[FindingJoJo]

Funny actually spelling it out even if I did repeat a few times helped me to be more clear about why I forgive him....lol

[superdog]

Is there really any merit in showing this to the MLCer. One that is out of replay ?

SD
x

[OldPilot]

Is there really any merit in showing this to the MLCer. One that is out of replay ?

SD
x

First of all - how do you know they are out of REPLAY?

I would suggest that showing it to them before the crisis is over, that means complete reconciliation is
controlling and NOT what you should do.

[superdog]

Hi OP

Ow appears to be gone. No replay behaviours surfacing from what I can see. He is expressing that he is aware of the damage and its his fault. Major depression kicked in. What else should I look for to say out of replay?

Sd
X

Edit - will answer on your thread - OldPilot
http://mlcforum.theherosspouse.com/index.php?topic=2977.msg186257#msg186257

[Howmanytimes]

I wish I could be sure that my H felt remorse. 

He is a very deep person and has lied in the past.  He was also in an affair with OW for six years.  He says he is sorry etc. and I believe he feels guilty but whether he feels remorse is another thing.  I don't believe I will ever know the answer to that question.

[stayed]

Might I ask, then how are you ABLE to remain with him?  I simply could not have stayed with my h if I had never seen TRUE REMORSE.  I simply would have been unable to FORGIVE HIM.  I don't care how "deep" he is, or private, he B E T R A Y E D you.  This isn't just about sex, heck, I honestly wouldn't have given a tinker if he had simply been having it off, with the dumb bunny.  It was the lying, sneaking, disrespect, withdrawal of love, support, appreciation, LOYALTY.  That was the REAL issue. 

My h's defection taught me that I could live ALONE.  That I was not dependent on him for anything.  I learned that if he could not be a totally loving, devoted h who was capable of dropping his pride for my benefit to REASSURE me, that he was aware of how badly he had screwed up, then I would/could live without him.  He taught me that.  He taught me that LOVE is not ENOUGH!  Marriage is much, much more then LOVE. 

I expect if one does not make it very clear about what they MUST have in order to rebuild a life with MLC returner, then one will not get it. 

Hugs Stayed

[Howmanytimes]

Hi Stayed

I suppose because deep down I love him very much.  I tell myself that if it happens again then I will have to end it.  I hope that I will have the strength to follow through and do just that.

I am soused to living with him and feel so attached to him.  I have known him nearly all my adult life.  Tat is why it hurt so much when he did what he did.  I almost had a breakdown.  For the first time I really did come very close to ending up going nuts and ending up being committed.  When I look back I find that rather worrying.  When I look back at how I behaved.

I suppose we are all different in how we cope.  I think most people in my shoes would have filed for divorce.  Part of me almosts feels ashamed at myself for not doing so.

When you think that for six years he was having an affair then you get some idea of the deceit involved on his part.  That is why I know that I will never really know him.  During that time we were actually getting on really well and he treated me well.  It was only the last year that he stopped wanting to sleep with me.  I don't know what that tells you.  I would say that he had become more close to her but according to him the last two years he wanted to end it but was afraid of her telling me because she is a bunny boiler. 

Part of me thinks that he must have some kind of personality disorder to be capable of such deceit.  That is why I say I will never know for sure what he is thinking.  He tells me he loves me And is sorry and feels guilty but I cannot say I believe him 100% because of the extent of his deceit.

hugs to you too Stayed.

[stayed]

Howmanytimes, I am going to post your entire posting and respond within it, in blue.  I am concerned that you might not have been doing your homework.  As many of the comments you have stated, you will not have done so, if you had read the ARTICLES.  We are here to SUPPORT you my dear, not criticize you.  We will not judge you and hopefully we will be able to help you understand that nobody else, friends, family or children should judge you either. 

Here we go!

Hi Stayed/Hi Howmanytimes

I suppose because deep down I love him very much.  I tell myself that if it happens again then I will have to end it.  I hope that I will have the strength to follow through and do just that.
We all love our spouses.

I am soused to living with him and feel so attached to him.  I have known him nearly all my adult life.  Tat is why it hurt so much when he did what he did.  I almost had a breakdown.  For the first time I really did come very close to ending up going nuts and ending up being committed.  When I look back I find that rather worrying.  When I look back at how I behaved.
From what I have read about your situation, you became aware of a huge character change in your h 7 years ago.  It seems he began meeting with "prostitutes" or some such.  MLC brings about HUGE changes in a person.  It begins slowly, gradually increasing in intensity and frequency with inappropriate behaviour, moodiness, anger, awareness of physical health, change in style (cloths, hair), often take up new taste in music, movies.  Sexual behaviour often changes as well.  Increased interest in pornography, more adventurous sexual activities etc.  Severe mood swings, happy, sad, carefree, morose, angry... etc.  sometimes, all in one day.  Life become pretty uncomfortable and you find yourself walking on eggshells.  Generally, at some point an Other Person is discovered, not always mind you, but more often then not.

I suppose we are all different in how we cope.  I think most people in my shoes would have filed for divorce.  Part of me almosts feels ashamed at myself for not doing so.
My dear lady, you have joined a forum of over 900 people (men and women) who have been treated just as disrespectfully as you, and NONE of us have FILED for DIVORCE.  I would go so far as to say, most where divorce has been filed, was done so by our/their MLCer.   This is a forum, that truly wishes to SALVAGE marriages.  No need to feel any shame about not having done so... NOT HERE!  We totally get why you didn't/haven't!

When you think that for six years he was having an affair then you get some idea of the deceit involved on his part.  That is why I know that I will never really know him.  During that time we were actually getting on really well and he treated me well.  It was only the last year that he stopped wanting to sleep with me.  I don't know what that tells you.  I would say that he had become more close to her but according to him the last two years he wanted to end it but was afraid of her telling me because she is a bunny boiler.

You knew something wasn't right.  You may never have believed your h was capable of deceiving for 6 years, but it happens. My h was in crisis a long time before he had his affair.  I did not wish to believe that my h was cheating on me either.  That is normal. When I look back, can we say DENIAL much???  I am embarrassed to admit,  cheating on me, just never once occurred to me.  I think I simply did not want to believe my h was capable of that.   

Part of me thinks that he must have some kind of personality disorder to be capable of such deceit.  That is why I say I will never know for sure what he is thinking.  He tells me he loves me And is sorry and feels guilty but I cannot say I believe him 100% because of the extent of his deceit.

Duh...  yes, your h does have a personality disorder, it is called MID LIFE CRISIS.  Do the reading my dear girl.  Your h has all the traits.  Of course he lies and much, much worse. 

As for remorse, my dear lady, until he is completely out of his crisis and totally recommitted to you, he is not going to be trustworthy.  You will not be able to believe a single word out of his mouth, and I don't think you will really want to know what he is thinking.  It is just too crazy to comprehend.

Do the reading Howmanytimes.  Educate yourself.  You will be amazed at the RELIEF it will provide.  Understanding is half the battle.  It will not solve your problem but at least any decisions you make once you have educated yourself, will be made from KNOWLEDGE not knee jerk reaction.

hugs Stayed

[itsonlyme]

I  noticed a change in my H over 7 years ago .  i put it down to him losing  his mother, father and brother all within 2 years .
He works away from home Monday to Friday and i only saw him at the weekends ,even then he started to go out by himself to the football  and drinking with his new friends .  I was definitely in denial  that something was far wrong with him and our marriage . We had always been together , I think  at that time  i was a real mess emotionally and i allowed him to distance himself from me 

Then in Aug 2009 i discovered the secret phone  . He had been having an affair with a woman that he had met through his new friends . He dumped the OW almost immediately ,  was really sorry , bought me flowers every week , answered all questions about his adultery and we limped along for the next 3 years (remember i only saw him at the weekends )  I always thought that something was quite not right but couldn't put my finger on it.

Then in August 2012  i could feel a change in him again .  He got out of bed one morming , told me that it was inevitable that we were going to split up  and that every time he saw me he felt guilty , hated himself, was a loser ,wasn't in love with me and that he thought that he would be better of by himself.  i asked him if there was an OW  . He  denied this also in front of our grown up children .

I  thought that he was depressed and started researching  discovered he is MLC
He is still at home and i try to detach from him as much as possible .  I dont know what stage he is at . He sits and watchs TV most of the day when he is here, goes out with his friend every now and then .  The reason that i posted is thati can see that its still all about him 7 years on . When i read the guilt vs remorse, i recognise that he feels guilt  and shame.but  i haven't seen or felt any remorse from him.
He is still angry with me , doesnt contact me at all during the week.

I wish that i had found this site 3 years ago,  i would have dealt with him and her differently .
What i find hard to understand is why did he not tell me all of this 3 years ago when he was with OW.

[Guanacowife]

This was such an eye opener.  For my H it is all about him.  Before I had confirmation about the OW I would get upset and sometimes cry when he would constantly go out.  He would get very angry at that.  Now I know it was because it stirred up feelings of guilt inside of him.  He has not yet reached remorse yet and I am not sure if he ever will.  I've lost almost 40 lbs since the affair began.  At first it was because he was spending all his money on her and not leaving me with any to buy food, after it was an inability to eat or keep food down once I found out about her.  He is constantly telling me now to eat and gain weight.  After reading this I realize it isn't because he cares about me and my health, but is worried about how others are perceiving him because of it.