[hawk]

ps , and thanks to Onward btw, that was nice to hear but eh , not a drama , really. Just another typical jump in on a one post thing without the rest of the picture .
Stayed you really gotta do some reading if your gonna go on a run about somebody , get the whole story first you know.

Sadly l see more and more lately, why people talk so much about not actually being able to talk where they should be able to, without being raced off into God knows what.

Well, that's enough bs for me 

[Thunder]

hawk, you are so right.

I don't see you are being down or depressing to be around.  I find you quite delightful.   

My main reasons for not wanting to remarry my X is personal.  It has nothing to do with him,  It's more me.
I've been married before, had my children.  I just don't see the point in it anymore.  I didn't when I married my H, but is was important to him.

I feel at this time in my life I don't need marriage to make me happy.  I can be happy in a relationship without the rings.
I'm not saying I don't want a "committed" relationship. I do...but the vows are just not necessary.
I want someone to be with me because they want to, not because they promised to.

[Reallytrying]

Lisa - I honestly don't think standing vs non-standing is what determines weak, lazy, insecure, or whatever. I have met those people in all categories just as I have met those who are strong, healthy whatever. I think painting with a broad brush is never productive.

I do find your post is quite condescending towards those of us who choose to stand. I can't imagine why my interest in saving my marriage would mean I am in denial. I am perfectly clear about the situation I find myself in. I'm also perfectly clear on who my h was and is now. I don't sugar coat any of what I've endured. I've also grown in leaps & bounds over the past few years. None of that changes my desire to reconcile my marriage.

Hawk - I have never experienced you as negative! I too am proud of how both you and your w have patented your d.  Keep laughing and the right lady (you know I'm still hoping its w) will show up.

[Ready2Transform]

I feel at this time in my life I don't need marriage to make me happy.  I can be happy in a relationship without the rings.
I'm not saying I don't want a "committed" relationship. I do...but the vows are just not necessary.
I want someone to be with me because they want to, not because they promised to.

Really love this, Thunder. I don't see marriage ever again in my future either, even with Hoss if he were to heal. Divorce is expensive!    Hoss was more amped to marry than I was, too. Neither of us wanted kids (though he's probably changed his tune on that now that he's going to be a 'step grandpa') but after ten years together, I think he wanted a change and this was the quickest way to accomplish it. Lots of outside pressure to finally take the plunge, and I guess it made sense because I thought we'd be together forever (didn't we all?). But I don't feel pulled to find a permanent partner at all. If it happens, that's nice, but I'd rather just have relationships on my own terms.

[hawk]

Haha thanks Thunder and RT but l don't know negative or depressing or whatever it was , didn't see it tbh sorry. But eh , l'm dyslexic and l can't just read and read and read, it has to involve sex or money or something good before l can get through something too long, that way l can focus, yaknow

[Trustandlove]

I would like to agree with Onward -- standing doesn't mean that we don't feel angry or betrayed, it doesn't mean blame-shifting, it doesn't mean we're afraid.  It means we've felt all that and worked through it all. 

I'm sad that implication that non or even anti-standers have is that standers are weak, I don't think that's the case at all. 

I don't choose to divorce (given the choice), I don't choose to have another man, that doesn't make me weak or afraid.  (in my case divorce doesn't help me at all, I recognise it may be different for others) I do look at my H and his actions with open eyes, I don't actively put myself in the way of what I called "shrapnel", I work hard to protect myself and my children. 

I deal with what is.   I can't change my H's responses, but I can change what he responds to, and that does work.   

I disagree with the thought or implication that standers don't stand up for themselves.  Standing doesn't mean being a doormat, that is one of the first lessons taught here.    As a matter of fact, we find ourselves standing up for our own beliefs perhaps more so than those who choose another way.

I want to respect everyone's well-considered choices, this has always been a safe place for everyone to get their own head in order.   

And I also agree with RCRs statement that they may well be fewer divorces if more people took a stand. 

[poussin]

Hello

I'm a long term stander, I don't read all the threads so I don't understand what is going on, but I would like to comment.

Standing is a personal choice and implies that I'm not entitled to blame anyone for choosing to stand. Even when it turns out that standing was not the right option. So it is my responsability.
And there is no one who can make me feel different.

I come to this site to find support, because standing is hard, but I think it is also hard not to stand.

We all suffer from pain, grieve, anger, guilt, love ... you name it, we've all encountered all these feelings in some point.
I still experience all these feelings every day because I'm still in love with this man, I want to nurrish my memories, I want to be angry, ... it makes me who I am.

So my belief is that if anyone here on this board is bitter, angry, depressive... it is who this person is and how he feels at that particular moment and we have to respect everyone's choices and feelings.
If we had the chance to feel otherwise, would you stay in this $h!te of MLC?

I hope I made myself clear, because English is not my mother tongue.

Love.
Poussin

[limitless]

Hello

I'm a long term stander, I don't read all the threads so I don't understand what is going on, but I would like to comment.

Standing is a personal choice and implies that I'm not entitled to blame anyone for choosing to stand. Even when it turns out that standing was not the right option. So it is my responsability.
And there is no one who can make me feel different.

I come to this site to find support, because standing is hard, but I think it is also hard not to stand.

We all suffer from pain, grieve, anger, guilt, love ... you name it, we've all encountered all these feelings in some point.
I still experience all these feelings every day because I'm still in love with this man, I want to nurrish my memories, I want to be angry, ... it makes me who I am.

So my belief is that if anyone here on this board is bitter, angry, depressive... it is who this person is and how he feels at that particular moment and we have to respect everyone's choices and feelings.
If we had the chance to feel otherwise, would you stay in this $h!te of MLC?

I hope I made myself clear, because English is not my mother tongue.

Love.
Poussin

Poussin,

You made yourself very clear.   

Great post.  I agree.

Standing is a choice.  Not Standing is a choice.  Being in the middle somewhere is also a choice.

I just want to be aware that the choices I make are my responsibility.  With that comes empowerment....

If you are strong in your choices and convictions - it doesn't matter what anyone else posts....or chooses to do with his/her own life situation.


Great post, Poussin!

L

[Trustandlove]

This thought came to me in a moment of reflection -- it's interesting that those who choose to stand can feel the need to defend their choice on a forum that's meant for standers.... 

I agree with poussin -- standing isn't easy, this is where we come for support.  And not standing isn't easy either. 

[osb]

I'm a stander who's now reconciling; my H was a clinger whose MLC largely took the form of episodic rages and disappearances to climb mountains (and have EA's, and try to accidentally off himself), then returns to lurk moodily in the spare room. So I don't have the experience that so many do here, of a vanisher or of divorce sought or unsought.

But I can say unconditionally that the most powerful thing I've done in my life is to stand. I'm a risk taker, I try new things, before and after BD I learned to rock climb and skydive and mountain bike and dance aerial suspended 20 feet in the air... but the moment I most felt like I was flying without a parachute was when I learned to negotiate my peace with my raging H. To work on my agape, without expectation of any return. Once I figured it out (and it wasn't easy! thanks and hugs to the mods on this board who helped me, without ever making me feel stupid for failing), it was like I couldn't ever be hurt again, no matter what crazy H did. Zen master trick - and actually, isn't there a martial art in which you move only in defense? Aikido, I think? You land no blows, but use your opponent's weight and momentum against them, so any move they make will see them lying on the ground seeing stars.

Standing (and NC, to the extent that one can with a clinger) provided a shield for my emotions, and space for my wee fledgling self to grow unbruised and unbittered. Even if I'd in the end decided not to take back my H, think I might still identify as a Stander, because that's what gave me back my power. I wouldn't call it weakness. I wouldn't call it being a doormat. Standing is both a tactic, and a life skill. You may not need/use the tactic forever, but you do grow with the life skill. At least that's my own experience.