[Disillusioned]

I know several MLCers who moved out and divorced, and remarried who are back with their original spouses. My dad was a Vanisher and he and my mom reconciled.

I have a friend who just reconciled after 4 years MLC. I have an MLC girlfriend who left her spouse six years ago, she has had a series of OM and the only thing she really wants is her H back (he’s a no.)
I have another MLC girlfriend who left her H six years ago and she told me the other day (she is in a serious relationship) that she wished her H “could have only held on a little longer) - by 2.5 years he began dating and moving on...

So, while it may be true that the odds are better if a spouse remains home, in all the MLC cases I personally know of except one, the MLCer has wanted to return home, though many of their spouses had moved on. I also know a couple of walk away spouses and there has been zero interest in getting back together with their partners, but their behavior and attitudes were clearly different from the MLC examples I give above.

I know I am likely in the minority, but I still believe that if an MLCer navigates their crisis, allows themselves to hit rock bottom and then is willing to do their personal work, they will regret leaving and blowing up their marriages - regardless of whether they want to reconcile.

That's a lot of MLC!!!   

[Not Applicable]

But maybe we are just looking at the MLCer's point of view.. Maybe it makes no difference for my H if he had stayed or not.. But it has made a difference to me.. Maybe it's because I have a very practical mind most of the time.. And what I see is my H treated me very badly for 7 months, then he abandoned me and blamed me for everything. He's currently a stranger who lives in another country and is engaged to OW.. This wouldn't be the situation if he had stayed home but he didn't.. All the actions since he left drove me to a place of acceptance and a wish to move on.. So reconciliation is no longer an option... If we were still living together (hard as it would be), I will feel there's a way back.. But with the current situation, I don't.. But that's just me!

Exactly. And I think most people would think the way you do. He left. That normally is a sign that someone doesn't want to continue with you, that the marriage is over, so why would you want him back?

If this site did not push the agenda of standing during an MLC, if it didn't tell people that their spouse might come back after leaving, after divorcing, whatever, would people actually be sitting here and saying that leaving is better than staying? I doubt it. Because it is just not logical or intuitive to think that way. Leaving DOES mean something, divorce DOES mean something, MLC or not. I think it is denial to use MLC as an excuse to discount the significance of these actions on the part of the person who chooses to leave. Look at how many people are telling SS she is giving them hope. The reason people believe that they might get their spouse back and even want them back is because they are being told it can happen. It's a form of cultlike brainwashing in my opinion.

Yes, an MLCer can monster and be emotionally detached, but a spouse at home, even if he is just paying the bills and the like, is being responsible and spouselike at some level. An MLCer who leaves or divorces you is engaging in complete abandonment and I really don't see how someone like that is reconciliation or remarriage material, to be perfectly honest.

Look, it's easy to fall for the stuff that people tell you on this site in the beginning but after a few years into your spouse's MLC, a person should have developed their own perspective and thoughts on the situation, especially their OWN situation. I worry if someone is NOT questioning what they are taught at that point. Then they aren't facing reality.

[Not Applicable]

The most important factor in our situation that facilitated healing in M and F is the fact that he never left,

Thunder, I think you need to re-read this line in Acorn's thread.

I also would remind everyone Acorn was not in this forum during her H's worst monstering. He probably was just as bad as any other monster we just were not privy to it. I am sure he did as much damage as any other and I bet she reacted to his monstering before learning to zip her lips. I think her appearance in this forum at a late date in the process gives people a rather warped view of her experience and even her own actions. By time she arrived here, she probably had learned from making mistakes that you are glossing over. And I say this because I am pretty sure she will agree with me. 

[3Boys4Me]

If that “criteria” is the case NYM, than only stay at home MLCers are worthy of reconciliation or remarriage - in my experience that just simply isn’t the case.  If an MLCer does the work, wants to reconcile and the former spouse is willing and able to join them in that effort, than good for them; their success story and recommitment should be honored and celebrated IMO. I’m in awe of the strength my mom displayed in rebuilding a relationship and marriage with my dad, the 30 years they had together after so many years apart brought tremendous joy to them, my siblings and me, and their many grand children and now great grandchildren. My dad didn’t just leave, he was a Vanisher and he abandoned us financially, but my mom helped him find his way back home and forgave him completely.

[Treasur]

And imho that's why it matters so much to respect that LBS make different choices as they progress and that MLC spouses are not always a one size fits all as things progress either. As long as any LBS is taking care of their own sanity and wellbeing appropriately, it's really not my place to judge their choices. Stander or not, divorced or not, physically present spouse or not.

[Not Applicable]

3 Boys- I don't see any point in debating this or getting offended because someone sees this differently than you do, because this is absolutely a personal decision each person has to make. If my H had moved out 3.5 years ago, I would have gotten a divorce and remarried long ago. If he wanted a future with me, I made it very clear he couldn't cross that red line and he respected that. A long distance marriage even for say, work reasons, would not be acceptable to me at all. There are things that for me are essential for my marriage and that is my right to have those things. Every person has to decide what they consider to be disrespect and abandonment. Allowing others to brainwash you into doing something that is not good for you is not good for your mental health. (Edit-I wrote the above before I saw Treasur's post but I agree with what she says)

You can throw out all the catch phrases about the marriage ending at BD, blah blah blah. Or that divorce is just a piece of paper. MLC forums like this come with a lot of catch phrases and advice that gets repeated over and over. But let's just look at it in a really simple way, living with a stay at home MLCer is just going through a difficult time in our marriages. A difficult time, that if they never leave, eventually is likely to get better. If they do leave, well then they have left and the marriage is over. Anything beyond that really is just making it more complex than it needs to be.

[3Boys4Me]

In your opinion NYM, in your opinion. So often when I read your posts, I am aware that you state things from a single perspective as if they are fact, often when other people’s direct experiences contradict your statements. I am suggesting that you are an example of one, and your repeated efforts to suggest that anyone else who sees things differently must be wrong. Your experience isn’t wrong, it just is. As is everyone else’s. Moreover this forum specifically began to support standers, it has grown and blossomed since then, but your very narrow view suggests it should be for standers who’s MLCers live at home, RCR herself would then, by that measure, not qualify.

My memory could be in error, but weren’t you just strongly advocating for debate on another thread?  Why so defensive?

[Seahorse]

Though my H was/is a live-in MLCer, he imploded our marriage and family. 
I think some do it with a nuclear head, others with a thousand grenades.  The result is the same.  Nothing left of M or family. 

The most important factor in our situation that facilitated healing in M and F is the fact that he never left, though he was thoroughly tempted. That was the line he would not cross.  I saw and heard him struggle with the urge to the point of torment.  By God’s grace, he did not cross that self-imposed line. 

Just my 2 cents’, based on a sample of one. 

Acorn - then does that mean my chance of healing M and F is less because mine DID leave, and divorced me?  No anger, just a question.

Sea

[Thunder]

"I think her (Acorn) appearance in this forum at a late date in the process gives people a rather warped view of her experience and even her own actions."

Acorn what say you?  Do you think you are giving people a "warped" view of your experience?
I certainly don't want to speak for you.

[Sam I Am]

I personally believe if there is any chance of reconciliation it all starts with the LBS.  What do we do during this time.  I am not there this is just my thoughts based on what I have read.

The LBS who gets his/her crap together has a better chance no matter the type of MLCer….even the vanisher.

By getting their crap together, I mean:

They start by taking care of themselves, their family, the house, the animals....whatever was left in their hands.
They learn, learn, learn.
They don't nag, cry, scream or be mean, vindictive, sarcastic.
They learn to let the anger go.
They learn how to forgive others actions.
They learn how to protect themselves.
They learn how to stand up for themselves and for what is right and fair no matter what has been done to them.  They do it without anger or personal vendetta.

They grow.
They take the best of themselves and make it better.
They find the bad parts that are fixable and improve on them.
They learn patience.
They learn to not need to have control in every situation.
They learn to appreciate blessings of all sizes and shapes.

They become confident.

Basically...they become the best person they can be and they do it for themselves.   I could go on and on....but in all the different sites and forums out there (that I have been exposed to)...they all have the same basic message.

1.  Mirror work/Be the best person you can be/focus on yourself, etc.
2.  Don't focus on MLCer.  Do something with your life.  GAL, etc
3.  Let the MLCer start convos….especially relationship convos.
4.  Learn to treat the MLCer with grace.
5.  Let time run it's course.  Won't happen in a few hours, days or weeks.  Get ready for a long haul.
6.  The only thing you can control in life is yourself and how you act, react, etc.

If you do the opposite of these things, you are just digging a bigger hole and chasing the spouse away.  Don't dig that hole deeper and take away chances.
It is all your choice to try to not.  To stand or not.  It is up to each one of us to decided what we are going to do in any given second of our lives.