressing herself so well she's won speech contests and is a sought after speaker to suddenly start reasoning like a 16 year old girl?  I thought she was pulling my leg.

I missed a lot of signs but I forgive myself.  MLC is a train that no one sees coming.  I'm not the first and won't be the last.   

[Zendog]

Communication is always the issue in relationships. I wasn't a good listener but my W wasn't communicating either. I spent a lot of time guess, and guessing wrong. But that's on me. Her share is making me out to be a mind reader and setting expectations for me, not communicating them or changing them.

It's the expectations that are killers. It's what leads to MLC. Those expectations we have of ourselves that this isn't going the way it should, that there's something wrong with this and it's an outside force making me feel this way.

DaRealist, to your point of your W leaving or cheating being emasculating, absolutely it can be. But we as men create those expectations in ourselves that we are less than men if our Ws leave for someone else. We take on that burden as our problem. So we choose to punish ourselves when they leave. It alway lies within us to stop the punishment. It's not easy. But it's our choice. As an added bonus if you stop punishing yourself for things you think you should be better at or mistakes you made, you actually take away and MLCers greatest weapon: that ability to hurt you like no other.

In It, I like your views on things. Gives me different perspectives. I was always like the Shirley McClain of men. Always had women friends. Just as comfortable talking about kids and family and listening as I was about football and cars. Oddly that's part of my problem. I'm interested in a lot of things and able to traverse many grounds with many different people. It sometimes looks like I have no life. But I like it.

[in it]

WHO EVER THINKS THEIR WIFE WOULD REGRESS TO BE A CHILD??

I take no offense at Caps..I use them to place emphasis NOT yell.

This was the only time you dismissed what she was saying? The only time you got angry with her "reasoning"? When this MLC thing hit ..never before that?

[in it]

Here's another thing about the mind reading thing I felt if I HAD TO TELL HIM it meant less for me if he would say or do something.

 I know for me I want to inspire that I don't want to put words in someone elses mouth..how genuine is THAT??

I LOVE men I truly do...not in a destructive way and I have tried to connect it's just not there for me..so I've given up.

Here at least I can see a typed word and know I'm not entirely nuts and that some men DO want to educate themselves and communicate.

You guys have absolutely no idea how much it means to me to know that you do really care about the women you are dealing with.

[DaRealist]

WHO EVER THINKS THEIR WIFE WOULD REGRESS TO BE A CHILD??

I take no offense at Caps..I use them to place emphasis NOT yell.

This was the only time you dismissed what she was saying? The only time you got angry with her "reasoning"? When this MLC thing hit ..never before that?

Yes, considering her MLC started way before I knew it.  It would be random stuff.  It wasn't 24/7 16 year old girl.  It would just be flashes of her.  She'd say or do things that I thought were odd, but because she seemed like my wife most of the time I just ignored it or questioned what the hell was she thinking at that time and then moved on.  No real arguments, but just odd behavior that I didn't recognize until I started thinking backwards.

It's confusing because we talked so much.  About everything.  Except "this", obviously.  A pretty big "this", if you ask me.

[in it]

Yeah no $h!te it was a pretty big THIS.

It's hard when you realize something may have been wrong in hindsight. But put yourself in that position now. Would you have done ANYTHING DIFFERENT?

Would you have sat her down and took her hands in yours looked her in the eyes and expressed some concern or caring..empathy, compassion. Or was it easier just to dismiss it because it was too uncomfortable to deal with?


It's the expectations that are killers. It's what leads to MLC. Those expectations we have of ourselves that this isn't going the way it should, that there's something wrong with this and it's an outside force making me feel this way.

And this is TRUE! We are human beings and we have a cetain degree of expectation. Not neccesily for "good behavior" or "being right" and getting a pat on the head.
Our world is an intimate place for us and it is GODDAMN HARD not to take this all personally.

Honestly I don't know how in the hell a mutually beneficial healthy relationship exists with out  SOME expectation.. I just got done saying this on my thread.

I simply refuse to buy into it. There's nothing wrong with me..or maybe there is because I say there isn't.

Just because I say it with conviction doesn't mean that isn't someone elses opinion.

They and I have the option to simply not deal with it as two adults do. Agree to disagree.

[DaRealist]

Yeah no $hit it was a pretty big THIS.

It's hard when you realize something may have been wrong in hindsight. But put yourself in that position now. Would you have done ANYTHING DIFFERENT?

Would you have sat her down and took her hands in yours looked her in the eyes and expressed some concern or caring..empathy, compassion.

Of course!!!  A thousand times YES!

[in it]

OK so you have changed but she isn't open to it. YET.

That still may happen but may take a long time!

Now here's a bigger question:

Is it just EGO that makes you want her back?

 The thought of being able to "win" her heart again?

[DaRealist]

Is it just EGO that makes you want her back?

 The thought of being able to "win" her heart again?

Absolutely NOT.  My ego wants to leave her in the dust.  I want her back because I love her, I love my family and will do everything I can to get us all back under the same roof.  I miss her as my wife and I miss her as my best friend.  I DO NOT believe who she is right now is who she really is.  I think deep down she is screaming for help.  My wife and children deserve my very best effort.  And they deserve for me to die to myself (not my Self, but my ego).

[in it]

You are VERY sure about this? It's not because she's involved with another man? ( if she is)

I'm not saying just a smidgen of this isn't warranted but it can't be the whole reason.

And I am glad to read that you are willing to humble yourself in regards to your ego taking a backseat. Or dying off in the parts that are needed.

This is what needs to happen. Painful at best.