[KeepItTogether]

" From my experience if my H had let me go a long time ago, and stop pressuring me, begging, and pleading and just let go I possibly would have experienced my awakening sooner than I did."

I wish EVERY LBS would read that statement!  I've heard this from 3 different MLCer's now.

You need to let them go!
Thank you, den.

Such a simple statement, letting them go. And yet, I find myself struggling with how to implement it, especially with a S10 and a stage 5 Clinger. I've definitely stopped  pressuring, begging, and pleading. I guess, just do the 180? With a child who adores his dad, it's a little tricky. Any advice on how to "let it go" under those circumstances?

Thanks Den!

[StormChaser]

Thanks Den for the insights. It's helping me on my journey and so many others.

KiT. All I can say is that turning my attention to being the lighthouse and being steady and strong and a good dad and being the person I want to be has made me feel good about where things are at. If half of what Den remembers is going on in my W's head, I'm looking like a rock star to her right now even though I'm just being me. And it feels good to just be me, and not trying to be anything for her or worry about the future of the M or what's going on in her head. I can't imagine what's going on in there, so why bother...

That's whats helped me detach, feeling good about me and who I am.

[denjef31]

Okay, I truly feel all of your pain as an LBS myself. Having said that I am going to be honest and play devil's advocate here. I want to make you all aware that yes, this is a terrible things are spouses are doing to us. The betrayal, abandonment, deceit, affair, and lies are unbearable. It hurts like hell!! So my question to you who are struggling with what I and many others who have experienced this nasty depression/MLC this is to you!! What can you do to stop the pain? What can you do to stop this train from running off the track? NOTHING!!!!!!! The only thing you can do is remove yourself out of harm's way.

I love my spouse just like you love your spouse, yet I did those same thing to my spouse. I hurt him in the worst way, I can never truly forgive myself for it. I do not like talking about it because I find it very repulsive and disgusting to think about it sometimes. There is an enormous awareness and guilt that comes with the bad behavior you are seeing. Some spouses will be very verbal and show that guilt at times, and others will bury themselves further in running behavior.  Despite what you see, what you hear, please know they are miserable in the inside looking for peace. This possibly torments them more than you.

There are some stories on here that I do not believe are MLC. The giveaway that it is MLC is the running behavior and the utter confusion and indecision we experience in depression. One minute we are considering coming back to the marriage, the next day we made up our minds we are better off with OW/OM. The next day we are thinking again and haven't made up our mind. I cycled throughout my depression. I would make love to my H and had made up my mind that I was going to recommit to my marriage. Next few hours OM text me and want to spend some time with me, take me out and boom I had decided that quickly and easily nope I am done with H. It really is a going back and forth in our head constantly. You may think they are having fun and have made up their mind because they seem to be pretty sure from what you see that they have made the right decision but internally nothing could be further from the truth.

You cant run behind them, as it only adds fuel to the fire and further cements their decision to remain hidden. I noticed when H would pressure and pursue me I was off  running. Running into OM's web. H would get discouraged and back off then I would run to him make love and I wanted him back. As soon as I was secure that he was still inlove with me and wanted me back as his wife, I took off confident as ever. RE-READ that!!! He stop pursuing, I then pursued. If you do not detach you will show them exactly what you do not want them to know. They need to feel the loss of you. They need to feel you have let go, they need to feel you are not there waiting in the wings. They need to feel they have passed the threshold of what you will accept and put up with.

It is cruel but also so easy to betray someone when you feel that no matter what you do to them they will always be there. They will put up with and allow anything because they just want you back. So as an MLC'er we think like this " My H loves me and he always will. If I want him I can always go back to him. However, OM is so nice to me, treats me very nice, and I enjoy spending time with him. I have to see where this goes as he might be the one for me, but I might blow it and he might end it so I have to take this chance. I have to end things with H so I can give 100% to OM, if it doesn't work out I can always go back to H, but I am not confident or certain that OM will be there waiting for me."

They are sure they have YOU,  and not sure they have OM/OW. The adrenaline and hormones to secure OW/OM is what drives the behavior you are seeing. You take away that confidence, you stop fueling that thinking and you take back your power. DETACH, DETACH, DETACH!!!!! Some of you are in front row seat waiting for the next installment of the soap opera that is going on with your spouse. Please just stop it as it will be very difficult and painful for you to get past the betrayal. Some things are better off not being known to you. Stop waiting and looking for clues as to where your spouse is at with MLC. Yes, I did this too as LBS but the obsession I had with trying to get answers prevented me from seeing what I already knew.

It was not until I said "Fu$% it, I am done" and I meant it did I start seeing changes in my H. I said it many times to him out of anger, hoping he would wake up and realize what he was losing. When I truly detached, and didn't care what happened I just wanted to get to a place of peace he noticed. He felt the shift, the change and he started coming to me all on his own. He told me he still loved me and that was in August and he has been cycling towards me and we have been reconnecting ever since. As a LBS and as a MLC/Depressed person the shift matters. The point of detachment is what you all should be striving for and working really hard to obtain not only for your marriage, but for yourself.

You hate hearing the word detach, because you don't want to do it. You don't see how that matters, or that it will help you but it most definitely will help you. It is the only thing that will help you. Some spouses are gone, vanished into thin air....poof! So you don't think this applies to you as you don't see or hear from them anyway but it applies to you as well. If you don't get a handle on your emotions, handle the betrayal and start taking care of yourself...your spouse MLC will eat you alive. Take years from your life as you remain stuck wondering what if? how could they?

Don't do it!!!! Let go and let god.


Denjef31

[No expectations]

Again, thank you Denjaf.  I am learning to love ME.  And doing things I want to do.  I don't initiate any contact w H.  I have told him, he can come back when and if he is ready to truly commit and work on US, and if I'm still ready as well.  Do you think I should tell him I don't want contact w him until or unless?  I think we are at a good point, he keeps reaching out to me, however I know OW is still in the picture.  He says they just talk but I am very doubtful, I don't see why that would be the case.

Thanks

[denjef31]

Again, thank you Denjaf.  I am learning to love ME.  And doing things I want to do.  I don't initiate any contact w H.  I have told him, he can come back when and if he is ready to truly commit and work on US, and if I'm still ready as well.  Do you think I should tell him I don't want contact w him until or unless?  I think we are at a good point, he keeps reaching out to me, however I know OW is still in the picture.  He says they just talk but I am very doubtful, I don't see why that would be the case.

Thanks

No I do not think you should implement no contact. I am not an advocate for it, and I think it hinders reconnection. He is reaching out to you because he is cycling, he has not made up his mind, and he still deep down knows he still cares for you deeply. He is lying about OW to protect you. Yes, in perfect world to protect you would be stop doing things that hurt you but it is not that easy in MLC world. If he came clean about every stinking thing he is or has done he probably feels there would be no coming back as you would not be able to forgive him and any chance of reconciliation would be lost in his confession.

Do not talk about OW, as you will only get more lies. You keep being a happy, kind spouse in spite of what he is showing you.


Denjef31

[Watcher]

You have delivered Gold again Denjef. I am at that F*ck it, I'm done point. I have to admit, it took me time, but I have had enough of her sh!t.

I see a lot of my W in what you write. The cycling back and forth that she does with me. Using sex to keep me in place.  She is too comfortable. My family has told me many times that she has no fear. They say she believes that I will never leave her. She can do as she pleases. Your correct.

Now I have bumbled my way threw her mlc, I admit. I left home Oct 16th because I told her that I had enough. I'm not talking to her. She's not talking to me. We had one school function together and she sent me a few emails, whining and monstering. She complains that we don't have sex and wants to know basically how am I meeting my needs.

We did not spend this past Thanksgiving together. She did not invite me and I did leave the house for behavioral issues afterall.  Now she says that I don't love her or the kids. Maybe she needs to feel more of this angst.

She has to chase me. I'm done making this easy on her. I'm not shutting her out but she has to finally see that I am serious. I can move on without her and I know that I will be fine. Now she has to feel it.

As usual your posts are much appreciated, Thank you.

[No expectations]

Thanks Denjaf.  I do not ask about OW, I know it would only cause lies.  It already did.  Twice he promised no contact, and twice he was caught in it.  Once before he moved out, once after.  I am done asking.  I did tell him, he'll know he's ready when he's ready to give up all contact with her.  And that was the last time we talked about it, at least a few weeks ago.  I also told him, he will need to be very transparent w his phone etc when he comes home. 

We will probably start back in counseling after the first of the year.  I can wait and see what he has to say then.  Until then, I can continue to be ME and enjoy finding myself again.

I really appreciate all your help and support.  I hate that you're going through this, on the LBS side, after all you went through already.  I hate that we ALL are going through this.

[denjef31]

You have delivered Gold again Denjef. I am at that F*ck it, I'm done point. I have to admit, it took me time, but I have had enough of her sh!t.

I see a lot of my W in what you write. The cycling back and forth that she does with me. Using sex to keep me in place.  She is too comfortable. My family has told me many times that she has no fear. They say she believes that I will never leave her. She can do as she pleases. Your correct.

Now I have bumbled my way threw her mlc, I admit. I left home Oct 16th because I told her that I had enough. I'm not talking to her. She's not talking to me. We had one school function together and she sent me a few emails, whining and monstering. She complains that we don't have sex and wants to know basically how am I meeting my needs.

We did not spend this past Thanksgiving together. She did not invite me and I did leave the house for behavioral issues afterall.  Now she says that I don't love her or the kids. Maybe she needs to feel more of this angst.

She has to chase me. I'm done making this easy on her. I'm not shutting her out but she has to finally see that I am serious. I can move on without her and I know that I will be fine. Now she has to feel it.

As usual your posts are much appreciated, Thank you.

Bravo Watcher!!!

By goly you got it! What you are doing is exactly what she needs. You have dropped the rope and now she has to figure out how to pick up the pieces and solve the puzzle! She is definitely worried about you moving on by the questions she is asking. Keep being aloof with her, she will keep coming out of her shell as she will not want to lose the golden egg.

Keep me updated on what you are seeing and hearing. I am ready to do the happy dance for you!

Denjef31

[denjef31]

Thanks Denjaf.  I do not ask about OW, I know it would only cause lies.  It already did.  Twice he promised no contact, and twice he was caught in it.  Once before he moved out, once after.  I am done asking.  I did tell him, he'll know he's ready when he's ready to give up all contact with her.  And that was the last time we talked about it, at least a few weeks ago.  I also told him, he will need to be very transparent w his phone etc when he comes home. 

We will probably start back in counseling after the first of the year.  I can wait and see what he has to say then.  Until then, I can continue to be ME and enjoy finding myself again.

I really appreciate all your help and support.  I hate that you're going through this, on the LBS side, after all you went through already.  I hate that we ALL are going through this.

 Who is suggesting counseling? If you are, don't ask anymore about counseling. Some MLC'er will go through the motion of counseling to shut you up but they already feel it wont work, because deep down they know they are not ready to stop their behavior. Before I was depressed I kept asking my H to go to counseling to resolve communication issues and he never wanted to go. Once I was in full blown depression, I withdrew physically and emotionally and it was him who wanted to go and I was totally against it. He would set up appts I would say I was going but I made excuses and I never went.

Go into counseling hopeful, but have an openmind that you may not get the benefits you hoped to see. Do not be discouraged by it though, MLC just takes time and MLC' er has to see and experience things their way and on their terms not ours.

[No expectations]

Denjaf,

It was initially my idea for H to go, this was before I realized the extent of MLC.  This was after I discovered the EA w OW, and h was telling me how broken he felt.  I suggested the therapist we'd been to quite a while ago.  Once he reached out to her, he started going to IC eagerly.  After a few sessions, I also went to IC.  Then, at his suggestion, I started going w him, not really MC, more like I was there for his IC.  He thought (and the therapist thought) that it would help us to communicate.  We did this a couple times, then the therapist went out on medical leave.  H has said he couldn't wait until after the first of the year, when she returns, to go back.  I think he realizes it is helping HIM.  We haven't gotten to the point that it is about US, he's not ready for that and I do understand that.  If he chooses to return, it's up to him, and it will continue to be about him as long as he needs/wants it.

Thanks