There are some stories on here that I do not believe are MLC. The giveaway that it is MLC is the running behavior and the utter confusion and indecision we experience in depression. One minute we are considering coming back to the marriage, the next day we made up our minds we are better off with OW/OM. The next day we are thinking again and haven't made up our mind. I cycled throughout my depression. I would make love to my H and had made up my mind that I was going to recommit to my marriage. Next few hours OM text me and want to spend some time with me, take me out and boom I had decided that quickly and easily nope I am done with H.
denje, I agree with you that some here are not dealing with MLC. But this only tends to be true for the begining of the crisis. When a MLCer is settled deep in the tunnel, they stop doing it (unlesss that are a super clue clinger and their LBS is up to allow them their antics). You also need to think that there are several types of MLCers, clingers, on-off, boomerang and vanishers. Some of these types do not do that, or do not spend the whole of their crisis doing. And real vanishers just vanish, there is zero contact. The other thing is that you had a very short and mild crisis. That is not case with several of our MLCers. Their crisis last two or three or more times yours and are much deeper, darker and nastier.
Long term MLCers have a point, that can last for many years, where there are firmly convinced OW/OM is the real deal and they may desingage from their spouse and not contact the spouse for a very long period of time.
So as an MLC'er we think like this " My H loves me and he always will. If I want him I can always go back to him. However, OM is so nice to me, treats me very nice, and I enjoy spending time with him. I have to see where this goes as he might be the one for me, but I might blow it and he might end it so I have to take this chance. I have to end things with H so I can give 100% to OM, if it doesn't work out I can always go back to H, but I am not confident or certain that OM will be there waiting for me."
No I do not think you should implement no contact. I am not an advocate for it, and I think it hinders reconnection. He is reaching out to you because he is cycling, he has not made up his mind, and he still deep down knows he still cares for you deeply.
I think this is also true early on the relationship with OW/OM. Because a point comes when OW/OM no longer treats the MLCer nice. In fact, they are bossing the MLCer around, having huge nasty fights with the MLCer, nothing goes well in their relationship. Unlike what LBS often think, a relationship with OW/OM can last for many years, with several break ups in the middle (even if the LBS is not taking back the MLCer or around to hear them). MLCers put up with real bad, long relationships with their alienator.
And some MLCers are aware their LBS has moved on, is not going to take them back. And others don't have a clue what their LBS is going to do or not to do. Long term MLC is a different thing. Many years go by, contact is often lost. LBS keeps leading its life and the MLCer becomes forgot, no longer has a relevant place in the LBS mind/daily life.
No I do not think you should implement no contact. I am not an advocate for it, and I think it hinders reconnection. He is reaching out to you because he is cycling, he has not made up his mind, and he still deep down knows he still cares for you deeply.
I agree, lack of contact may make reconnection more difficult. But try more than three of four years with a crazy MLCer who lives with OW/OM. Not going to work, especially if MLCer and LBS have no children. Of course some LBS always keep in contact with their MLCer. But if we keep in contact with our MLCer, isn't it a bit like saying, "hey, we are still here for you"? Some how both things sound a bit contradictory to me. At least from a certain point on.
I know you are mostly talking to newbies and early timers and that you are speaking from a personal experience of a short crisis. For a long timer, some of the things you write don't apply so much, or we have different views of those things because our long experience with our MLCers shows us differently. The one I don't believe is that while in crisis a MLCer still cares for us deeply. A depressed deed in crisis MLCer cares for no one, not even themselves.
I always heard the OP is like a drug that gives them a high.
But like all drugs, at a point, there will be no more high. Or to obtain the same high, higher and higher dosages are necessary. I very much doubt that years down the road the OW/OM provide any high. Let alone when the MLCer is not oscillating between OW/OM and LBS.
What most likely happen is that, since they have destroyed everything, like RCR writes, they think they may as well stick to OW/OM.
And we have seen several of our MLCer either jumping from OW/OM to OW/OM or finding more and more running and escaping behaviours to try to get the high because OW/OM are no longer provide the fix.
Regardless of whether this is an MLC affair or EXIT affair, the basic principals and concepts are the same. Most affairs start off with basic conversation. Someone acknowledging something small such as they love the shirt, dress, shoes, glasses (insert whatever you choose) That makes anyone feel good about themselves to be noticed by someone who appears to have no motivation to say that so it must be true!
Indeed. The difference is that the exit affair is just that. It is not a start to a new marital like relationship with OW/OM. MLCer affairs are different in that often the MLCer will establish a new, years long life with their affair partner.
They start talking casually, finding out things about each other, they laugh, they make jokes, they talk about simple things that married couples who have been together for years have simply forgotten to do as it just doesn't seem so important anymore when you have bills, kids, cleaning, cooking and other responsibilities.
Not all couples forget to compliment their spouse on a daily basis or to talk about simple small things even after many years or marriage. And yet, they still have affairs. And in the case of MLCers, they are after a new marital like relationship, not just some fun. So, they are in fact after a responsability with someone new. They go live with their affair partner, they buy or rent a new house with this person, they have bills to pay. Some MLCers even look after the alienator children or relatives. That makes it different from a regular or exit affair.
While this is the reality of your life, this OP is slowly filling a void that has been neglected for quite sometime. You didn't realize you were neglecting your H/W because you did everything you thought a loving spouse should and your spouse gave you no indication that things were off. It happens!!!
Uhhh... lets assume that the alienator is filling some void of a very depressed person. The void has most likely nothing to do with the LBS and everything to do with the depression. And if a spouse does not mention that there is a void, than the spouse who did not mention the void is the one at fault. This is one thing I noticed you do a lot, denje, you somehow think the LBS is to blame or is at fault or somehow was failling the MLCer at some level, rather than see that all responsability is upon the MLCer.
The depressed MLCer that failed to get help and instead thought it was a good idea to get themselves into the mess MLC is. You still see some things too much like a MLCer/former MLC who hasn't totally got how it is to be a LBS (of someone who did not had a MLC). Things may be different to you since you had a MLC, for those who did not, things are seen very differently.
Plus, the MLCer has a spouse. A spouse the MLCer may had been failling to in many ways, yet the spouse is not having a MLC. And if a person has a MLC and does what MLCers do, they do completly fail their spouse, don't they?
In fact I encourage you if he does reach out for legitimate friendship, and help that you be the lighthouse for him in his darkness.
Why? Even in the articles RCR mentions that it is not possible to be friends with a MLCe that is leading a life with OW/OM. That would be allowing the MLCer to cake eat all the way and having the LBS as their safe heaven every time things are bad for the MLCer.
There is no legitimate friendship with someone that is married to us/has divorced us and is living with someone else. Let alone when they are not paying alimony and blowing all the money with their OW/OM. Actions have consequences, including for the MLCer.
I hope you don't mind what I wrote. But I have been following your threads. There are many interesting things in them, but, for me, you have a very naive, bland vision of MLC and how most MLCers are, as well as how long their crisis last and the many totally crazy things they do. It reads like how to deal with MLC lite, or mild MLCers. Not so much with the reality many of us have/had. And I would not like newbies to think things are so easy, light and can be solved so fast as it sometimes transpires from your posts.
There is certainly very good, useful and hopeful information on your threads, but not everything is MLC is so black and white or so easy.
Navigating through the fog-Personal Experiences Part 2
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